Y'all beating a dead horse to hell LoL
Y'all beating a dead horse to hell LoL
Not exactly on topic, but there have been some pretty wicked high revving small blocks. 283 or smaller with long rod, short stroke for example, but you don't see them as often as most are more truck motors.
Will said:Trackmouse said:Whereas, I have absolutely no respect for someone with an “easy button” LS swap. Yawn, it’s been done a trillion times.
This strikes me as a pretty uncool attitude.And I say this as someone with a 4.6 DOHC-swapped 57 Thunderbird.
Let me tell you and the rest of the haters what’s up. As a kid, I was inspired by the cool cars at the car shows, and in the pits at the local drag strip. When I grew up and began learning more about engines and racing, I began to see a trend, and, pretty quickly I’ll say, my peaked interest lost interest like a flaccid old man.
Why? Because EVERY SINGLE HOT ROD had a small block Chevy v8 with a 4 barrel carb. It gets soooooooooooooooooooo boring seeing the same crap, it got so bad that I haven’t been to a “hot rod” car show since. And guess what? I got into import cars with unique engine swaps. One of the coolest swaps I’ve seen in a long time was an old T-bucket with an s2000 swap. What did people do before the LS engine? Originality is KING in my eyes. That’s my opinion. So, I don’t give a #### what anyone thinks, I have an “uncool attitude” toward “uncool originality”.
Maybe the aftermarket has something to do w/ popularity of capable engines and why they were adopted by hot rodders and engine swappers. 
Ain't nothin' new.
Another issue with the Coyote as a swap that I mentioned earlier but seemed to get overlooked: They Coyote has no provisions for power steering pump mounting. All the applications it comes in have electric power steering. So if you want power steering in whatever you have, you have to pony up for an expensive aftermarket FEAD to mount one.
In reply to NickD :
I don't know what a FEAD is, but you can use an electric pump (Minis are swappable, not sure how swappable Mazdas are) or an electric column (find a Saturn VUE, bring tools).
Knurled. said:In reply to NickD :
I don't know what a FEAD is, but you can use an electric pump (Minis are swappable, not sure how swappable Mazdas are) or an electric column (find a Saturn VUE, bring tools).
FEAD = Front End Accessory Drive. Fabbing a bracket for a reasonable power steering pump and running a longer serp belt doesn't seem like a huge deal to me if you're already planning a swap.
Trackmouse said:Will said:Trackmouse said:Whereas, I have absolutely no respect for someone with an “easy button” LS swap. Yawn, it’s been done a trillion times.
This strikes me as a pretty uncool attitude.And I say this as someone with a 4.6 DOHC-swapped 57 Thunderbird.
Let me tell you and the rest of the haters what’s up. As a kid, I was inspired by the cool cars at the car shows, and in the pits at the local drag strip. When I grew up and began learning more about engines and racing, I began to see a trend, and, pretty quickly I’ll say, my peaked interest lost interest like a flaccid old man.
Why? Because EVERY SINGLE HOT ROD had a small block Chevy v8 with a 4 barrel carb. It gets soooooooooooooooooooo boring seeing the same crap, it got so bad that I haven’t been to a “hot rod” car show since. And guess what? I got into import cars with unique engine swaps. One of the coolest swaps I’ve seen in a long time was an old T-bucket with an s2000 swap. What did people do before the LS engine? Originality is KING in my eyes. That’s my opinion. So, I don’t give a #### what anyone thinks, I have an “uncool attitude” toward “uncool originality”.
You want to show off, the "haters" as you call them want a car to drive.
418NV said:Then there is the sound. A Coyote sounds glorious.
Interesting sounds emit from the LS when exhausted through Coyote mufflers....
Trackmouse said:Will said:Trackmouse said:Whereas, I have absolutely no respect for someone with an “easy button” LS swap. Yawn, it’s been done a trillion times.
This strikes me as a pretty uncool attitude.And I say this as someone with a 4.6 DOHC-swapped 57 Thunderbird.
Let me tell you and the rest of the haters what’s up. As a kid, I was inspired by the cool cars at the car shows, and in the pits at the local drag strip. When I grew up and began learning more about engines and racing, I began to see a trend, and, pretty quickly I’ll say, my peaked interest lost interest like a flaccid old man.
Why? Because EVERY SINGLE HOT ROD had a small block Chevy v8 with a 4 barrel carb. It gets soooooooooooooooooooo boring seeing the same crap, it got so bad that I haven’t been to a “hot rod” car show since. And guess what? I got into import cars with unique engine swaps. One of the coolest swaps I’ve seen in a long time was an old T-bucket with an s2000 swap. What did people do before the LS engine? Originality is KING in my eyes. That’s my opinion. So, I don’t give a #### what anyone thinks, I have an “uncool attitude” toward “uncool originality”.
All of which is understandable. You want to try something different, that's great. Variety is the spice of life, and all that. However, there's no reason to E36 M3 on people who don't feel the same as you do.
There are very few, truely original ideas left in hotrodding. Trust me. Do what makes you happy. I wouldn't build a car to impress people I don't know.
Tom_Spangler said:All of which is understandable. You want to try something different, that's great. Variety is the spice of life, and all that. However, there's no reason to E36 M3 on people who don't feel the same as you do.
This. Why all the hate? Seriously. The attitude that someone built a car they want is beneath you because it's not "original" is totally dickish.
Bobcougarzillameister said:Tom_Spangler said:All of which is understandable. You want to try something different, that's great. Variety is the spice of life, and all that. However, there's no reason to E36 M3 on people who don't feel the same as you do.
This. Why all the hate? Seriously. The attitude that someone built a car they want is beneath you because it's not "original" is totally dickish.
Yeah. Sometimes I look at LS-swapped stuff and go "Hmm, not what I would have done" but I never go "I don't respect this person at all." Just curious, do you not respect Keith Tanner because he builds LS Miatas?
There's a lesson in saying you build a particular swap "to get respect", and then immediately throw away any chance of being respected by being an ass.
I've said for a while that the ideal engine swap for a lot of internet forums is one that's only been done once before. Any more, and it's played out. But you want someone else to figure out the hard stuff for you. I once had a customer get quite frustrated that I didn't have a kit for some oddball swap he'd dreamed up, and he wanted to do it because it had never been done before. He just couldn't make the connection between "never been done before" and "no kit available".
When I put the LS in my MGB GT, it was the first time it had been tried IIRC. There are one or two others running around now. But that was not a factor at all. I was originally going to do a 302 until I saw an LS out of the car and fell in love with the packaging. I picked the engine because it met my criteria, and I couldn't care less what anyone else thought. I'd do the same now because the result works well.
The Coyote is a great engine, but it's just not feasible for a lot of applications. It won't fit places the old SBF used to fit, which ironically means it's probably decreased the percentage of Ford swaps over time despite being several generations newer and better.
Appleseed said:There are very few, truely original ideas left in hotrodding. Trust me. Do what makes you happy. I wouldn't build a car to impress people I don't know.
Anything that we think is original or a new idea is 99.9 percent likely that someone else has already thought of or tried.
Don’t get me wrong here folks, I guess I should reword what I said. I don’t have “absolutely” no respect. I have less.
Im sorry, but when I see your car hauling ass around the course and you come in from your session, I’ll head your way and about as soon as I see or hear about the LS swap my mind is moving on to other things. It’s boring. It bores me. I can’t look at another one.
Its like getting beat by a v8 when drag racing your 4cyl, it happens, and then everyone moves on because..... yaaaaaawwwwwwnnnnnn. But the inverse makes for quite a talkative discussion.
I still think it's ridiculous that your measure for how interesting a racecar is isn't it's speed around the course. "Boring" does not apply to the faster of two cars when the point is to go faster. Maybe if you're talking about a concours event that mindset makes sense.
yupididit said:Also, every thread that is about swapping an engine that isn't LS based turns into a "yeah but the LS....". Maybe just maybe we should stay on topic and think outside the LS box sometimes. It's okay to swap in other engines that are bigger less powerful etc. We all know the benefits of the LS. It's been beat over our heads for the past 15 years. I love the LS as much as the next guy but we don't need it shoved down our throat everytime someone dares to be different.
The Internet is just a contrary place. But this one topic where it crosses over into reality, which is hilarious. I put a worked-up Ford 302 in an E36 chassis. On the underside of the hood, on the leading edge, I took a Sharpie and wrote "Why didn't you do the LS?" The vast majority of people who look in the engine compartment get around to saying it. I just point at the writing, and the guy usually laughs.
People who have never swapped a motor, much less owned a GM product, will say it. Just like people who don't know the difference between MIG and brazing will give me crap about the welds on my custom exhaust and express concern whether I "got adequate penetration" welding 16 gauge steel tubing.
It's a powerful motor in a small package so I can see why it's so popular. Personally if I wanted to go that way I would just buy the C5 and start enjoying the motor at the track immediately.
For my E36 project, I needed something cheaper and lighter, so I was willing to give up the extra 12% horsepower bump. Usually when I say this on the internet, somebody will tell me my motor is actually heavier than the LS, more expensive, and down more like 30% on horsepower.
Anybody who does a motor swap is the kind of person I would like to talk to, no matter what kind of motor they used.
dculberson said:I still think it's ridiculous that your measure for how interesting a racecar is isn't it's speed around the course. "Boring" does not apply to the faster of two cars when the point is to go faster. Maybe if you're talking about a concours event that mindset makes sense.
+1
418NV said:Ive found LS motors in my area getting stupid money for a 6.0
Not worth it IMHO
I've seen that same thing locally. Just google GM 6.0 crate motor and laugh at the crazies that think their ragged on 150K+ mile motor is worth 3-4k.
In reply to Keith Tanner :
Years ago when I had my 86 IROC, I looked at dropping in a LT5 in place of the 305, as a local 'Vette recyler had a pull out that was complete, and was willing to let me have it for $1500 as it had been sitting in his warehouse for a few years at that point. (mid 90's and C5's were sill a few years out) When we got to talking about what I wanted to do with it, he told me to go back and measure it, then go measure my car to make sure it would fit. As I didn't have the tools/skillset to fab a whole lot I was hoping for a bolt in, run some lines, sort the wiring harness, get a shop to hook up the exhaust, SBC to SBC swap, with some added cool factor. I'm glad he was honest about it.
Mr. Lee said:In reply to Keith Tanner :
Years ago when I had my 86 IROC, I looked at dropping in a LT5 in place of the 305, as a local 'Vette recyler had a pull out that was complete, and was willing to let me have it for $1500 as it had been sitting in his warehouse for a few years at that point. (mid 90's and C5's were sill a few years out) When we got to talking about what I wanted to do with it, he told me to go back and measure it, then go measure my car to make sure it would fit. As I didn't have the tools/skillset to fab a whole lot I was hoping for a bolt in, run some lines, sort the wiring harness, get a shop to hook up the exhaust, SBC to SBC swap, with some added cool factor. I'm glad he was honest about it.
That would have been a sweet build though. 3rd-gen ZL-1 Camaro phantom? Cool
NickD said:Mr. Lee said:In reply to Keith Tanner :
Years ago when I had my 86 IROC, I looked at dropping in a LT5 in place of the 305, as a local 'Vette recyler had a pull out that was complete, and was willing to let me have it for $1500 as it had been sitting in his warehouse for a few years at that point. (mid 90's and C5's were sill a few years out) When we got to talking about what I wanted to do with it, he told me to go back and measure it, then go measure my car to make sure it would fit. As I didn't have the tools/skillset to fab a whole lot I was hoping for a bolt in, run some lines, sort the wiring harness, get a shop to hook up the exhaust, SBC to SBC swap, with some added cool factor. I'm glad he was honest about it.
That would have been a sweet build though. 3rd-gen ZL-1 Camaro phantom? Cool
http://www.superchevy.com/features/0809gmhtp-1988-lt5-chevy-camaro/ shows it can be done if you spend enough time and money at it
MotorsportsGordon said:NickD said:Mr. Lee said:In reply to Keith Tanner :
Years ago when I had my 86 IROC, I looked at dropping in a LT5 in place of the 305, as a local 'Vette recyler had a pull out that was complete, and was willing to let me have it for $1500 as it had been sitting in his warehouse for a few years at that point. (mid 90's and C5's were sill a few years out) When we got to talking about what I wanted to do with it, he told me to go back and measure it, then go measure my car to make sure it would fit. As I didn't have the tools/skillset to fab a whole lot I was hoping for a bolt in, run some lines, sort the wiring harness, get a shop to hook up the exhaust, SBC to SBC swap, with some added cool factor. I'm glad he was honest about it.
That would have been a sweet build though. 3rd-gen ZL-1 Camaro phantom? Cool
http://www.superchevy.com/features/0809gmhtp-1988-lt5-chevy-camaro/ shows it can be done if you spend enough time and money at it
Bringing it back around to that whole "there are no new ideas" point.
NickD said:MotorsportsGordon said:NickD said:Mr. Lee said:In reply to Keith Tanner :
Years ago when I had my 86 IROC, I looked at dropping in a LT5 in place of the 305, as a local 'Vette recyler had a pull out that was complete, and was willing to let me have it for $1500 as it had been sitting in his warehouse for a few years at that point. (mid 90's and C5's were sill a few years out) When we got to talking about what I wanted to do with it, he told me to go back and measure it, then go measure my car to make sure it would fit. As I didn't have the tools/skillset to fab a whole lot I was hoping for a bolt in, run some lines, sort the wiring harness, get a shop to hook up the exhaust, SBC to SBC swap, with some added cool factor. I'm glad he was honest about it.
That would have been a sweet build though. 3rd-gen ZL-1 Camaro phantom? Cool
http://www.superchevy.com/features/0809gmhtp-1988-lt5-chevy-camaro/ shows it can be done if you spend enough time and money at it
Bringing it back around to that whole "there are no new ideas" point.
http://www.superchevy.com/features/1601-1992-falconer-all-aluminum-v-12-experimental-zr-corvette/
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