frenchyd said:
dean1484 said:
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:
If you don't want to use multiple smaller turbos, big diesel stuff is your best bet. Look for powerstroke Fords, the turbo is up high at the back of the engine- they seem to get snatched quickly by the truck guys, but usually diesel vans and ambulances still have them attached and they can be accessed through the doghouse from inside the vehicle.
Lots of Saabs are turbocharged and they tend to hang it out in front of the engine where it's easy to get to. VW 1.8t turbos are tiny so I'd avoid those. What kind of stuff is usually in your local yard?
Actually if you total displacement is 3.5-4 l two of these would in theory be enough for that. 1.8x2 =3.6.
I would be looking for the turbos off a Mazda 3. Those are a single on a 2.3l. So two of those would work well. Be carful with the ones you get they also put turbos on the Mazda 2.3 that is in there small suv those are different. They have a smaller hot side so they Spool quicker to get the suv moving off the line better but will suffer at the top end.
It’s either 5.3 or 6 liters stock figure 3 liters per side.
Ohh that changes things. I wonder if you could fit four of those little turbos of the 1.8 in there. Lol.
Check the Posts for the Chupacabra vette. 4 T's
Not for me but Two may work. also in the RPM range you are looking at a Single would work,as the Multi Turbo engines are to get the Boost at Lower RPM( I know you know this).
frenchyd said:
yupididit said:
Air flow in that compartment is terrible. Under race conditions the stock valve springs softened towards the end of the race greatly increasing the chance of swallowing a valve.
They ultimately solved it with the valve springs used in Formula 1 Cosworth
Are you talking about this particular car in the photo or just in general?
In reply to yupididit : To my knowledge no Jag V 12 was ever raced Turbo charged.
The heat issue is well known but by putting the turbo’s out of the engine compartment like I did with my first one. they shouldn’t add greatly to the heat problem.
I built one to go chump car racing but found out how many penalty laps they would assign me and gave up on the idea and sold it.
Things seem different now but given the poor standard of driving reported with those groups I don’t want to risk it.
All I want to do is have a little fun racing a Jaguar again. Hopefully a small low key event or two a year
I’m looking to build something nice, reliable, and maybe as quick as my old Black Jack Spl
In reply to GTXVette : your posts were one of the reason I’m considering doing this.
When I built my first one I used a pair of turbo’s out of Saab’s. The earliest injectors were just big enough to provide the required amount of gasoline and I planned on using a blend of race gas and 92 octane non oxygenated fuel to survive.
But even back then 5 gallons of race fuel cost $100.00 Making racing insanely expensive. A weekends worth of race gas could approach $800 I was able to buy surplus race gas a year old for a little break from a shop that sold it to motorcycle racers. But still not cheap enough to race on an income based on Social security.
Once I began using E85 the light bulb lite up and I started looking for big injectors only to give up when I saw the prices charged.
Your article about nipping the ends off and dramatically increasing flow renewed my interest.
Thank you!
Ct26's off the 86-92 Supra turbo are the biggest stock turbo for a gasoline engine iirc, good for ~400hp each. 14b's from turbo eclipses are good for ~300. Both of those are getting pretty thin on the ground though. Personally I'd do a bigger Chinese single.
the Nipple Nipping is a Nelson Thing.
I am as new or newer than you to doing this stuff.
Like I have Gotten this Fiero W/ turbo running but not right,and I read well, but still, ' What next'
frenchyd said:
In reply to yupididit : To my knowledge no Jag V 12 was ever raced Turbo charged.
The heat issue is well known but by putting the turbo’s out of the engine compartment like I did with my first one. they shouldn’t add greatly to the heat problem.
I built one to go chump car racing but found out how many penalty laps they would assign me and gave up on the idea and sold it.
Things seem different now but given the poor standard of driving reported with those groups I don’t want to risk it.
All I want to do is have a little fun racing a Jaguar again. Hopefully a small low key event or two a year
I’m looking to build something nice, reliable, and maybe as quick as my old Black Jack Spl
This particular car was raced in the Marque Sports car race series. From what I read there were no heat issues.
simplecat said:
Ct26's off the 86-92 Supra turbo are the biggest stock turbo for a gasoline engine iirc, good for ~400hp each. 14b's from turbo eclipses are good for ~300. Both of those are getting pretty thin on the ground though. Personally I'd do a bigger Chinese single.
While a bigger single would be cheaper it’s also very hard to fit! Imagine fitting a big single into a late model Corvette engine compartment.
That would be easier to do than a Jaguar XJS engine compartment. Everybody else fitting turbos onto a V12 engine uses two of them. Ferrari, Aston Martin, BMW etc.
I built a XJS twin turbo using two T2’s sized turbo’s from Saab’s . I put them behind and above the front tires out of the engine bay. But they are too small for racing. ( the reason I want to do this)
simplecat said:
Ct26's off the 86-92 Supra turbo are the biggest stock turbo for a gasoline engine iirc, good for ~400hp each. 14b's from turbo eclipses are good for ~300. Both of those are getting pretty thin on the ground though. Personally I'd do a bigger Chinese single.
The 14b's exhaust housing would be very restrictive on such an engine. I'd run a bigger single like a This one.
frenchyd said:
simplecat said:
Ct26's off the 86-92 Supra turbo are the biggest stock turbo for a gasoline engine iirc, good for ~400hp each. 14b's from turbo eclipses are good for ~300. Both of those are getting pretty thin on the ground though. Personally I'd do a bigger Chinese single.
While a bigger single would be cheaper it’s also very hard to fit! Imagine fitting a big single into a late model Corvette engine compartment.
That would be easier to do than a Jaguar XJS engine compartment. Everybody else fitting turbos onto a V12 engine uses two of them. Ferrari, Aston Martin, BMW etc.
Ive seen the v12 xjs engine space or lack there of. Cut up some of the front header panel and place the turbo behind where the passenger headlight is supposed to be. All you'd have to do is run a cross over pipe from the other exhaust manifold down under the accessories or near the bellhousing. I've seen it done on plenty cramp-engine- compartment turbo cars.
A single turbo = less intercooler piping, one blow off valve, one wastegate (if running external), less oil and or coolant lines for the turbo. And it's more simple because you only have to keep one turbo happy.
Use your imagination FrenchyD.
OK which side of the V 12 should I put a big single turbo on? No room in front no room behind no room underneath, while there would be room on top it will block the drivers view.
In short a big single won’t fit!
If I wanted a pair of new Chinese made turbos I’d buy the T45 series but that would burn up every last dollar I’ve budgeted for performance increase. A couple of used ones the right size would leave me hundreds of dollars to also upgrade cams and springs.
In reply to frenchyd :
But, little twins are too small for racing. And the good small turbo options are out of your budget.
Hopefully someone with a bigger budget will one day throw a pair of disco potatoes or gt3082r's on a jag v12!
yupididit said:
frenchyd said:
simplecat said:
Ct26's off the 86-92 Supra turbo are the biggest stock turbo for a gasoline engine iirc, good for ~400hp each. 14b's from turbo eclipses are good for ~300. Both of those are getting pretty thin on the ground though. Personally I'd do a bigger Chinese single.
While a bigger single would be cheaper it’s also very hard to fit! Imagine fitting a big single into a late model Corvette engine compartment.
That would be easier to do than a Jaguar XJS engine compartment. Everybody else fitting turbos onto a V12 engine uses two of them. Ferrari, Aston Martin, BMW etc.
Ive seen the v12 xjs engine space or lack there of. Cut up some of the front header panel and place the turbo behind where the passenger headlight is supposed to be. All you'd have to do is run a cross over pipe from the other exhaust manifold down under the accessories or near the bellhousing. I've seen it done on plenty cramp-engine- compartment turbo cars.
A single turbo = less intercooler piping, one blow off valve, one wastegate (if running external), less oil and or coolant lines for the turbo. And it's more simple because you only have to keep one turbo happy.
Use your imagination FrenchyD.
The oil lines are easy because there are two cams up on top of the engine one on each side. Nice and neat from there to the turbo’s in each front fender. Same with the oil return lines. Intercoolers are nice but a complication I can deal with by using E85 instead of the intercoolers.
Cold air pick up in front of the radiator. Tube picks up in front of radiator and tucks under the top edge of the fender.
The exhaust curves from the manifold up to the turbo.
Along side of the engine is a nice place for air to flow allowing more air to flow through the engine compartment.
I suppose I could put one about where the glove box would be. But that would mean a lot of exhaust tubing, intake tubing, and pressure side tubing. Crossing over behind and above engine and transmission. Not to mention the difficulty of heating up the drivers compartment.
yupididit said:
In reply to frenchyd :
But, little twins are too small for racing. And the good small turbo options are out of your budget.
Hopefully someone with a bigger budget will one day throw a pair of disco potatoes or gt3082r's on a jag v12!
The Jag isn’t new. The motor is fine with a little freshening . Why isn’t there a decent selection of medium sized used turbos available? Am I missing something?
I know I can put a pair of medium sized superchargers off some domestic V6’s and make plenty of boost. Why not turbo’s.
frenchyd said:
yupididit said:
In reply to frenchyd :
But, little twins are too small for racing. And the good small turbo options are out of your budget.
Hopefully someone with a bigger budget will one day throw a pair of disco potatoes or gt3082r's on a jag v12!
The Jag isn’t new. The motor is fine with a little freshening . Why isn’t there a decent selection of medium sized used turbos available? Am I missing something?
I know I can put a pair of medium sized superchargers off some domestic V6’s and make plenty of boost. Why not turbo’s.
Medium size turbos seem to either be just out your budget or slightly too big to run as twins? It also seems like there isn't many oem medium turbo applications. I believe the Japanese and German turbo diesels trucks used medium size turbos but those tend to be rare in the US.
yupididit said:
frenchyd said:
In reply to yupididit : To my knowledge no Jag V 12 was ever raced Turbo charged.
The heat issue is well known but by putting the turbo’s out of the engine compartment like I did with my first one. they shouldn’t add greatly to the heat problem.
I built one to go chump car racing but found out how many penalty laps they would assign me and gave up on the idea and sold it.
Things seem different now but given the poor standard of driving reported with those groups I don’t want to risk it.
All I want to do is have a little fun racing a Jaguar again. Hopefully a small low key event or two a year
I’m looking to build something nice, reliable, and maybe as quick as my old Black Jack Spl
This particular car was raced in the Marque Sports car race series. From what I read there were no heart issues.
I haven’t seen where he put his turbo’s but I’ll bet it isn’t in the engine compartment.
609 horsepower would sure be nice but I’ll bet dollars to donuts it’s not with junkyard parts. And my tiny budget.
frenchyd said:
yupididit said:
frenchyd said:
In reply to yupididit : To my knowledge no Jag V 12 was ever raced Turbo charged.
The heat issue is well known but by putting the turbo’s out of the engine compartment like I did with my first one. they shouldn’t add greatly to the heat problem.
I built one to go chump car racing but found out how many penalty laps they would assign me and gave up on the idea and sold it.
Things seem different now but given the poor standard of driving reported with those groups I don’t want to risk it.
All I want to do is have a little fun racing a Jaguar again. Hopefully a small low key event or two a year
I’m looking to build something nice, reliable, and maybe as quick as my old Black Jack Spl
This particular car was raced in the Marque Sports car race series. From what I read there were no heart issues.
I haven’t seen where he put his turbo’s but I’ll bet it isn’t in the engine compartment.
609 horsepower would sure be nice but I’ll bet dollars to donuts it’s not with junkyard parts. And my tiny budget.
Same as pic in previous page. The original builder used a Motec Engine management system. He raced It then sold It to a guy who added an Air2water Intercooler and upgraded the engine management. He ran the car in Bathurst.
yupididit said:
frenchyd said:
yupididit said:
In reply to frenchyd :
But, little twins are too small for racing. And the good small turbo options are out of your budget.
Hopefully someone with a bigger budget will one day throw a pair of disco potatoes or gt3082r's on a jag v12!
The Jag isn’t new. The motor is fine with a little freshening . Why isn’t there a decent selection of medium sized used turbos available? Am I missing something?
I know I can put a pair of medium sized superchargers off some domestic V6’s and make plenty of boost. Why not turbo’s.
Medium size turbos seem to either be just out your budget or slightly too big to run as twins? It also seems like there isn't many oem small turbo applications. I believe the Japanese and German turbo diesels trucks used medium size turbos but those tend to be rare in the US.
I tend to agree that there are darn few foreign medium sized diesel trucks sitting around in junkyards waiting to have their turbo’s harvested. That probably would be my solution if there were.
Used small turbo’s exist and are the affordable solution with Saab’s being the easy ones. Maybe I should reconsider a pair of Audi 2.7 turbo ‘s. Just deal with the complications of the VGT by using the Distributor from the HE with its built in retard? In effect trade boost for timing?
frenchyd said:
OK which side of the V 12 should I put a big single turbo on? No room in front no room behind no room underneath, while there would be room on top it will block the drivers view.
In short a big single won’t fit!
If I wanted a pair of new Chinese made turbos I’d buy the T45 series but that would burn up every last dollar I’ve budgeted for performance increase. A couple of used ones the right size would leave me hundreds of dollars to also upgrade cams and springs.
To take a page from modern Corvettes, what about a remote mounted turbo? Basically just need extra piping an an oil scavenge pump compared to a traditional turbo setup. Put it where the muffler lives.
I doubt the 2.7 Audi used vgt turbos. They're normally used in big diesel applications. Earlier someone suggested k03 and k04 turbos. They can be found cheap. As well as dsm t25's from turbo second generation mitsu eclipse/talon. The 14b are also small and cheap and can be found in first generation manual turbo eclipse/talon/laser, they're good for almost 300hp each on e85. I've personally sold 14b turbos for less than $100 bucks.
yupididit said:
frenchyd said:
yupididikt said:
frenchyd said:
In reply to yupididit : To my knowledge no Jag V 12 was ever raced Turbo charged.
The heat issue is well known but by putting the turbo’s out of the engine compartment like I did with my first one. they shouldn’t add greatly to the heat problem.
I built one to go chump car racing but found out how many penalty laps they would assign me and gave up on the idea and sold it.
Things seem different now but given the poor standard of driving reported with those groups I don’t want to risk it.
All I want to do is have a little fun racing a Jaguar again. Hopefully a small low key event or two a year
I’m looking to build something nice, reliable, and maybe as quick as my old Black Jack Spl
This particular car was raced in the Marque Sports car race series. From what I read there were no heart issues.
I haven’t seen where he put his turbo’s but I’ll bet it isn’t in the engine compartment.
609 horsepower would sure be nice but I’ll bet dollars to donuts it’s not with junkyard parts. And my tiny budget.
Same as pic in previous page. The original builder used a Motec Engine management system. He raced It then sold It to a guy who added an Air2water Intercooler and upgraded the engine management. He ran the car in Bathurst.
That’s very impressive. I assume that’s the turbo in the right front corner? Is there a pair of them or just one?
But whoever sorted out the Motec earned his fee. And then he had someone else redo it? Isn’t Motec used in a lot of European race cars?
As far as heat why would he go from air to air and then switch to air to water if heat wasn’t an issue. I understand he switched from 6.9 liters to a 6 liter engine to gain some reliability. Somewhat indicating it wasn’t yet reliable in spite of the changes.
I also have these pics from a quad turbo v12 xjs. These have been on my phone for years, I've forgotten the details.
These aren't tiny turbos that's apparent.
frenchyd said:
yupididit said:
frenchyd said:
yupididikt said:
frenchyd said:
In reply to yupididit : To my knowledge no Jag V 12 was ever raced Turbo charged.
The heat issue is well known but by putting the turbo’s out of the engine compartment like I did with my first one. they shouldn’t add greatly to the heat problem.
I built one to go chump car racing but found out how many penalty laps they would assign me and gave up on the idea and sold it.
Things seem different now but given the poor standard of driving reported with those groups I don’t want to risk it.
All I want to do is have a little fun racing a Jaguar again. Hopefully a small low key event or two a year
I’m looking to build something nice, reliable, and maybe as quick as my old Black Jack Spl
This particular car was raced in the Marque Sports car race series. From what I read there were no heart issues.
I haven’t seen where he put his turbo’s but I’ll bet it isn’t in the engine compartment.
609 horsepower would sure be nice but I’ll bet dollars to donuts it’s not with junkyard parts. And my tiny budget.
Same as pic in previous page. The original builder used a Motec Engine management system. He raced It then sold It to a guy who added an Air2water Intercooler and upgraded the engine management. He ran the car in Bathurst.
That’s very impressive. I assume that’s the turbo in the right front corner? Is there a pair of them or just one?
But whoever sorted out the Motec earned his fee. And then he had someone else redo it? Isn’t Motec used in a lot of European race cars?
As far as heat why would he go from air to air and then switch to air to water if heat wasn’t an issue. I understand he switched from 6.9 liters to a 6 liter engine to gain some reliability. Somewhat indicating it wasn’t yet reliable in spite of the changes.
The second owner switched to a2w and upgraded the ems. I think the 6.9 was NA. Not sure.
