Remember 25 years Ago When I Said Japanese Cars Would Be Collectable

Today I was reminded of a conversation in my fabricator's shop. I was surrounded by a group of muscle car guys and I mentioned that I saw Japanese cars as the next round of collectable cars.

Naturally they looked at me like I had two heads and were totally dismissive. 

I would love to sit down with the same group guys today.

I'd love to claim I was visionary but I'd belonged to a predominantly Australian Datsun forum and the vintage racing scene there featured lots of Japanese cars.

I will also admit I never thought my glorified IT car would become a much loved vintage race car.

You usually want what you couldn’t have during your formative years. For those of us who grew up on Hondas, Datsuns and Mazdas, we knew this was coming. 

In reply to David S. Wallens :

I was also doing some vintage motocross at the time. Japanese bikes were overflowing there.

Should I ever buy lotto tickets and win, I will fill the garage with a CRX, RX-3SP, RX7, 240SX, 510, TE-72 Corolla, Starion and a Toyota 2000GT if the money goes that far.

Due note there will be an early 911 in there but mostly Japanese cars......oh and a Redline Sqaureback.

In 1990 I bought a '66 Datsun roadster for $2500 and 6-7 years later I barely got $2900 for it.  Now they get crazy money - more respect?

David S. Wallens said:

You usually want what you couldn’t have during your formative years. For those of us who grew up on Hondas, Datsuns and Mazdas, we knew this was coming. 

And those of us who lived for Gran Turismo.

I wasn't in the market to buy a car but about ten years ago and on another forum, I asked the collective about a low mileage 2001 Acura Integra Type R that was for sale for 19K and later about a pristine Datsun 240Z for about 14K.

I was run out of the forum for being so "out of touch" for even considering those prices.  
 

It didn't take long for the market to show I was on the right track regarding the value of those cars then and also what was going to happen in the market in the near future.

And that was on a prominent forum devoted to single Japanese automobile, the Miata.

In reply to Coniglio Rampante :

If it's the Miata forum I'm thinking of, it's not surprising. They are completely full of themselves. And E36 M3. Lots of E36 M3.

My brother had a Datsun 510, 510 station wagon, and a 240Z in the early 1980s

I had half a dozen 1200s and a Datsun 2000 Roadster in the early 80's.

Wife had a 240SX

Oh well!

When I started driving in the mid 80s, I had come from high school where everyone had Cutlass, Monte Carlo, a few other sedans, my best friend's 70 Camaro, and one guy even had a C3 Vette.  I had no exposure to imports.

Few years into the Navy, I had my 84 Camaro because I thought that was cool.  A few friends had imports, my now best friend had an 85 CRX, I almost bought an early 80s RX-7 but the manual gearbox and choke scared me.  A few other friends had imports and smaller cars like a Shelby Charger, an EXP.  The longer it went, the more imports I saw.

Then after the 90 Beretta GT I decided I wanted an import.  Found my first manual, a 93 Eagle Talon (ES I think?), close enough.  Damn that thing was fun on corners.  I've never looked back since, I have no idea what I'd buy if it had to be domestic.  Zero.

If only I had gotten brave and bought that RX-7 (probably an 83 or so) in 1987.  Skip the second Camaro, skip the Beretta, probably go right to an MR2 and while it was still fairly new. Don't let the ex-wife talk you out of it.  C’est la vie.

My first car was a 1971 Datsun 510.......I'd love to have an upgraded version of that car today.

30 years ago I suggested to PW that a fun retirement gig might be to take trips south with a trailer and bring back rust free Japanese cars and parts like people were doing with Camaros and G bodies at the time. I don't think it became near as lucrative, though.

Did I miss a memo telling us that Japanese cars were not collectible?  

Back 40 years ago, we got a Datsun 2000 which people were collecting when they were not even 20 years old.  And 15 year old 240Zs were already collectible.  I actually got my first Alfa for less money than what either Datsun were selling for.  

While a 510 was cheap enough to participate in the GRM challenge, I had in my possession an '67 Alfa GT Jr that was also cheap enough to participate in the challenge.  Maybe the paths of each car has changed more in the last 20 years, but both have increased in desirability enough that they are not likely to be a good challenge platform due to cost of rusty buckets of them.

Basically, the only reason that Japanese cars took longer as a whole to be collectible is that they had both less time and fewer iconic cars to start with.  But they have been collectible as long as I have been driving.  Which is considerably longer than 25 years.

Peabody said:

30 years ago I suggested to PW that a fun retirement gig might be to take trips south with a trailer and bring back rust free Japanese cars and parts like people were doing with Camaros and G bodies at the time. I don't think it became near as lucrative, though.

I think the global shipping infrastructure beat you to that one...  The rednecks in Alabama dismantling them have the same access to facebook marketplace and ebay that you do...

I wonder if my forty-grand CRX is still a crazy idea.

Good body, nice paint, Rush or Tillett seats, remanufactured HVAC unit, new speakers and head unit, about a 260 hp K24 with a 5.5 inch twindisc Power Train Technology clutch and a Torsen, all new suspension arms, rebuilt manual rack, 400/400 springs with free lengths chosen to lower the car an inch and a half, Bilstein HDs valved for this application, 17" HRE wheels with Pilot Sport PS4S, the smallest carbon-ceramic brake discs I can find (if nothing comes up, then tiny iron discs and a water mist system for the ducts).  

My first car was a '73 Mazda RX-2.  I haven't checked around lately, but I'm sure based on rarity alone, that one would not be acquired cheaply.  I do have a  '88 RX-7 Turbo II that Hagerty tells me has increased in value.  But I agree with the OP, 25 years ago, very few people could have predicted the collectibility of Japanese cars.  And certainly not the kind of guys that were into cars like the '57 Chevy.

1988RedT2 said:

My first car was a '73 Mazda RX-2.  I haven't checked around lately, but I'm sure based on rarity alone, that one would not be acquired cheaply.  I do have a  '88 RX-7 Turbo II that Hagerty tells me has increased in value.  But I agree with the OP, 25 years ago, very few people could have predicted the collectibility of Japanese cars.  And certainly not the kind of guys that were into cars like the '57 Chevy.

I'm not sure those people are.  The people who grew up with Japanese performance cars are.  Given the life cycle of people, the interest in cars shift.  Kids of people who liked the '57 Chevy are getting Skylines and Z cars.  And people like me who had a CRX as a second ever car.  

Japanese cars in the early days had dubious styling but interesting mechanical design.

The Datsun 2000 with the Solex carbs (150 bhp)  had a rugged OHC engine while the British sports cars they had been styled after were still running pushrods.

The Datsun 240Z was a paradigm shifting car - modern styling that still looks great today (until they started sticking big rubber excrescences on bumpers and such.  After I saw a picture of the homologation special called a Datsun (or more likely Fairlady as they were called in the home market) 240 ZG I immediately wanted one

In reply to WonkoTheSane :

I don't know if I agree with that. The internet has made things easier but the market didn't develop like I thought it would. I don't think the import stuff ever came close to being as popular as the hot rod or enthusiast scene then

And we even get started on 70s and 80s Fords (Cortina's, Capris, And Ford Econoboxs)

I wonder if the Japanese Nostalgic Car forum is still up. I used to be up there pretty often back when I had a Galant VR4, 1g GSX, and a Starion.

In reply to DeadSkunk (Warren) :

I say that all the time - I'm a broken record.  I think the Civic Si might be close.  
 

alfadriver said:

Did I miss a memo telling us that Japanese cars were not collectible?  

Yes,  I graduated high school in 1980 and most car guys I knew were all into muscle cars. 

If someone was into imports it was either German  (VWs, Porsches) or British (Triumph, MG or Austin Healy) very few were into Japanese cars other than the 240Z-280Z crowd.

I can't remember what issue but 7-10 years back CM published a letter from me complimenting the article on Japanese collectible cars...................the next issue was a rebuttal from a reader saying otherwise (I think he was into British cars).

I also remember when SCCA approved some Japanese cars for the Production class and Sportscar magazine had a letter from a guy talking about why Japanese cars shouldn't be allowed because they were subject to "oil-canning". Yeah because British cars of the same era are so much higher quality. This anti Japanese car mindset was prevalent up until about 25 years ago.

Several of the vintage race groups have only embraced them in the last 20 years.

While my 1200 is probably the least collectible of Datsun from the early 70s  these days I  get loads of compliments when I drag it out to shows/events. 

Tom1200 said:

Yes,  I graduated high school in 1980 and most car guys I knew were all into muscle cars....If someone was into imports it was either German  (VWs, Porsches) or British (Triumph, MG or Austin Healy) very few were into Japanese cars other than the 240Z-280Z crowd.

I graduated in 1977. The cool - kid - had a muscle car, and there was only one or two. Back then, most of us didn't even have cars yet, and no one cared what you drove as long as it had wheels. I do remember one guy with an MGTD, especially after helping to push it to school one day after we made a brief "outing."

Back in the 90s I remember hearing from "serious" collectors that Japanese cars would never be collectible because they made too many of them.  Of course, they said the same thing about 60s muscle cars, and look where that went.

Back in the 2010s Hemmings Sports & Exotics did a comparison article with 2 owners of a 240Z and XKE. They said the response to that piece was mostly positive but they did publish one letter from a guy who was indignant about those cars sharing space.