RX8 vs WRX

MrJoshua wrote: I was going to comment, but I don't know if my IQ is high enough.

Ditto that.

Seriously, I can understand how someone between 50-100k household income in the real world (mortgage, food, taxes, regular expenses) can afford a 10k car outright (the only way I will ever own a car) but at this stage I have two kids (young kids with big expenses), one on the way and a wife in grad school (the cost is the big deal, she is earning an income) I cannot. My wife is due for a replacement, and we are going to have to wait until I am 31-33 before we can afford her likely 10K replacement vehicle.

While in college, many of us drove rusted out three bill beaters and came away better for it. That's where the pain is. While I would be making the same decision in your case, I would definitely question how parents could put their kid in such a position (assuming that you're a kid as most have guessed), and would highly recommend as a slightly seasoned adult that you don't purchase a 10K vehicle, and instead put it in some sort of investment for later use.

While on GRM, we all talk about finding cars with as little rust as possible, and how to cheap out on parts and how to make the $20xx challenge car so it can still be a DD. You can't just come here and insist that you've grown accustom to a world class interior and nothing else will do and not get some backlash. Even if most of us have the money for car like that, we probably don't actually do it until it becomes more necessary due to the newness or people carryingness of said vehicle. We would build 5 challenge cars instead.

All of that said, I'd get a GTO if you're hell bent on buying something. If not, but something cheap, let it build your character and let your money do something useful until real life hits. My Ford stock earned my 697% so far. Apple and UA have each earned me double digits this year alone. Real life is expensive and risky, plan for it.

This thread has gotten a little... off-topic (for lack of anything better to call it)

I was gonna suggest bike (look at the one in the avatar), but you said no to that. I can understand. The learning curve is high and dangerous if you don't get used to it. On the up side they are cheap, fast and reliable (although deadly). I bought the one in the picture when I was 22. Earlier that year I T-boned a car on my first bike probably goin 100mph or so. Not fun. So I can see your point in not getting one.

Anyway, I think the WRX is a good choice. I've got a friend who has one that is one of the fastest cars I've ever ridden in.

As far as a new suggestion. How about Hyundai Genesis? Fast, reliable, and pretty cheap. Only gets 21/30 mpg, though.

GTO mentioned above is a great idea. One of the finest things GM has put out in a long time imo you can find the 06's for around 10-12k and they are pretty damn nice inside as well

vincephan wrote: Your sense of humor isn't too funny. Nice try with the sarcasm as well. If I'm interpreting you correctly, you think I'm power hungry, like obnoxious noises, and I'm disregarding the RX8's handling prowess. I am not. Reading comprehension might help you understand this thread a bit better so that you would be better suited to contributing worthwhile information to the thread. I appreciate the RX8's ability to out-handle many cars in its class. I understand that it makes a great road-race/autocross car. HOWEVER, I do not visit the track often enough to take advantage of this. And to address your last comment, you have no idea what you're reading about, do you? I don't beat the RX8 9/10 all the time, nor do I want to. I said that in order to get a "kick" from the RX8, you have to drive it aggressively, which is VERY true. It's meant to be tossed into corners and very high speeds and is meant to stay in the mid-upper range of it's powerband. I'm considering the WRX because it makes a better street car for my needs. No one mentioned anything about a pickup truck and big V8's, nor did anyone mention anything about liking cars that feel like they're about to fall apart when you drive them slow. Thanks for your help though.

OK the beretta was a joke. But I was serious about a pick-up. Hear me out now. Cost of mantince is low, you can get a extened cab with about as much room as your curent back seat, gas milage is about the same, you can get lether seats with heaters and it sounds like what you want is low end grunt.

Well, I avoiding posting this question in model-specific forums, for obvious reasons. I chose grassroots because I assumed I would get better input from people, people who aren't biased and actually know what they're talking about... but I guess there's always at least one bad apple from the tree.

I went out today with the hopes of falling in love with my RX8 again. I did. The streets were pretty clear out today so I had some fun with a little spirited driving. I shifted later, broke later, entered turns a tiny bit faster, and I finally remembered what made me fall in love with the car in the first place. If I could drive the car like that ALL the time, I would definitely keep the car and never look back.

The biggest problem with the RX8 is when you start to demand a bit more punch from it, the MPG drops down dramatically. After a session of spirited driving, the underhood temps start to get pretty high as well (relative in terms of piston vs rotary). Anyone who has an RX8 and tries to use the A/C knows exactly why this becomes a problem, especially in the summer.

I'm going to test drive a WRX again soon. My first stick-shift lesson was in a WRX and it's been a while; I don't remember how it feels and I'm sure it'll be vastly different now that I'm not stalling at every other stoplight.

Now, to go back on Hondas. I love Hondas! However, where I live, driving a modded Honda is going to get you A LOT of unwanted attention. I'm talking about everyone from ricers, cops, to car thieves. An Integra GSR is easily one of the best handling cars out there, especially for a FF vehicle. But where I live, a lot of Hondas are vandalized, stolen, get pulled over for no reason, or get revved at by everyone

Ahh, the Pontiac GTO. You can't say no to that LS engine. I gotta test drive one first to see if I like it, though. Almost forgot about this gem!

junkbuggie wrote: OK the beretta was a joke. But I was serious about a pick-up. Hear me out now. Cost of mantince is low, you can get a extened cab with about as much room as your curent back seat, gas milage is about the same, you can get lether seats with heaters and it sounds like what you want is low end grunt.

The more I re-read these few pages, the more it becomes clear to me. I want a car that hasn't been made yet... at least not at the price point I'm wanting it to be at.

I'm basically looking for an STi or an Evolution. If I could pick up an 06+ WRX, I think it'll be the right car for me.

Things I "Need" (or want, I guess you could argue that I don't really need anything but a base CRX held together by duct tape.

Seating in the rear, Some Low End Grunt, Large Aftermarket Support, Good Gain/Money ratio, Reliable, Can double as a competent daily driver as well as an autocross/track car for the weekends.

Without being financially irresponsible, I think it wouldn't be too of an idea to jump into a 2.5 WRX. They're basically close enough to being an STi without all the icing on the cake but that can always be thrown on later. Easy enough since Subarus are just like Hondas. Almost everything is interchangeable.

I respect your desire for either an 8 or an Rex. As others have said, buy what you will enjoy, but if you ask for opinions expect to get them.

I've driven both, owned a Rex, and could own whichever I want.

There's a lot of wisdom in this thread that you are blowing off. That's your prerogative.

The advice from me (and others) about lower cost and powered alternatives is not an assault on your refined sense of driving experience. They are legitimate suggestions based on what you are saying, both directly and between the lines.

I realize you don't understand, but those "lesser" cars will make you appreciate the "better" ones, and make you a better driver. They will build character. Perhaps what some of us are trying to tell you in the kindest way we are able is that a couple of doses of character may do you good.

The CRX has graced the pages of GRM dozens of times. The Miata has been there hundreds. The WRX and the RX-8 have been there very seldom, perhaps never.

There's a very good reason for this.

I see NASIOC is your home. I spent a lot of time there in the past, because all of my early racing experience was with Subies (including getting a feature article in Subie Sport). Frankly, I don't think very much of them. Lots of hotheads with no patience, minimal talent, and very little varied experiences. But if you enjoy their input, I say enjoy.

A car is like a woman. Until you've learned to coax and care for the gentle ones, you'll never tame the wild ones.

I drive a beater Miata. And I am a better man (and driver) for it.

I think you should buy a Rex. You deserve it. But I also think you will be missing out long term.

SVreX wrote: A car is like a woman. Until you've learned to coax and care for the gentle ones, you'll never tame the wild ones.

^^^ This should find it's way into the magazine!

I was hoping you'd enjoy that one!

SVreX wrote: The CRX has graced the pages of GRM dozens of times. The Miata has been there hundreds. The WRX and the RX-8 have been there very seldom, perhaps never.

Since '05 the mighty Rex has graced the cover 5 times. So I'm sure there's been an article or two.

SVreX wrote: I respect your desire for either an 8 or an Rex. As others have said, buy what you will enjoy, but if you ask for opinions expect to get them. I've driven both, owned a Rex, and could own whichever I want. There's a lot of wisdom in this thread that you are blowing off. That's your prerogative. The advice from me (and others) about lower cost and powered alternatives is not an assault on your refined sense of driving experience. They are legitimate suggestions based on what you are saying, both directly and between the lines. I realize you don't understand, but those "lesser" cars will make you appreciate the "better" ones, and make you a better driver. They will build character. Perhaps what some of us are trying to tell you in the kindest way we are able is that a couple of doses of character may do you good. The CRX has graced the pages of GRM dozens of times. The Miata has been there hundreds. The WRX and the RX-8 have been there very seldom, perhaps never. There's a very good reason for this. I see NASIOC is your home. I spent a lot of time there in the past, because all of my early racing experience was with Subies (including getting a feature article in Subie Sport). Frankly, I don't think very much of them. Lots of hotheads with no patience, minimal talent, and very little varied experiences. But if you enjoy their input, I say enjoy. A car is like a woman. Until you've learned to coax and care for the gentle ones, you'll never tame the wild ones. I drive a beater Miata. And I am a better man (and driver) for it. I think you should buy a Rex. You deserve it. But I also think you will be missing out long term.

I respect your honesty and I do realize that I've come off as an arrogant snob and everything you just said makes a lot of sense.

True, I don't deserve the things I desire, in fact, I don't deserve the car I'm driving now. I understand a lot of you guys drove cars that were meant to just take you guys from point A to point B. However... there's too much inductive reasoning going on here.

Did I ever mention once in this thread that the RX8 was the first car I ever owned? How many of you guys actually know how old I am? I do, indeed, need a dose of character, many others here as well.

I am not blowing off wisdom from those who are actually speaking like they are wise. I owe my gratitude to them because I can learn from their experiences. I know they've driven more cars than I have, I know they've been around cars for longer than I have, however, not every "kid" that has a nice car at his age is a douchbag. Some people came in here and started acting like they are were a better person than I am because their car was taped together through college. I know I'm blessed to have been able to drive such a car at such a young age.

I understand the CRX and the Miata has been featured in this magazine a couple times. They are great performing vehicles, however, this magazine is about automotive driving, tracking, autocrossing and not about "what car makes a better mixed daily driver". If I were building an autocross machine, I would be in nothing other than a NA Miata. Perhaps this is the wrong forum to have this kind of discussion in. Everyone is in the "build the fastest car with the lowest amount of money" mindset. I am not.

It takes much more than just growing up in less fortunate conditions in order to become a good person (and driver). I don't believe I'm handling myself out of line, I simply asked for some advice, had some people give me their opinion, politely dismissed their consideration due to my own unique conditions, and had them basically label me as "ungrateful child" that doesn't deserve "X" car... simply because we have different priorities.

As for lesser cars, I wanted to build my own. I was planning on picking up a GC Subaru (ironic, isn't it?) and start taking HPDE's in that. Truth be told, my uncle bought me the RX8. Now before I get the "rich kid" bashing, I never asked to have a nice car. He basically said he was going to buy me a car within a particular price point. Now tell me, would your typical spoiled kid that wants to go fast and easy pick an RX8 over the vast majority of other cars out there? I don't think so. In fact, I ended up buying the car at the minimum price point he gave me and told him to keep the rest.

Thanks for those who have truly and genuinely been trying to help me become a better driver and person through choosing the right car. To those just bashing me for the heck of it, and there has been plenty, go ahead and listen to what you're preaching... then go ahead and swallow some of your own advice.

After some consideration, I will be keeping the RX8.

Moderators, please close the thread.

vincephan wrote: After some consideration, I will be keeping the RX8. Moderators, please close the thread.

Moderators rarely close the threads here, and I really don't think this one needs it.

I'm in a similar situation as you: a 20 year old in college with a really nice Miata that I worked hard for, but did not pay for--I can't, as I am paying for a lot of my college. It is a little different for me because I would be happy in a stripped Miata without any interior, or a Crown Victoria, or just about anything RWD that can be made fun. But my first choice was this one, and I was lucky enough that Dad made it happen (even after I told him that this doesn't make sense).

But in your situation, after stating that you want a nicer car, I think that I would be searching for a GTO, Mustang (if the ergonomics will live up to your standards), or a WRX (really a very good answer, IMHO).

And I know you said you've decided to keep the RX8. I don't think that is a wrong decision, but I don't think you should ever stop looking.

Yeah, I still have the RX8 posted up for trade at NASIOC, if the right WRX pops up, if God permits, I'll be the owner of a WRX. It's a better car for me at the moment. I wouldn't mind picking an RX8 later on in my life time though. I definitely had a lot of fun.

Congrats on your Miata though. I have yet to drive one but since it shares the same basic underpinnings as the RX8, I'm sure it's very similar. =]

vincephan wrote: Congrats on your Miata though. I have yet to drive one but since it shares the same basic underpinnings as the RX8, I'm sure it's very similar. =]

Not mine, I have an NB. They weren't the same underpinnings as the RX8 until the NC in 2006.

Good call on the 2.5 WRX if you want a bit of punch. I have a 2.0 WRX, and while fun, you kinda have to wind it up to get it to respond, which seems to be the chief complaint of the RX8.

As for the drama, I'm sorry that "bashing" is all you took away from my previous post. That wasn't the intent, but the conversation has been soured to the point where the intent won't make it regardless.

Your last few posts already sound a bit wiser!

My apologies if I stepped over the line.

I've got a curiosity question- you were right that there has been a lot of inductive reasoning in this thread (including me). Just out of curiosity, was any of it close?

I don't think you are a snobby rich kid. I wouldn't know. I think you have a set of unique life experiences which give you a particular perspective, and there may be some opportunities that are foreign to you which you may not have considered.

SVreX wrote: Just out of curiosity, was any of it close?

Hehehe, I think that was answered when we learned the OP didn't buy his own vehicle.

my only advice concerning all these cars that are up for consiration.. drive them and find out which one you like most.

Personally.. I would take a Saab 9-2X Aero over the WRX

z31maniac wrote:

SVreX wrote: Just out of curiosity, was any of it close?

Hehehe, I think that was answered when we learned the OP didn't buy his own vehicle.

oh geez, give it a rest. if someone had offered to buy me a car while i was in college, i would have jumped at the chance. hell, i'd jump at it now. you want to beat the kid up b/c he's got a generous uncle? i guess have at it if it makes you feel better.

OP, congrats on deciding to keep the RX-8. They are great cars, although I agree that their "specialness" is kind of wasted pulling straight commuter duty. If I didn't care about having a competitive Stock-class autoX car, I'd probably have a WRX.

Aw, looks like I missed the "college kid playing with cars" side of the debate. Oh well.

vincephan wrote: Seating in the rear, Some Low End Grunt, Large Aftermarket Support, Good Gain/Money ratio, Reliable, Can double as a competent daily driver as well as an autocross/track car for the weekends.

Okay, not to be contrary, but I don't think I'd jump into the WRX if I were you. I would be too nervous of an improperly cared for Turbo. You'd go from a known to an unknown, with no appreciable gain. If you're going to change cars, either save a chunk of change, or get something fun/quirky.

I think you're trying to trade sideways into a "better" car, and it's going to be nearly impossible to do. I think you're better off trading down a little bit, but maybe not as much as other people have suggested.

Here are a couple things to think about:

E36 M3. I really think that's your answer. It's an affordable automotive Swiss Army Knife and really great German engineering. I loved my M Coupe, and it was dead-nuts reliable.

S14 chassis 240SX. 2+2 RWD coupe with a 4cylinder and tons of aftermarket support. It's also better looking and less stereotypical mad tyte dorifto than the S13.

Mustang GT or Camaro. Not as nice, but you'll have that torque you want and could net a few grand on the swap.

Mercury Grand Marquis. Soft and cooshy can be fun, and you could have fun hot-rodding it into a sleeper. It would take a lot to make it a true hot-rod, but I'm sure it would be hilarious to drive in anger after a few upgrades.