Ford used two firing orders for the 302: 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8 and then 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8 for the HO. If a person had the EFI from an HO Mustang and wanted to install it on carb'ed, non-HO car, would it be as simple as rearranging the fuel injector wiring and plug wires? We'll ignore cam or engine swaps etc. for this thought exercise.
If it's not sequential injection, would the firing order even matter?
I would think a cam swap would be required to swap firing order.
5.0 HO (LSC, Mustang) are sequential. LSCs are all speed density even after the Mustang went to mass air and have a goofy computer, you dont want to use an LSC computer but the motor hard parts are the same or same enough.
5.0 non HO (Thunderbird, Cougar, Crown Vic, Grand Monkey, F150) are batch fired.
I wouldnt even bother changing injector order, it will run fine enough at RPM, may run a little goofy at idle but its gonna be a turd anyway without an HO heads/cam swap. Plus without the HO firing order it won't "sound" like a 5.0 so without that you don't have much.
To swap in the "HO" EFI just install the wiring, ECU, intake, injector, sensors, etc. Keep your non HO firing order on the distributor, the engine won't care.
You have to change the camshaft.
As I said above, no cam swap.
What I actually had in mind was taking the EFI parts from a '93 5.0 HO with a lot of miles and suspect internals and putting them on a 60s or 70s 302 to get cheap fuel injection. I don't want to open the old 302 beyond changing the intake.
5.0 non HO (Thunderbird, Cougar, Crown Vic, Grand Monkey, F150) are batch fired.
Trucks are batch fire. Tbird and CV are sequential.
I wouldnt even bother changing injector order,
Agreed. Even with the effort to swap the cam off the table, you can still use the HO efi stuff. I have run HO ecu on SO engines, with no negative effects from the injector sequence mismatch.
Make sure you are using the proper gear for your cam material, on the TFI distributor..
You MAY need to rewire the injectors if they're sequential. Ignition won't care.
Years back I was given a freshly built Factory Five to go over, basically a PPI but more of a "make sure I didn't screw anything up". She did an amazing job putting the car together except for one flaw. The engine was a Ford 302 crate engine with a roller cam. Because it's this thread, you know what she did 
It actually drove really well on only the four corner cylinders, it just seemed a little down on power. Sounded kinda like an ACVW through the crossoverless side pipes. Then I rewired it to the correct firing order and, oh, I thought it scooted BEFORE!
Allegedly (meaning per their press release) Ford changed the firing order for the 351W to revise main bearing loads on the front journals. That makes it interesting that Ford went to the 351W firing order for the 5.0 at roughly the same time they made the crankshaft loads lighter and stuck more of the balancing way out on the damper like 6" ahead of the front main.
Apis Mellifera said:As I said above, no cam swap.
What I actually had in mind was taking the EFI parts from a '93 5.0 HO with a lot of miles and suspect internals and putting them on a 60s or 70s 302 to get cheap fuel injection. I don't want to open the old 302 beyond changing the intake.
I don't think you're getting it. It's not optional. You either swap the camshaft or use non-HO EFI compatible with your firing order.
Talking about two different firing orders
Last stupid question - will the HO manifold clear your hood and firewall? They are kinda bulky.
In reply to Javelin :
Oh, I get it. This is GRM. I never suggested it should be done. I was just curious if it was feasible or if I overlooked some aspect that would make it not worth the effort. A cam swap is optional according to the video and what others have said here. The only possible issue would be the O2 sensor mismatch between bank 1 and 2, but he said it would probably be OK with stock injectors. I hadn't considered that part of it and therefore the less than ideal performance makes it not a good GRM solution.
Many thanks for your various insights on the topic. I guess I'm back to putting a Sniper on my Torino and challenges of running a Cleveland rather than a Windsor or using the Explorer engine I was saving. It has P heads and the missing exhaust manifolds is another reason I didn't want to use it.
someone humor me please, tell me the cylinder numbering scheme on the SBF's in question.
Ford V8's are 2 4-cylinders because Henry was stubborn.
1234 on the right side,
5678 on the left.
Edsel could only sell Henry on a V8 by making it two 4-cylinders on a common crankcase. That's why a Ford flathead can run with one cylinder head removed.
A SBC and a Windsor both have the same firing pattern, just the cylinders are numbered differently.
The 351W and LS also share the "LS" firing order.
In reply to ShawnG :
All flathead V engines can do that to one degree or another. One of the benefits of the intake manifold not bolting to the heads.
A SBC or other pushrod engine will also run with one head off if you can blank off the intake manifold. People used to make Midget engines this way. (See also, Pontiac 194)
At least Ford had the forwardmost cylinder as #1. ALL GM V8s had the left bank as bank 1, even the Pontiacs, which had the right bank forward. Cylinder numbering from front to back was 21436587.
If you DON'T rearrange the HO injector harness to match the SO ignition firing order, you don't screw up the cylinder numbering/o2 bank reporting.
In my experiences using the mismatched injector sequence, I found no worse idle or driveability characteristics than a batch fire setup.
ShawnG said:A SBC and a Windsor both have the same firing pattern, just the cylinders are numbered differently.
The 351W and LS also share the "LS" firing order.
Thats what I was thinking, because there's only a couple of firing patterns available for V8 engines that share rod journals. I was curious about the ECU seeing o2 feedback from one cylinder and thinking it was another, which started my ponderations.
The only "Windsor" engine per Ford was the 351W. The 221-302 was just the 90 degree V8, or maybe the Fairlane V8. Calling it a "Windsor" is like calling a 4.8 Chevy an "LS" - that's not what the manufacturer calls it, although 99% of the time people know what you're talking about, and the other 1% of the time it's because they don't know the engines to begin with.
Come back next week when we talk about the Ford 400! Is it a Cleveland? Is it a Midland? You may be surprised!
Pete. (l33t FS) said:The only "Windsor" engine per Ford was the 351W. The 221-302 was just the 90 degree V8, or maybe the Fairlane V8. Calling it a "Windsor" is like calling a 4.8 Chevy an "LS" - that's not what the manufacturer calls it, although 99% of the time people know what you're talking about, and the other 1% of the time it's because they don't know the engines to begin with.
Come back next week when we talk about the Ford 400! Is it a Cleveland? Is it a Midland? You may be surprised!
Midland? I thought the M stood for Modified, because (iirc) it was a tall-deck and long-stroke version of something, perhaps the 351 Cleveland? Minor Confession: I know dick about Fords.
In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :
The 351M was a 400 with a 351W crank, because Ford stopped making the 351C and then realized that they needed more 350ish CI engines than they had capacity to make 351Ws. Oops.
I've seen Modified, I've seen Midland, I've seen that the M was just M.
When Ford went to the same heads on the 351W as the 302 in 77ish, they renamed that engine the 351K for a few months. It didn't stick. I don't think the K stood for anything, either...
In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :
I was a ford fan, and around when they were out. The Fairlane V8 was my favorite till the smogged 302 came out.
The 351 W was a great engine, and was the first of the series with a different firing order.
The 351 C was a completely different engine, and the 351 M was as well (kinda like the "C") the 400 was same series as "M" but never had the "M" despite the public still using the "M" to name it.
I love Pete's comparison!
but, I've only ever heard "modified" and wondering if that was a typo?
Edit: interesting. I too had heard M just meant M. First time I've ever heard Midland
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
Never heard the 351K either. But it's Ford, so, there's that to consider!
K was the VIN code for the 289 Hi Po on some cars, so...
Ford! Who knows!
The "Windsor" and "Cleveland" are obvious why; Do you happen to know a why for the 351M being a "Midland"?
Far as I know, they didn't have an assembly line in Midland TX! 
03Panther said:The "Windsor" and "Cleveland" are obvious why; Do you happen to know a why for the 351M being a "Midland"?
Far as I know, they didn't have an assembly line in Midland TX!
There is also a Midland in MI. I'm pretty sure Dow Chemical is HQ'd there, and due to it being on big water, lots of other industry up there as well.
In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :
Mostly just being silly; figured there was. Don't expect that where the 351M was made, but it's not in any of my "useless trivia" memory banks!
Lotta REALLY cool and important info in them; sadly, I haven't found a defrag program 
The 351M and 400 also used the 385 series (big block Ford) transmission flange on the block not the small block version.
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