Serious discussion... Cars as an investment?

Javelin wrote:

imirk wrote: The difference is the labor involved, miata hardtop issue aside, you are comparing a job to an investment, an investment takes almost none of my time, and I get paid very little and make crap returns on my money, versus my job which to me is almost printing me money, except that I have to work and give up my time.

I did exactly 0 work on the Concord, and spent all of 10 minutes on the Lincoln getting a used tire installed on a lunch break. So since you can only sell 6 a year anyways, it should give you time to seek out the "really easy" deals, right?

Javelin:

See, this is where the credibility goes away. Had you done "0 work" on the Concord, it would still be around. At a bare minimum, you had to advertise the car, meet with at least one buyer and perform whatever paperwork is required.

Unless your tire store is run by NASCAR pit crews, a tire change is not going to take 10 minutes, at a minimum, you used up your lunch hour to get there and back.

I am not disputing the fact that you made some coin, however, I am always amazed at how, after accomplishing a difficult task, so many people reduce it to "No Big Deal"

So, with income earned in the hundreds of dollars/hour range why have you not quit your day job?

You need to figure all of your time spent, whether it's actually working on the cars, advertising them, paperwork or whatever, and divide that out by how much money you take in.

Say you make $1000 on a car flip but it takes 100 hours of your time to buy the car, fix it, clean it up, run ads, deal with buyers, and so on. Is all this worth $10/hr?

NOHOME wrote:

Javelin wrote:

imirk wrote: The difference is the labor involved, miata hardtop issue aside, you are comparing a job to an investment, an investment takes almost none of my time, and I get paid very little and make crap returns on my money, versus my job which to me is almost printing me money, except that I have to work and give up my time.

I did exactly 0 work on the Concord, and spent all of 10 minutes on the Lincoln getting a used tire installed on a lunch break. So since you can only sell 6 a year anyways, it should give you time to seek out the "really easy" deals, right?

Javelin: See, this is where the credibiity goes away. Had you done "0 work" on the Concord, it would still be around. At a bare minimum, you had to advertize the car, meet with at least one buyer and perform whatever paperwork is required.

Well, obviously you have to actually buy and sell the car. I thought that part was pretty obvious, I mean you can't sell a car without actually physically selling the car. I meant I did no actual work to the car itself. Didn't even wash it.

And to clarify the other points, yes the tire change really did only take 10 minutes from my day. There's a used tire store on the same street as my work. I dropped the wheel off on the way out for lunch, and picked it up on the way back in. It really was "that easy". Granted I did have to put the tire on the car when I got home, and I did wash it. So in all fairness, let's say I spent an hour on fixing up the Lincoln, plus an hour to buy it and an hour to sell it. That's still $130/hr?

So even if you give yourself 5-10 hours for each "deal", as long as you make a good $300, you are money ahead. And for clarification, I didn't quit my day job. I did most of these this summer while in-between jobs. I was just realizing how much better this was at making money than traditional investments, as the 401K and retirement plans at work look like flushing money down a toilet to me.

Sounds like your mind is made up, give it a shot.

Oh I have been and did. I'm just trying to make sense of doing it again. Time is a little more valuable to me now, but I do need to have a retirement plan. Considering a CD is worth all of about $100 a year right now (with a stupid amount of principle), even doing 1 car a year would be better.

Javelin wrote: the 401K and retirement plans at work look like flushing money down a toilet to me.

You may want to look at managing those plans a little, and moving some of the money around to different areas...my 401k has been doing great over the last year or so.

Nick Mason, drummer for Pink Floyd, is considering something similar albeit on a slightly larger scale...

http://www.detnews.com/article/20110127/AUTO03/101270319/1148/auto01/Pink-Floyd’s-Mason-out-to-earn-15--car-fund-profit

It's worked well for me. Never had a job in college-my room mate and I would buy a car or two every semester, fix and detail it, sell it and live off the proceeds. Worked on our terms and hours. Now, considering that I always have quite a few cars in the fleet, I try and buy smart so I can flip the cars for a nice return when something else catches my eye. I traded a 60s Ferrari for my first house years ago when Ferraris made their first crazy run up in value. Stay away from orphans and unloved models and you'll be OK.