Should I get a TDI?

I drive a bunch for work (30K plus miles per year) and I need to carry rather large objects. Therefore I've been eyeing either a used 09-14 Jetta Sportwagen or maybe, just maybe I could stretch for the new Golf Sportwagen - maybe.

If I go with the used Jetta TDI, what are the main issues? I've never owned a VAG product and it probably has a lot to do with their terrible reputation. But a manual transmission, diesel wagon is just too cool!

If I go with the new Golf, has anyone compared the two? Is the new car way better?

I'll be selling my Golf TDI shortly, but I think it's below your price point and ilder than you might want. I dont think any of the diesel VAG products have serious issues, especially with the powertrains.
Fuel economy is great, I was getting 52 or so during my commute (70% highway).
At least in the generation I own, the interior plastics are monumentally poor quality. Shamefully crappy.

DrBoost wrote: At least in the generation I own, the interior plastics are monumentally poor quality. Shamefully crappy.

It's because of our car market. The Camry/Accord buyers don't care about a nice interior, so VW had to cheapen the interior some on the Jetta to lower the price. I'm sure it could be the same with the Golf and Passat.

MK6 TDIs have intercooler freezing issues. Not sure if it will happen where you are. I've had 3 no-start/hard start/almost hydrolock issues with mine. Basically in humid and cold areas, the water freezes in the intercooler. Then you park and the ice melts and puddles in intercooler. Next time you try and start, it might not or you could suck the water into your engine. I am going to design/find a drain before this next winter for mine.

Other than that, my Golf has been trouble free at 127k miles. I am having the timing belt done now (no time to do it myself), and it needs shocks/struts. Everything else works fine.

CGLockRacer wrote: MK6 TDIs have intercooler freezing issues. Not sure if it will happen where you are. I've had 3 no-start/hard start/almost hydrolock issues with mine. Basically in humid and cold areas, the water freezes in the intercooler. Then you park and the ice melts and puddles in intercooler. Next time you try and start, it might not or you could suck the water into your engine. I am going to design/find a drain before this next winter for mine. Other than that, my Golf has been trouble free at 127k miles. I am having the timing belt done now (no time to do it myself), and it needs shocks/struts. Everything else works fine.

2011 Golf TDI driver here as well. 150 miles/day round trip commute. 35~40K/year

Had the same issues living in Michigan. Intercooler freezes in single digit temperature, thaws out parked in the garage overnight, and then the dreaded sucking of water into engine no start/hardstart/near hydrolock scenario.

An EGR delete/tune permanently solves that issue, but most people don't like having to modify a new car just so it'll start in the morning. I just left the car outside on really cold nights so the intercooler stayed frozen (ironic yes.. leave a diesel outside in freezing temps so it'll start easy in the morning).

Other than that, no issues, and it's a great commuter. mostly highway, 80mph, AC on, driving like I stole it, lifetime average just shy of 40mpg. I'm closing in on 100K on the car now. Manual 6-speed.

http://www.fuelly.com/car/volkswagen/golf/2011/grounded87/309993

My old '99.5 Golf TDI got better mpg's, but the mk6 is a much nicer car to drive. I ran the mk4 to 285K and sold it to a friend. It's still chugging along. It ate 5th gear at 235K, plugged in a used trans, and kept truckin'. The new car seems much better put together.

DrBoost wrote: I'll be selling my Golf TDI shortly.

I was wondering if you still had that car. Mk IV with the bare-bones options spec, right? I might be interested. Now a toss-up between this and ProDarwin's Miata...

Kinda surprising to heear you say that about the interior. The interior quality of my Jetta still beats cars twice the price, even after 12 years and over 300K miles.

I have a '12 TDI Jetta. Not so many miles on it as some others. I only got less then 40 mpg on two tanks this past winter and both were just under 40, other wise always 40+ in everyday around town driving and 50+ on the highway. The innercooler issue is for those that park the car indoors. I don't and I don't worry about it. It always started even in -10 deg. temps. If it gets colder then that I'm just not going anywhere. Being retired allows you to make that choice.

Had an '09 DSG TDI, got totaled by a dumb lady in a Honda Pilot or we'd still have it. Made it to a bit over 101K miles, had one cylinder pressure sensor fail (it's built into the glow plug, easy replacement), factory battery died after about 5 years, driver rear door handle broke. Still had the original brakes, all maintenance but the DSG service was done by yours truly. Never had the intercooler icing problem, and we drove it through 3 Ohio Winters.

We replaced the '09 with a '14 JSW DSG Sunroof, we couldn't wait around for the Golf Sportwagen to be available, we needed a car right away. Fuel economy hasn't been as great on the JSW as it was for the sedan, but it's improving some now that the temperatures are warmer.

We had a 2004 A4 wagon with a 2-liter. It was awesome to own. I think the only issue we had over the 4-years of ownership was the EGR valve once, and I put sulfur free diesel in it in the dead of winter not knowing it'd gel up in the tank (it was in Hungary that all this happened)

Otherwise a great car, would do 45mpg while driving about 90mph down the motorway, and was as smooth as butter. Would do again.

edit:

Not sure what engines we got here, but some of the TDIs in Europe had cam shaft problems when the incorrect oil was used (must meet VW ou812 or whatever the requirement is). I guess the injector pumps run off the cam and put a lot of stress on it. I believe these were known as PD-TDI engines? Unfortunately I'm not very well versed, and got my info second hand from a mechanic friend when a co-worker's Passat broke its camshaft.

Hungary Bill wrote: edit: Not sure what engines we got here, but some of the TDIs in Europe had cam shaft problems when the incorrect oil was used (must meet VW ou812 or whatever the requirement is). I guess the injector pumps run off the cam and put a lot of stress on it. I believe these were known as PD-TDI engines? Unfortunately I'm not very well versed, and got my info second hand from a mechanic friend when a co-worker's Passat broke its camshaft.

Correct, those were the "PD" engines, and were also used in the US. They were in the later mk4 cars starting in 2004, and used in the mk5's as well. The "common rail" 2.0 replaced it in the mk6 (2010?+) cars.

While the PD motors did have issues eating cams/lifters due to the smaller lobe size (more things to run on the cam since cam drove injectors), the cam replacement costs have come way down, and there are countless cars that ran the correct oil with hundreds of thousands of miles on the original cam with no issue.

"Correct oil" has always been a problem for TDI's - at least since around '97 with the ALH versions. It seems a lot of noob owners get sticker-shock when they see $10/qt for the proper sythetic. Or they don't realize how important the oil is and just figure, "any synthetic will do..." especially when it can sometimes be hard to find.

It's a lot easier to find now, but I live in a reasonably populated area with a lot of TDI's. When I first bought my car in 2003, TDI's were fairly rare and the only place I could easily find oil was a local VW/Audi dealer. Fortunately, their cost wasn't any worse than buying synthetics from other stores.

Oil can be tough for the DIYer that doesn't want to pay dealer pricing, but I've found ordering a case at a time online works out cheaper in the long run.

Both of our cars have been the newer common rail engines, the '09 was a CBEA, the '14 is a CJAA, and I use Mobil 1 5w30 ESP, it meets the VW 507.00 requirement for low sulfur/ash, and comes in liter bottles. In OH, the local O'Reilly's stocked it for me and one other guy, kept it behind the counter for us. When we moved back to AR, no one could get it, NAPA, O'Reilly's, Autozone, Advanced, etc. One O'Reilly's about 60 miles away allegedly had one case in stock, but couldn't find it. Pep Boy's in Little Rock could get it, but wanted almost $15/bottle for it. I quit trying local, I can get a case (12 bottles) from Amazon shipped free for a little over $9 a bottle. With 10K mile oil change interval that lasts a while.

Most VW dealers carry the 507.00 Castrol, so if you need it now, you'll pay a little more, but you can get it.

We test drove a '15 Jetta sedan with the new EA288 TDI, same engine in the new Golf Sportwagen, it didn't feel anymore powerful than the CBEA we were replacing, but the new engines are supposed to be more fuel efficient. They require DEF now, even in the Jetta, I was a little turned off by that, and the Mk6 Jetta (even the '15 refresh) just isn't as nice of a car as the Mk5 or JSW were in our opinion.

If the Golf GTD, or that AWD, Manual, TDI Golf Sportwagen press car that was touring the car shows last Summer make it to a US dealer's lot, I will own one.

I'm kind of rambling now, so I'll shut up.

I always just ordered an oil change kit from idparts.com had the right oil the filter the drain nut etc. Piece of cake. My TDI was awesome, my only complaint in retrospect was buying a very bare bones one and so the car just didnt feel "nice" and thats eventually why I replaced it after spending so much time in it.

In reply to bigdaddylee82:

Have you checked Walmart? They usually have more M1 in stock (in jugs!) than the parts stores.

Kenny_McCormic wrote: In reply to bigdaddylee82: Have you checked Walmart? They usually have more M1 in stock (in jugs!) than the parts stores.

They've got the usual suspects, various weights, and high mileage, but not this stuff.

Jaynen wrote: My TDI was awesome, my only complaint in retrospect was buying a very bare bones one and so the car just didnt feel "nice" and thats eventually why I replaced it after spending so much time in it.

Maybe that's why I tend to be confused about interior complaints. When I ordered my car (no dealer within 5 states had a TDI wagon on the lot back in '03), I spec'd it with tan leather and the upgraded stereo. Something about a dark car with a tan leather interior just gives it a more upscale feel. It kinda irks me you can't order a Jetta with leather anymore. And annoyingly, if you want heated seats you need to order at least the mid-level trim model with a berking sunroof... My car was the same way, but at least the sunroof in my car is small and with the fuse pulled is essentially forgotten (yes - I really dislike sunroofs...).

Ian F wrote: I was wondering if you still had that car. Mk IV with the bare-bones options spec, right? I might be interested. Now a toss-up between this and ProDarwin's Miata... Kinda surprising to heear you say that about the interior. The interior quality of my Jetta still beats cars twice the price, even after 12 years and over 300K miles.

Yeah, only power locks cuz they don't build 'em without. Manual trans, 2-door, upgraded suspension and a few other things.
The interior quality is terrible. Anything you remove will break. In fact, when I was replacing the side mirrors last week, my neighbor's VW door panel clips broke out of sympathy. And he wasn't even working on it at the time haha.
That said, it's a great commuter, but you know that. Back when my commute was about 70% highway I was getting 720-750 miles to a tank by the time the light would come on. Amazing.

CGLockRacer wrote: MK6 TDIs have intercooler freezing issues. Not sure if it will happen where you are. I've had 3 no-start/hard start/almost hydrolock issues with mine. Basically in humid and cold areas, the water freezes in the intercooler. Then you park and the ice melts and puddles in intercooler. Next time you try and start, it might not or you could suck the water into your engine. I am going to design/find a drain before this next winter for mine. Other than that, my Golf has been trouble free at 127k miles. I am having the timing belt done now (no time to do it myself), and it needs shocks/struts. Everything else works fine.

I do remember reading about the intercooler freezing - I'm in Oregon so it could be a thing if I'm up in the mountains.

I also saw a couple of things regarding HPFP failures - anybody have experience with that?

I'm also considering an E90 wagon, if I could find one. I know it won't get anything close to the mileage but I have an E90 sedan and it is the best car I've ever owned.

kilgoretrout wrote:

CGLockRacer wrote: MK6 TDIs have intercooler freezing issues. Not sure if it will happen where you are. I've had 3 no-start/hard start/almost hydrolock issues with mine. Basically in humid and cold areas, the water freezes in the intercooler. Then you park and the ice melts and puddles in intercooler. Next time you try and start, it might not or you could suck the water into your engine. I am going to design/find a drain before this next winter for mine. Other than that, my Golf has been trouble free at 127k miles. I am having the timing belt done now (no time to do it myself), and it needs shocks/struts. Everything else works fine.

I do remember reading about the intercooler freezing - I'm in Oregon so it could be a thing if I'm up in the mountains.

Our '04 Audi made it through some seriously cold weather with no issues. Far worse than what we get in the western side of Washington (not sure if you're east of the cascades or not). Although it's not very humid in Hungary either so that may be a contributing factor.

I had a 01 Jetta tdi with about 150k miles, and I didn't like it at all. Really hard to work on, only got over 40 mpg one tank, and if I had kept it I would have had $12k+ into it to fix all the issues. I did read that they finally decided to warranty the hpfp issues on the newer ones, there is a lot of information on the tdi club board. I'm going to stick with Mercedes if I drive a diesel though, no more VW.

FYI. One the subject of special oils for the TDI. I found that Penzoil sells the correct synthetic oil for less then Mobil 1. They have a 6qt case for about $36 plus shipping, unless you have Amazon Prime, etc.

Ian F wrote:

Jaynen wrote: My TDI was awesome, my only complaint in retrospect was buying a very bare bones one and so the car just didnt feel "nice" and thats eventually why I replaced it after spending so much time in it.

Maybe that's why I tend to be confused about interior complaints. When I ordered my car (no dealer within 5 states had a TDI wagon on the lot back in '03), I spec'd it with tan leather and the upgraded stereo. Something about a dark car with a tan leather interior just gives it a more upscale feel. It kinda irks me you can't order a Jetta with leather anymore. And annoyingly, if you want heated seats you need to order at least the mid-level trim model with a berking sunroof... My car was the same way, but at least the sunroof in my car is small and with the fuse pulled is essentially forgotten (yes - I really dislike sunroofs...).

Mine was a 2000 so Mk4 with manual trans and roll up windows and cloth seats. It had working AC and a decent stereo those were about its only options.

This is what I used on mine. 5qts of oil and the filters etc 37bucks before shipping http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=25_28&products_id=1059

I will also say that for doing a lot of miles only going to the gas station every 600 miles is awesome. As is true 10,000 mile oil changes, and once you have made sure it has a new timing belt those are on a 100,000 mile interval.

I had mine for at least 80k miles starting at 124k miles. The worst tank of gas I ever got in it was all city driving 4 people in the car with the AC one in Las Vegas and was 39mpg. My normal MPG at 80mph and mixed traffic commute in Socal was a steady 43mpg. (slowing to 70 gained 2mpg)

Cost wise I had to replace turbo hoses (they get old eventually as all rubber does) I fixed/recharged the AC. I had to have a new oil pan put on when I hit a big rock in the road but other than that just oil changes and filter changes for 80k reliable miles.

Travis_K wrote: I had a 01 Jetta tdi with about 150k miles, and I didn't like it at all. Really hard to work on, only got over 40 mpg one tank, and if I had kept it I would have had $12k+ into it to fix all the issues. I did read that they finally decided to warranty the hpfp issues on the newer ones, there is a lot of information on the tdi club board. I'm going to stick with Mercedes if I drive a diesel though, no more VW.

Wow definitely sounds like you got a not very good one. I made sure to buy one with good document maintenance history.