I've got a '95 Mustang GT with a slight pull to the right, an off-center steering wheel, and the pull changes under braking vs. not. The car has about 150,000 miles and what I believe are the original lower control arms / ball joints / bushings. Because I don't know the history of this car (bought in April from out of state) and because I have not seen accident damage while under the car swapping in new rack mount bushings and a solid steering shaft, I want to think that that right side lower control arm has some basic parking lot damage, like curbing and such. So I'm thinking it's getting time for new control arms.
Are the 2003-2004 Cobra arms worth the cost? Can I even get replacement arms for a GT from Ford or do I need to step up to the Cobra parts? This is not a track car, I am not interested in converting to a coil-over front or moving to a tubular K member now or in the future, but if there's a decent tubular arm that I could move to for not a lot of money that may be something I'm interested in.
Right now I'm just building up a pile of parts to do this swap along with struts, springs, tie rod ends, and other related bits. Eventually I want to do the whole front at once so I have time and can pick up other pieces if there's some reason to wait.
The SN95 hubs/uprights are extremely desireable. That being said, I'm not sure what the difference in the GT vs Cobra parts is. The pull may be associated with a hub bearing or sticking brake caliper if it changes while under braking. Just a thought though.
I know you said you're not looking for any extreme suspension swaps, but have you checked out Maximum Motorsports stuff? Their stuff is really high quality and bolts right up. Pretty much all we used at the performance shop I used to work at.
Conquest - he already has an SN95.
Pres - the issue that you're going to run into is the factory inboard-spring setup. I've yet to see a tubular A-arm that allowed you to keep the stock spring location.
The flipside of that issue is that most coil-over conversion kits on the market are built around drag struts (lakewood, strange). --I know you said you didn't want to go this route, I'm just backfilling info in case this option becomes more appealing.-- The only two COs I'm aware of that use what I consider to be decent dampers (bilstein, koni, tokico) are the MM and Griggs setups... which are both fairly spendy.
Near as I know the only difference in the Cobra A-arms is that they're cut slightly different to allow for wider wheels, so it's definitely an easy go-to if you can't find stockers.
Oh, and just an FYI, in the Mustang world "LCA" very specifically refers to the rear suspension.
In reply to ReverendDexter:
I don't think what I'm doing really makes the cost of MM or Griggs C-Over parts worth the money. It's a GT Convertible that I intend to keep on the street 100% of the time; never say never but I don't plan on racing this thing. The money seems like it would be better spent elsewhere.
A quick search doesn't even show an online source for GT control arms, Cobra parts seem to run around $300 for the pair, and they're supposed to have Delrin bushings installed as well as an improved balljoint. I don't know if the geometry of that balljoint is different from the '95 GT part but supposedly, grain of salt here, it's a lower friction part with more strength. Somehow. If GT arms aren't much cheaper I figure I might as well grab Cobra arms, but so far with no pricing info I'm not sure which direction to take this.
I can't say for certain, but my guess would be that the balljoint is taller as well. The front roll center on Mustangs is pretty low, and makes for some craptastic geometry (like camber loss under compression :x ). Anything that can get it up is a good thing.
There are spring perches for OE lower control arms on tubular crossmembers.
John Brown wrote:
There are spring perches for OE lower control arms on tubular crossmembers.
On which ones? All the tubular Ks I've looked at require a CO conversion (MM, Griggs, QA1)
In reply to John Brown:
Maybe I'm confused but I don't see how that helps me if I'm not interested in changing to a tubular crossmember at this time. If anything this sounds like a situation where if I get stock or Cobra, etc factory parts I can swap to a tubular crossmember later and not have to throw away parts. Right?
Pres, I did a little bit of digging and found these: LMR - AJE tubular A-arms with spring cups
I'm not familiar with AJE Racing, but it looks to be exactly what you're looking for.
Just buy the 03 Cobra arms. They are slightly forward offset and are probably about the same price. Look at one of the large mustang distributors - CJ Pony parts, jegs, summitracing...
If it is a street car, just keep it close to stock. Once you open up MM's catalog, it's hard to stop. I've got about $4k worth on my car (only really need the Torque arm and tubular k-member).
You CAN have a really, really great handling better-than-stock riding street car with the full MM stuff, ride quality has more to do with shocks/springs.
Honestly, if I was going to have a 'street' Mustang, I would do this:
-MM Panhard bar - $350
-Road and Track springs - $250
-Koni or Bilstein - $650
-MM Camber/caster plates - $200
-Rear lower control arms - $300
That will give you a pretty decent handling car. If i was just going to do one, I would get the PHB the difference is UNBELIEVABLE.
Rev: I found the AJE arms last night, but I don't know if they're going to be a no problems, decade of street use part vs. the Cobra arm which, while heavier, is also heavier. If you get my meaning. Cobra parts are also about $100 less for the pair and come built up with bushings and ball joints that are said to improve the roll center slightly. Thanks for looking though!
Social: I've heard stories about adding a PHB to an otherwise stock or near-stock rear causing additional bind, which makes sense to me, and this is already a bindy situation. I'm planning on grabbing everything you're talking about but with the addition of subframe connectors (and perhaps jacking rail connectors as well with some triangular bracing between those and the subframe connectors) and a torque arm, and I do like the MM stuff (so far I just have their solid steering shaft). This is also why I want to pile the parts up and do it at once; the torque arm has pretty different spring requirements so I'll want to shotgun the front and rear at once. Hopefully my garage situation by winter will let me spend some time out there without freezing to death.
IF you plan on keeping it a street/crusing type car then keep it stock. Better shocks/strut are a given, the Cobra ft. LCAs may be a bit better but I don't think you would do wrong by just getting GT replacemnt arms. Going coil over in the front is not that an expensive conversion. All you need is good quality caster/camber plates (Go MM.) and then there are kits to convert either Koni or Bilstien struts to coil over on the Mustang.
Installing a PHB will improve the handling of the car but it will induce bind in the rear suspension as it moves up and down. Some owners remove this by converting to a PM3L. You install a PHB and then remove one of the upper links. There is much info on this if you vist Corner Carvers.com and do a search.
jim: I've read a number of horror stories about the PM3L leading to torn bushings in the remaining upper rear control arm.
I haven't called a local dealership but OEM GT arms brand new seem nearly as costly as the Cobra parts. Haven't seen anyone say otherwise yet. Will look into conversion kits for coil over using stock-fit struts. I would imagine MM has something like that available off the shelf, maybe other sources as well. Not really sure of the benefit though if I'm going to keep using a stock style arm.
A panhard bar is only going to cause bind if you have other-than-stock UCAs. The stock UCAs with their super-soft rubber bushings have plenty of deflection allowance to the lateral movement imparted by a panhard bar (especially with a long one such as the MM unit).
Social - how is it you have $4k of MM goodies and have yet to do the TA? That's probably one of the most noticeable changes I've ever made to my foxbody, and I went to it after running around with a poor-man's 3-link for a couple months. I'm also curious why you wouldn't recommend subframe connectors as part of your budget handling setup... that was one of the other huge things for me on both my foxbody and my SN95 Cobra.
It seems that if you have to rely on deflection in the UCA then you're still talking about bind. This probably isn't something you're trying to debate though since you've gone on to say what an improvement the TA was, and that you were also running a PM3L seems to say you were trying to reduce bind as well...
Well, bind is an inherent part of the fox-chassis 4-link rear suspension (and why it's nicknamed the "quadrabind"). The geometry of the UCAs requires bushing deflection, as the UCAs have to twist relative to their mount points as the axle goes through jounce and roll. It's why poly-bushed UCAs are a huge no-no, and I stress that anyone looking at staying with the 4-link go with spherical bushed UCAs instead.
pres589 wrote:
Will look into conversion kits for coil over using stock-fit struts. I would imagine MM has something like that available off the shelf, maybe other sources as well. Not really sure of the benefit though if I'm going to keep using a stock style arm.
Depeding on the diameter of the body of the front strut you can buy coil over conversion kits from almost any supplier. Using a caster camber plate all you need to add is a top spring mount, a threaded sleeve, and the adjusting collar-which sometimes doubles as the lower spring mount. Some kits come with a second threaded collar to lock the spring mount to the sleeve. The whole assembly sits on the two monting tabs that hold the strut to the Mustangs spindle. Here's a pic of a friends car from his web site.
http://www.dariusrudis.com/2001_Griggs/
