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Ian F
Ian F SuperDork
2/15/12 12:24 p.m.
psteav wrote: and of course there's the durocco. I don't think the website is up any more,

that was one of the funniest website/build-blogs ever. It's a shame he took it down.... I've always loved the final sentence: "The car left the driveway under it's own power for the first time... berkeleying sideways!!!"

A mid-engine del Sol would be an awesome project.

Del Sol's do seem to have a following... a friend of ours has a bone stock one that is her DD. She is always fending off offers to buy it.

clutchsmoke
clutchsmoke Reader
2/15/12 12:26 p.m.

Your clutch is on it's way out. I had the same issue in my '90 Acura Legend.

I know you want to go K series and all if you swapped in another Honda engine, but what's wrong with a B-series? You could build a turbo B series (with an electric exhaust cutout for stealth) for $4k if you just bought off the shelf parts. Could probably build it for half that with careful shopping and parts sourcing. With that said, I'll have my popcorn in hand and patiently wait for this LSX swapped Del Sol. Few years ago someone built an LSX swapped EK. Lots of cutting and welding.

Taiden
Taiden SuperDork
2/15/12 12:53 p.m.

There's something about a b16 turbo with a properly sized turbocharger that is just ridiculous.

BoostedBrandon
BoostedBrandon HalfDork
2/15/12 1:14 p.m.

When completed, I will expect to see you at LSFest at Beech Bend Raceway Park. No excuses.

Hasbro
Hasbro Dork
2/15/12 1:17 p.m.
jstein77 wrote:
ronholm wrote: http://honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=1266033
This is perfect. Should have come that way from the factory.

Agreed. I would have been first in line. Why build a car that looks like a middy but is front wheel drive?

N Sperlo
N Sperlo SuperDork
2/15/12 1:36 p.m.

By the way, someone here probably has two turbochargers to sell you that would probably be perfect for your project.

Taiden
Taiden SuperDork
2/15/12 3:20 p.m.

Which means you should use both simultaneously.

One to turbocharge the l33

One as an afterburner attached next to the tail pipe.

Teh E36 M3
Teh E36 M3 Dork
2/15/12 5:52 p.m.
Chocoholic wrote:
Luke wrote: The Del Sol is one of those cars that looks like it ought to be mid engine/RWD.
Tell me about it. Whenever someone doesn't know what my del Sol is I usually get a "Is this an MR2?" or something similar.

Another is the Audi TT. I'd have loved for that to be a middy.

Alas.

oldopelguy
oldopelguy Dork
2/15/12 7:33 p.m.

Might give some thought to a Supra transmission, using the bell-housing Advance Adapters sells for Toyota trucks. Still a great tranny, even if only a 5-speed, plenty stout, and even with the bell-housing half the cost of a t-56. The real benefit is in the size, though, half the width and 2/3rd the height.

thunderzy
thunderzy Reader
2/15/12 9:01 p.m.

not sure if this has been posted. but this dude did it to a civic hatch. It can be done.

http://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-hybrids/730443-newbie-ls1-but-not-your-typical-car.html

ronholm
ronholm Reader
2/15/12 9:19 p.m.
thunderzy wrote: not sure if this has been posted. but this dude did it to a civic hatch. It can be done. http://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-hybrids/730443-newbie-ls1-but-not-your-typical-car.html

Yep.. Posted here today... I have been surfing the thread.. and while the car is neat.. and certainly fast.. Some of the rear suspension geometry was needlessly screwed up.. (probably 'works' just fine though) and the whole thread makes me rethink LS1 swaps.. and or appreciate the the GRM board just that much more.. The signal to noise ratio in that thread is all jacked up.. the mullets.. they are just to much.. even the ones supporting the guy.

Very cool car at the end of the day though.... If not well.. just needlessly a bit crude..

and at the end of the day... I dunno.. it makes me rethink my mid engine RWD conversion a bit..(a 85 shelby charger) Heck.. if going to do all that redneck'n stuff together with rectangular tube.. why the heck wouldn't you just build a decent tube frame and then set the car on it? This is done all the time... and nothing about the build really shows any 'extraordinary' skill.. Just lots of garage fun...

Makes me wonder what I am doing..

Sky_Render
Sky_Render Reader
2/16/12 10:10 a.m.

I approve of this project. When do you start?

neon4891
neon4891 SuperDork
2/16/12 10:29 a.m.

Good luck. I find the Del Sol to be my perfect DD, if I can ever get one.

Luke
Luke SuperDork
2/16/12 10:33 a.m.
Sky_Render wrote: I approve of this project. When do you start?

Internet forum psych-up is the first step in any project of this magnitude. Then comes the first irreversible cut

BBsGarage
BBsGarage HalfDork
2/16/12 10:50 a.m.

There's a very loud metallic green Del Sol that I come across in my daily commute. Always did like those cars.

Just thought I'd say that.

have you started yet?

jstein77
jstein77 Dork
2/16/12 11:01 a.m.
Teh E36 M3 wrote:
Chocoholic wrote:
Luke wrote: The Del Sol is one of those cars that looks like it ought to be mid engine/RWD.
Tell me about it. Whenever someone doesn't know what my del Sol is I usually get a "Is this an MR2?" or something similar.
Another is the Audi TT. I'd have loved for that to be a middy. Alas.

Actually, Audi did create a mid-engined TT. It's called the R8.

Sky_Render
Sky_Render Reader
2/16/12 11:30 a.m.
jstein77 wrote: Actually, Lamborghni did create a mid-engined TT. It's called the Audi R8.

Fixed that for you.

Rymel
Rymel New Reader
2/17/12 2:06 a.m.

christ, the positive response is overwhelming! why didn't i come here sooner?! i'll try to reply in order...

first off, you guys are going through the same work i've already done, haha. my personal rear-engine sol favorite is the Top Fuel del Sol. beautiful car, and i'll be mimicking its wheel stance 100%. as well as the full (replica) Mugen body kit. we initially were going to utilize one of those front vents for the SR20's SMIC.

i'd post the page link but both super street and import tuner's websites won't load for me for some reason.

N Sperlo - the initial plan WAS to follow this eg hatch to a T, after looking at RALLYSol's CR-V driveline swap and deciding that if he can get a driveshaft to fit, so can i. especially with how cheap the eg hatch was supposedly done for, i couldn't stop thinking about it. originally i had gotten a 240 with a half-installed SR20DET that hadn't been started in over 2 years. the plan there went from refreshing it to replacing it with an RB26DETT, to the now final L33 swap planned. i actually got a rolling shell with the 240's purchase, and had fully intended on doing the sol conversion with the SR20. got talked out of doing it last december, citing costs. it's still on the table in the event i back out of attempting this LS swap, though. and turbo is waaayyy down the line! i can't afford it!

Taiden - that's the plan, actually! everything from under the s13, onto the sol. and you're not helping with the turbo thing!

93EXCivic - 93 Si, S20 tranny. it probably is just due for a new clutch. the sol i had before this one didn't like staying in 2nd or 3rd unless i held in place, but that was bad synchros. as for cutting and welding, sadly i don't have the space, tools, skills or time for this kind of project. so instead i'll be bringing it to a shop. i have a choice of a shop where i know a well-vouched for welder, or a closer shop that knows domestics and has experience with track racing. i'll decide that when the time comes though.

re: why not B series? tbh, it's kinda played. i don't want to be yet another guy talking about his b-swap to another honda guy. the parts honestly are too much money for not enough return, at least for me. maybe i'm just getting older, but i also do not like the noise from heavily built small-displacement street cars with a large-diameter exhaust system. or maybe it's just the ones i often come across. but having driven a sol with a short ram intake and snapped off stock muffler it's obnoxious when i have to drive for more than an hour, and it's essentially an air raid siren for cops if i happen to be doing any decent speed. they just love little RED sporty looking cars...especially if it's an import driven by an asian . turbos alleviate the problem, but intercoolers are signs for thieves that something good's under the hood. with the LSx swap, i plan to have it dump to hidden side pipes over a certain rpm (don't know at what point yet). that way with daily driving it's quiet under the stifling small muffler, but lets the power out when i hit it. noise problems in daily driving solved, power on demand without needing to go to higher rpms, solved. woul've preferred just going J35, but on del sols J-series motors stick out INCHES from a shaker hood. i guess the nose slopes a bit more than regular EGs, but i don't need to advertise my block.

re: why not CR-V drivetrain? without upgrading the rear diff and axles, it can't handle power. and i'm stuck with the B20 tranny i believe, i think the transfer case it integrated. with all that trouble, may as well go up to something better. contemplated Skyline/G35 AWD, but unsure of how to make it work. inconclusive googling. i DO want the Nissan ATTESA E-TS Pro system, however. i tried looking up mating t-cases to T56s the other night for LS AWD...could work, but i don't think it can fit under the car without sacrificing the passenger seat, ha. not to mention no one's done it yet...

MadScientistMatt - yea, that's the well-known Civette. a fine, fine drift car, but to me, he 'cheated'. he didn't really make the drivetrain fit the hatch at all, he dropped its shell on the drivetrain. hot rod-style, sure, but in terms of useful information for anyone else to attempt without doing the same path? kinda useless. there's a reason why there wasn't a flood of LS-swapped EK civics afterwards...they all think they have to do the same thing. or fell for the old "anything can be done with enough time/money" line without a real explanation. i hate that line.

ronholm - that gemini sol never got finished. which is a shame, it would've hauled ass. heard he ran out of money and never got back to it.

Raze - that is indeed inspirational to think about. i'm glad i signed up! i was told all of that. but if i wanted a miata, i wouldn't have bought a sol. if i wanted an Ls-equipped car, i wouldn't have bought a sol. kind of a pattern here . and i like putting thought into doing things that should work but no one else thinks will. especially if it more than likely should work.

Chocoholic - i've gotten that, and gotten 'what car is that?' despite the honda emblem and model stickers on the back.

Ian F - i get asked if i'm selling mine all the time. those that know the car know that it's hard to find them in the condition i have it in. those that know it's stock are both blown away and interested in my motor once i swap!

BoostedBrandon - i'll be sure to make that trip when i do!

oldopelguy - given the magnitude of the project, i'd rather just put in the best tranny i can afford and be done with it. i'm actually aiming for a TR-6060, but we'll see how finances go with that. is it really half the cost of a T-56 and shorter?

now why haven't i started? finances. this was conceived only 2 or 3 weeks ago, and i'm planning this to coincide with my end-of-year bonus. going to save all year, then whatever i have come bonus time is how much i have to spend on both the parts and labor. Luke is right though, you guys are psyching me up pretty good! but because of the magnitude, i want to have this planned out as much as possible before even approaching the shops. both to have an actual plan and so they don't try to pull a fast one on me because i went in half-cocked.

that said, i do have quite a few questions for those who have undertaken projects like this: -we all know the del sol flexes a lot. will tie bars be enough or will i have to get a roll cage welded in?

-i wish to retain optimum daily driver mileage throughout the motor's entire build, and would love to have a switchable tune for both DD and all-out maps. with hondata this is possible (and on the fly i believe), but do GM ECUs have something similar available? that said, i was wondering how to best go about tuning for mileage. i understand upgraded injectors are going to treat my fuel like cristal at a hip hop afterparty, so i was curious if a double-injector rail could be used to keep a stock injector for normal use, and secondary injectors for supplementary use.

-displacement on demand was available on more recent LSx motors, but only for automatics. i don't know anything about it, but is it possible to have that with a manual transmission? wouldn't mind only running on 4 cylinders in stop and go traffic to save gas.

-while the car is stripped, i was considering the idea of lightening the load as much as possible while keeping full interior trim. that doesn't leave much to remove, so i wish to ask the GRM gurus if it's a wise decision or a waste of money to replace flat structural surfaces and possibly some support structures with titanium, and replace non-load bearing surfaces with carbon fiber (like the fenders, rear quarter panels, hood, trunk, etc).

-i plan on running 17x9 advan RS wheels, probably 245/40 like the top fuel sol. i run into two problems - fenders need flaring and tubs need to be banged out/replaced. i don't honestly know if spacing the wheels out to make them fit is a great idea, so how would you guys address the inner wheel well issue? for the front fender flares...how to do it without looking rice? looking at exotics, i noticed their front fenders are usually almost flat up top, curving down further out. looking to maybe imitate that, but don't know how exactly.

-i was considering adding a WORKING wing down the line, but while the car's getting cut up i may as well do it off the bat. i had an idea to do a super gt-style wing, low to the trunk but mounted to the floor of the trunk/rear of the car instead of just bolted to the trunk. the wing portion's support bars would be separated though, and locked into place with a custom trunk release that would release the wing from the part of the wing's braces attached to the car itself, so i can still get into the trunk. it's still gotta be a daily, after all. i know it sounds confusing, but a quick google of super gt cars should clear it up.

-clutchsmoke mentioned an electric cutout for the exhaust. i was planning on figuring out how vacuum line-based systems work, so it's more transparent. anybody have experience with either?

-lastly, nyc changed the laws for 2012. i only have to pass a visual and safety inspection for a 93. so if that colored anyone's ideas on how to go about things...it's been taken out of the equation

Wally
Wally SuperDork
2/17/12 8:31 a.m.

Would one of the front drive LS motors from the Impala fit with the G6 six speed transaxle in the back? If you going to be doing some cutting anyway that seems like if would make a fun little car.

Rymel
Rymel New Reader
2/17/12 8:38 a.m.

I had considered an LS4 swap in the rear, but ultimately I quite enjoy having a removable top, and it goes in the trunk. And decent trunk space for grocery getting and road trips. So engine's gotta stay in the front

Rymel
Rymel New Reader
2/20/12 4:53 p.m.

nothing?

internetautomart
internetautomart SuperDork
2/20/12 5:17 p.m.

i didn't see anyone else mention it so i will. it is not a t-top car, it is a targa top.

that being said, any crazy swap is a good thing around these parts.
My dad owns what is probably the rustiest Del sol that is daily driven, rust holes filled with "Great Stuff". Mechaniclly it's fine. it is also rolling on chevy cobalt wheels because the PO worked at a chevy dealer and got the wheels and tires cheap (I assume). he's overheated it 2-3 times

back on topic.

do the swap and post pics!

unevolved
unevolved Dork
2/20/12 8:13 p.m.

I think it's time to make a decision on powertrain and pull the trigger.

iceracer
iceracer SuperDork
2/21/12 9:15 a.m.

Del Sols can be made to run fast.
At our one mile speed run , one as clocked/radar at 111 mph.
Highly modified 1.6.

DaveEstey
DaveEstey Dork
2/21/12 9:55 a.m.

You are going to lose some trunk space due to the rear diff but get cutting and post pictures!

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