Tell me how stupid I am (I bought a Prius)

Armitage wrote: This seems like a smart move, especially for the price. I have some regret about having bought a commuter that gets 12 mpg and requires premium. With an older model like this, are there any expensive battery replacements/other maintenance that you'll have to do in the near term?

Well, you especially (or anyone else in D.C. area) should consider one more, as Clean Special Fuel plates give you HOV2 access.

1st gen concerns:

• Batteries more likely to fail. Still usually a 200-250k item on most models. Can be refurbished with Gen2 cells for around $800-1000. I've planned on having to deal with this in the next 5 years.
• Steering rack torque sensor failure. You need to replace the whole rack. This is EXPENSIVE if you get a rack from Toyota. Refurb aftermarkets are around $700. Its under warranty from Toyota until Dec. 2013. The warranty has been extended many times, but not sure it will be extended again.
• I've read about a few other potential issues here and there, but nothing alarming.

Were I to recommend one to others, I'd recommend the 2nd gen. There is a reason they sell for almost double the price with the same mileage and nearly the same age. They are bigger, more powerful, get better mileage, and are more practical (the hatch on the Gen2 is BIG). Also, there are about 20x as many in the US as Gen1, meaning more forum support, more aftermarket support, etc. There are tons of examples of these rolling around with 300-600k miles on them.

The Gen3 isn't very GRM priced at all (yet), but is significantly more powerful. It also has some really nice features in the interior.

To each his own but I would rather take the mileage hit and drive something that I consider a more fun car. Lifes to short for me to drive something I don't consider exciting. Any econobox falls into that category to me, so I'm not just picking on Prius. Saving a couple bucks at the gas pump is not enough incentive for me.

Edit; I do want a yugo, but for some unknown reason those excite me.

I'm with ProDarwin...the 1st gen isn't necessarily a stupid purchase, but the 2nd (and newer) generation Prius is a SIGNIFICANTLY better car in my opinion. They just keep getting better. I don't care for the Prius (especially the first gen), but they're a fantastic appliance.

I believe the Toyota and "two-mode" (GM, BMW, Chrysler) hybrids have the lowest battery-related risk of any cars so far. Their NiMH prismatic cells are extremely easy to replace (danger, HIGH VOLTAGE) and there's more of them available from wrecked cars in the yard than any others due to tons of Prius sales in the US. The first gen Prius can use second gen Prius cells with some minor mods. The Tahoe/Escalade hybrid use the same cells as a Prius. These cells are used conservatively and are pretty damn robust compared to the cylindrical ones like Honda and Ford used, plus they're easier to service and replace.

Those that hate the Prius either haven't driven one or don't enjoy trying to maximize fuel economy. If you get good at it, you can get some really awesome fuel economy out of a Prius (particularly for being a big hatchback), especially the newest ones. Last time I had one as a rental car I drove north of LA on the PCH and had a really fun time pushing almost 60 MPG on the beautiful rolling hills following the coastline. I was wishing I had an EV, but that wasn't an option from the rental company.

Bryce

some day I will build - and daily drive - a prius/leaf powered green car similar to this (although I'd settle for this as a body style)

ProDarwin wrote: Well, you especially (or anyone else in D.C. area) should consider one more, as Clean Special Fuel plates give you HOV2 access.

I've always taken issue to those VA tags on Prii. Whenever I see one on a gasoline powered car I shake my fist and proclaim, "there's nothing clean or special about your fuel!!!". I had considered getting "UN-PRIUS" plates for the FD ;P

Nashco wrote: Those that hate the Prius either haven't driven one or don't enjoy trying to maximize fuel economy.

I have driven a second gen and there was nothing enjoyable about it, either driving it or trying to maximize fuel economy.

If the 4wd ones were out I would be driving one right now. As it is I want to replace the wife's Forester and I am not sure I want to wait so we may end up with something else in the interim.

93EXCivic wrote:

Nashco wrote: Those that hate the Prius either haven't driven one or don't enjoy trying to maximize fuel economy.

I have driven a second gen and there was nothing enjoyable about it, either driving it or trying to maximize fuel economy.

This. I enjoy maximizing fuel economy on my dailies. The Prius damn near put me to sleep while driving it. It reminded me of a late 90's Buick in every way.

I want to combine a prius and a 73 Saab sonnet 3

Personally, I'd rather have the Hyundai 2.0CRDi over here in the Elantra. Roomy small car, 55mpg and none of the VW issues. Being a ginger, sunburn from CEL is a real concern.

93EXCivic wrote:

Nashco wrote: Those that hate the Prius either haven't driven one or don't enjoy trying to maximize fuel economy.

I have driven a second gen and there was nothing enjoyable about it, either driving it or trying to maximize fuel economy.

Do you enjoy trying to maximize fuel economy on any car...? Because hybrids have much greater potential for difference between good driver and bad driver than non-hybrids do, which rewards those who enjoy "playing the game" with their habits. Therefore, if you enjoy trying to maximize fuel economy ("playing the game") then I would expect you would enjoy driving the Prius as it is a good tool for playing the game. I enjoyed driving my first gen Insight MUCH more than any Prius, but the actual hybrid system was far less capable than a newer Prius.

Bryce

In reply to Nashco:

Not really. I honestly have never even calculated the MPG my Civic gets. I just drive until I need more fuel then put it in.

I want these engines in the US: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyundai_R_engine

Stuff that 2.2 into the new Sonata, 60mpg, 322ft/lbs. Where's the problem?

can anyone comment on the differences between the 2nd and 3rd gen? anything significant enough to warrant the extra cash?

Armitage wrote: I've always taken issue to those VA tags on Prii. Whenever I see one on a gasoline powered car I shake my fist and proclaim, "there's nothing clean or special about your fuel!!!". I had considered getting "UN-PRIUS" plates for the FD ;P

Yeah, but blame bureaucracy, not the Prii owners. They are just smart enough to take advantage of it :)

nicksta43 wrote: To each his own but I would rather take the mileage hit and drive something that I consider a more fun car. Lifes to short for me to drive something I don't consider exciting. Any econobox falls into that category to me, so I'm not just picking on Prius. Saving a couple bucks at the gas pump is not enough incentive for me.

Yeah, I think a lot of people on here share this opinion. It's one I respect, especially if those spouting it are driving something truly unique to work. I often find those with that opinion are driving something equally boring, but far less fiscally responsible like a 3rd Gen Maxima.

I am of the opinion that:

A) Any car I drive is going to be boring when sitting at a stoplight or putting along at 35mph behind the appliance in front of me. There is a reason I rarely drive my STR Miata to work, and rarely drove my S2000 to work. Actually, as far as making a boring commute exciting, I believe the Prius does a better job than others by turning economy into a game of sorts.

B) I'd rather have a low cost of ownership appliance and an expensive racecar/early retirement/more money for other hobbies I enjoy.

I'd rock a prius for a DD. Nice purchase!

I did see that Dorman makes battery cells for these now, although I think they are refurbished instead of new.

I offset our Prius with an RX7 racecar and a diesel F-250. Save fuel in one place to burn in another.

Spoolpigeon wrote: I'd rock a prius for a DD. Nice purchase! I did see that Dorman makes battery cells for these now, although I think they are refurbished instead of new.

They recently acquired a company in the NC, the owner of which posts on Prius forums. Apparently pretty reputable, so its good to know.

http://priuschat.com/threads/dorman-products-acquires-re-involt-technologies.132981/

Battery is still of low concern to me. I trust it more than I trust the engine/transmission in most cars. In CA the battery carries a mandatory 150k warranty.

my wife has a second gen Prius. I'll echo what others have said, the seats could be more comfortable. It is not thrilling car to drive. Its a quiet, efficient transportation appliance. It does what does quite well. And I like it for that reason.

I'm not a personal fan of the Prius, but I can absolutely see its' value for those whose life fit its' strength. For stop and go driving that's reliable, they're tough to beat. It's a bit unfair to critize them for being "boring", they weren't designed as sports cars. Isn't that like criticizing an Exocet for being breezy? They were designed to be the ultimate in town commuter appliance (uh...the Prius, not the Exocet ), and accomplish that job damn well.

If you don't like the fuel mileage game, then it also would bore you. While I enjoy spirited driving a lot too, I have fun trying to "play the game" with my Leaf and get the most from one charge that I can. It's fun in it's own way.

My brother spent a lot of money on his hybrid fusion to get 45-50mpg. He also got a very nice car.

My little saturn gets close to 32-40 for $1000, and has a ton more "character"

Personally, I just pretend my Corolla is an Elise and deal with the ~32mpg that yields.

Around here a Prius is more likely to be driven by someone who doesnt like driving or cars. Much more likely to change lanes , cut u off or otherwise drive erraticly in traffic around you. I tend to give them wide berths in traffic. Much worse drivers than Chrysler mini-van drivers imo.

This thread is cracking me up!

gofastbobby wrote: My brother spent a lot of money on his hybrid fusion to get 45-50mpg. He also got a very nice car. My little saturn gets close to 32-40 for $1000, and has a ton more "character"

Yeah, but his Fusion comes with a warranty and doesn't burn a quart of oil for every tank of gas. By "character" do you mean puke resin and cheerios under the back seat, a broken tape deck, and a funny rattle sound every time you go over a bump and turn left? Because that's the only character the last SC2 I drove had.

whenry wrote: Around here a Prius is more likely to be driven by someone who doesnt like driving or cars. Much more likely to change lanes , cut u off or otherwise drive erraticly in traffic around you. I tend to give them wide berths in traffic. Much worse drivers than Chrysler mini-van drivers imo.

Wait, so you're saying Chrysler Town and Country drivers like driving and like cars?

Bryce

I have nothing in particular against Priuses "the cars"

I do hate Prius "the culture" where local a-holes think they can hypermile at 56mph in the left lane of the beltway here when the rest of traffic is going around them to the right at 80mph or backing up for a mile behind.

So, drive like you're not driving a Prius, and I have no complaints....