Time for tires . . . again

Rodan said:

A while back, I spoke with TireRack about temperature tolerance with the ECS vs. PS4S.  They were hesitant to speak in absolutes, but said they had more reported problems with the PS4S in near freezing temps than with ECS, but recommended neither be driven under those conditions.

FWIW, we ran Yoko S.Drives on the wife's former daily, an NC3 Miata.  They were extremely tolerant of low temps and wet weather.  Good enough that I left them on year 'round (though they weren't driven in snow).  Here in the AZ mountains, we get plenty of cold (overnights/mornings in the teens), but not a great deal of rain/snow.

Sounds about right.  Don't run below 45 is a pretty common generic recommendation for summers due to potential reduced grip.  Damaging temps are lower, although it varies by tire.  Less aggressive summers usually (but not always) tolerate colder temps without damage than more aggressive tires.  The recommendations are usually tailored for the lowest common denominator, much like "better tires can only go on the rear"

I wasn't necessarily suggesting that the ECS is as good as the PS4S, only that it's in the same league for less cost. I run the ECS on my One Lap car because I always go through one set in testing and another set for the event and frankly I'm not shooting for any sort of win. I find that the grip delta between wet and dry is narrower than a lot of other tires which means I don't have to recalibrate quite as much for wet tracks. 

With all of that said, my wife's ND is on a fresh set of PS4S because they're just better and that car isn't grinding money to dust on track. If you're getting 30k+ miles out of them, I think they're absolutely worth it. It's only when you're getting 10k or less due to shenanigans that you start to question whether or not that little bit of extra gip is worth the money. 

mr2s2000elise said:

... wife's DD. 245 front, 285s rear

your wife must have a cool car...

759NRNG said:

BFG  G-force sport comp 2 A/S   on my second set .....quiet , great in the rain and got over 35k on the 'V'....way better than anything I've had from BiBB....

That's what I have on the 128i now. Staggered setup, and the rears are down to nothing after ~20k miles. When I checked Tire Rack, some sizes seem to be in limited stock, which makes me wonder if they're being phased out. I like them, but I'm not inclined to buy tires that may be soon discontinued.

As much as I love the ECS for its audible feedback and wet handling, the Indy 500 still grips harder in the dry, gets better fuel economy and changes directions eagerly. If you're looking for overall composure the ECS is the better pick, but if you're chasing grins in a 340tw package the Indy 500s are hard to beat for the money.

In reply to AngryCorvair :

Yes she does 

G_Body_Man said:

As much as I love the ECS for its audible feedback and wet handling, the Indy 500 still grips harder in the dry, gets better fuel economy and changes directions eagerly. If you're looking for overall composure the ECS is the better pick, but if you're chasing grins in a 340tw package the Indy 500s are hard to beat for the money.

Good point on the fuel economy.  The ECS seem to be almost as draggy as a slightly narrower set of Blizzaks in my experience.  

I pulled the trigger on a set of Federal Evoluzion ST-1 @ $384 shipped. All of the reviews I've read about them came back positive especially from folks that used them for DD duty.  Got them mounted up on last Thursday. ~$88 to mount, balance, and install. Even with the mold release junk on it and low temps (35ish degrees Thursday night), they felt pretty good. It is much quieter. I bombed a few off-ramps for the last week and it works very well for DD duties. I got to run it in rain to grab some pre-Xmas groceries. It was high 30s to low 40s. The tires performed really well. They gripped up really well on the off ramps and on the interstate. They were well mannered in these low temps and wet weather.

The con thus far? They "flat spot" after sitting overnight in the cold.  So they thump a bit for a few miles. Also, I found the sidewalls not as stiff as MPSS. Neither of these are show stoppers . . .

Cool, glad you like them so far. Always interesting to hear about tires like these.

Almost a year later . . . Federal Evoluzion ST-1 are still awesome. I think I have about 7000ish miles on it and it can't find any faults for the price I paid for them. They handle well in the rain and perform decently in the cold. I'm going to get another set for one of my other cars.

Floating Doc said:

mazdeuce - Seth said:

The Continental ECS is considered the poor man's PS4S in many circles. 

And the Firestone Firehawk 500 is the poor man's ECS.

I just bought a set of the latter. Like them a lot.

Edit: I'm not sure I was clear. I bought a set of the Firestone Indy 500. The more I drive on them, the more I like them. 

In my size the Indy 500 is only $9 a tire cheaper than ECS on TireRack. So more for bean counters than the poor man

GCrites80s said:

Floating Doc said:

mazdeuce - Seth said:

The Continental ECS is considered the poor man's PS4S in many circles. 

And the Firestone Firehawk 500 is the poor man's ECS.

I just bought a set of the latter. Like them a lot.

Edit: I'm not sure I was clear. I bought a set of the Firestone Indy 500. The more I drive on them, the more I like them. 

In my size the Indy 500 is only $9 a tire cheaper than ECS on TireRack. So more for bean counters than the poor man

The original sentiment was true a year ago when it was posted, since then indy 500s have gotten more expensive across the board (in my size they cost 20% more now than I paid at the beginning of last year) such that the only reason I see picking them over ecs is if there's any difference in size availability.

Kind unusual for a 4.5 year old tire to increase in price. I wonder if it's product shortage, or is it simply that there's a critical mass of people who recognize what a good product it is?

That is indeed interesting.

We've had some Continentals on our cars in the past that were all-seasons and Touring tires. They got hard fast -- within two years on cars stored outside. Is that an issue with their performance tires too, such as the ECS?