You know, that same issue could be here on my desk. My desk needs a bit of cleaning, though. Thanks for posting the issue info.
You know, that same issue could be here on my desk. My desk needs a bit of cleaning, though. Thanks for posting the issue info.
Thanx David for the kind words. I get tired of people trying to tell me what Grassroots is. Many say that any new car isn't grassroots enough, but for some it is. Many people don't have the time, money, place, skills to build a car from scratch so they have to shop for a new/almost new performance deal that they can modify and express their individuality.
Modifying rather than starting from scratch seems to me to be the ultimate grassroots. It's a lot easier and faster than building your own. You can buy your car and immediately get it on a track and begin having fun. No, it doesn't have the WOW factor of an LS7 powered RX7, but it does stock the autocross courses and DE days and I'd rather see a full field of guys out there having fun on a budget in the DD than sittin' on the sidelines watching a few specialty cars.
Doin' it NOW in a car that many might not think of as a race car seems to be grassrooty to me. And anyway how many people would be out there competing and having fun if they had to have a dedicated race car or have a car that is more race than street?
Should be titled "I'm tired of driving an old P.O.S.", or "My justification for buying a newer car".
I'd still be grassroots if I was a billionaire - I'd get a Caparo T1 
All the breakdowns, discomfort, tweakability and posh supercar asswhoopery you could ever want! 
If you are feeling guilty, just weld some tow hooks up underneath or something so you can still point to them as evidence when telling stories at the Balla cocktail parties your shiney new car is sure to get you invited to.
NYG95GA wrote:Will wrote: So if I understand you correctly, anyone who takes a new, 2009 Mustang to an autocross, drag strip or track day is not grassroots because that car costs $27,000. Is that actually what you're saying?Uh, yeah. Grassroots is about taking a car and putting it together for a tenth of that price, and beating the stink out of the newer car, both on the strip and the track. Extra bonus points if it looks good as well. You're new; hang around and read.. you'll learn.
We'll just have to disagree, but as far as I'm concerned, filling up my back seat with Hoosiers and filling the trunk with tools, driving across state lines for an event and working on the car myself instead of taking it to the dealer is just as grassroots as trailering a $2600 Miata with a $20,000 tow rig. I too believe grassroots is more in the attitude than the price tag. If I treat the car grassroots, then it's grassroots. I agree there's a price limit somewhere, but deciding that a new S2000, Evo, STI, 350Z, Solstice, GTI, Mustang or even Miata can't be grassroots is going too far for me.
an '05 caddy wouldnt be my first choise for grassroots, but the fact that it is a car that can hual some ass and the fact that he bought it used for about half of the sticker only 3 years later is nothing to sneeze at. how is it any worse than getting a deal on a used BMW?
I have to side with Will on this. I recently passed on a CTS-V which means I am a little jealous of him. Stupid future house ruining all my fun.
Will wrote:NYG95GA wrote:We'll just have to disagree, but as far as I'm concerned, filling up my back seat with Hoosiers and filling the trunk with tools, driving across state lines for an event and working on the car myself.... blah, blah, blahWill wrote: So if I understand you correctly, anyone who takes a new, 2009 Mustang to an autocross, drag strip or track day is not grassroots because that car costs $27,000. Is that actually what you're saying?Uh, yeah. Grassroots is about taking a car and putting it together for a tenth of that price, and beating the stink out of the newer car, both on the strip and the track. Extra bonus points if it looks good as well. You're new; hang around and read.. you'll learn.
You don't get to make up your own definitions or the whole language will break down and no one will be able to communicate. Then we will all be living in caves throwing feces at each other. I for one am not fond of feces throwing so I'll settle this once and for all.
From the wiki which is stealing from the dictionary:
A grassroots movement (often referenced in the context of a political movement) is one driven by the constituents of a community. The term implies that the creation of the movement and the group supporting it is natural and spontaneous, highlighting the differences between this and a movement that is orchestrated by traditional power structures. Often, grassroots movements are at the local level, as many volunteers in the community give their time to support the local party, which can lead to helping the national party. For instance, a grassroots movement can lead to significant voter registration for a political party, which in turn helps the state and national parties.
The big thing in Grassroots is starting bottom up.
Mostly this means some guy goes out makes race/track/autocross car. This is in stark contrast with a major manufactuer making a race car and then sponsoring a driver to drive it.
Grassroost is all about coming up from bottom (price point not that important) vs being a big corporate thing. Hey there are plenty of Grassroots types even at Daytona 24 hrs. Many there scrape together cash and put a race team together to compete along side the big budget pro teams. These guys are probably the top run of grassroots racing as going farther starts taking on alot more work. Bigger money sponsors, dedicated employess and large race teams, manufacturer support, and paid drivers.
Honestly, If I had ANY more money thatn I do right now, I would become an elitest Snob and leave all you grasroots punks behind.....
but really, that isn't going to happen...I have my 5 speed RWD vehicle, it is justa pick up truck, that's all.....
Grassroots is using your car for fun not for profit. Taking the family ride out for an autocross, track day, or cruise through the mountains. Doing a few mods to make it drive better, washing on weekends because you can, and understanding what makes a car more than an appliance.
Grassroots is not exclusively building some engine swapped monster out of a toaster, a spool of wires, a can of liquid something you found in the corner of your garage, and a trunkload of Puegot parts you found at the junkyard, it can also be simply loading up a set of tires and taking your newish car out to play. Grassroots is for everyone!
i guess im more grass seed, than grass roots...my current project was started by removing the vegetation and evicting wildlife from it...
Carson wrote: It's the Aug 08 issue, page 32. This issue just happens to be on my desk, I didn't go searching for it or anything.
I thought I was the only guy who kept the latest 3 or 4 issues stacked on my desk...along with SportsCar and NAP...
My definition of GR: Running what you have. Be it some Korean econobox, RWD V8 powerhouse or whatever. . . . if it's what you have, it's what you run.
924guy wrote: i guess im more grass seed, than grass roots...my current project was started by removing the vegetation and evicting wildlife from it...
Tell me about it! My latest acquisition ('91 MR2) is still covered in a nice layer of topsoil (and actual grass roots.) I've counted 8 different species of creepy crawlers, alive and well, in it and I've only had it home since Tuesday.
The guy at the parts counter just looked at me when I asked for a part for a '91 Toyota Terrarium.
My supercharged E46 m3 is grassroots.
joepaluch wrote: The big thing in Grassroots is starting bottom up. Mostly this means some guy goes out makes race/track/autocross car. This is in stark contrast with a major manufactuer making a race car and then sponsoring a driver to drive it.
Quoted for truthiness! I'm going to add this to my current definition of GR:
A private individual/group making the most of the limited resources at their disposal to participate in Motorsports.
In general, the most limited resources are: money, time, space, tools, and skill.
Edit: In short, regular folks making the most of what they got.
The horse E36 M3 here is very deep. Grassroots Motorsports Magazine has jumped the shark. Please note the date.
I just found a couple cts-v's on CL for around 20k that's what I'd be able to afford with out the Family lol 
ManofFewWords wrote: The horse E36 M3 here is very deep. Grassroots Motorsports Magazine has jumped the shark. Please note the date.
Did we at least jump it on a budget with a slightly older car, taking some measure of enjoyment out of the fact that we jumped every bit as fast and far as a professionally-built brand-new entry that cost more?
What's the best used car for shark jumping? Probably an Amphicar, but those are kind of rare, and they don't have much power. I wonder what would be a good engine swap; or maybe we could MegaSquirt that sucker and scrounge the junkyards for a DSM or Volvo turbo.
Tom and I were just talking about the infinite definitions that get applied to the term "grassroots." It's like driving; everyone who's going slower than me is a frustrating obstacle, everyone who's going faster is a psychotic maniac. My definition must be juuuust right.
As I see it, every car that has ever turned a lap at any sporting venue, from autocross and rallycross to HPDEs and races, is a pretty cool car. Some cost more than others. Some don't cater to my personal tastes. Some strike me as hairy death traps that you couldn't pay me to ride in. But the guy behind the wheel of his car is getting the same enjoyment out of their car as I get out of mine, and I can relate to that.
In reply to Scott Lear:
Nope Scott, you are completely wrong and I am right. End of story
Sharks don't jump unless they are attacking seals....is he calling us a seal? If so it looks like I'm due for a smoking hot wife!
I've haven't seen a shark yet, but I'll hop a gator next time I get the chance.
Joe Gearin wrote: In reply to Scott Lear: Nope Scott, you are completely wrong and I am right. End of story Sharks don't jump unless they are attacking seals....is he calling us a seal? If so it looks like I'm due for a smoking hot wife!
Just because Scott is wrong (and he is) doesn't make you right. In no sense of the word are you right. That's why I love you.
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