https://jalopnik.com/dead-volkswagen-gti-manual-and-volkswagen-golf-r-manua-1850787032
Volkswagen sent out a press release this morning about the 2024 Golf GTI 380 Edition. It contains the biggest “oh, by the way” in the history of enthusiast cars: that the 380 is being built to celebrate the end of the manual transmission in the GTI and Golf R.
Booooo!!!!!!!
Were you going to buy one? The DCT in those cars are awesome.
z31maniac said:Were you going to buy one? The DCT in those cars are awesome.
I get that, but for the most iconic hot hatch in history to go automatic-only is a damn shame.
z31maniac said:Were you going to buy one? The DCT in those cars are awesome.
No... but I wasn't going to buy a DCT version either.
Guess I will keep my mk6 R 6spd forever then.
Dumb.
Will this be also in Europe ?
And only GTI / Golf R or will it be all models in a few years ?
Tom_Spangler (Forum Supporter) said:z31maniac said:Were you going to buy one? The DCT in those cars are awesome.
I get that, but for the most iconic hot hatch in history to go automatic-only is a damn shame.
The new Golfs are a bit too crossovery to be a hot hatch 
Thats a bummer, Im on my 6th VW with a clutch pedal. Guess that run is coming to an end soon...
Chalk it up to the laziness of people everywhere wanting to have computers or other people make all of their decisions for them in a mindless stamper through life.
That's an interesting decision given that the 6MT take rate here was 50%+
Tom_Spangler (Forum Supporter) said:z31maniac said:Were you going to buy one? The DCT in those cars are awesome.
I get that, but for the most iconic hot hatch in history to go automatic-only is a damn shame.
Sorry I just get annoyed about folks complaining about stuff they never intended on buying.
docwyte said:That's an interesting decision given that the 6MT take rate here was 50%+
The article gives this as the reason:
The manual Golf apparently emits 162g/km of CO2 to the automatic’s 160g/km, which was enough to get it cancelled in the name of manufacturer fleet emissions quotas that apply in Europe.
I then assume the only way to get the GTI powertrain with a stick post 2024 is in the GLI? And I can't imagine that will be long-term as well...
Old_Town said:I then assume the only way to get the GTI powertrain with a stick post 2024 is in the GLI? And I can't imagine that will be long-term as well...
Is the GLI the same underneath? It used to be that the GTI got IRS and the GLI got the beam IIRC. Also, isnt the GLI on a longer wheelbase/slightly different chassis? I know I am nitpicking, but Ive always been a GTI-guy for little reasons, and one big one (hatch).
I own a Mk7 GTI manual. While I actually prefer the DSG for both normal and sporty driving, there are two reasons I got the manual:
1) DSG fluid service is every 40,000 miles with expensive fluid, manual is every 100,000 miles.
2) You can tow with a manual. I tow all the time.
Fine, I'll say it....
Good. The DSG cars are faster, stronger and more reliable. This just means finding your next project car will be easier, as the used market won't be littered with manual cars.
Tom Suddard said:Fine, I'll say it....
Good. The DSG cars are faster, stronger and more reliable. This just means finding your next project car will be easier, as the used market won't be littered with manual cars.
When you say this it leads me to believe you think the Olive Garden serves Italian food. LOL
Manuals are about the experience. Much like the aforementioned chain restaurant; which may well be faster, more widely available and charge half the price of a real Italian restaurant, the DSG experience does not bring as much joy as the manual does.
Most people are buying an enthusiast car for the joy it brings.
I may run a car with a CVT but I'm the first to admit I enjoy going up and down through the box more than I do the extra six tenths faster the F500 is with a CVT.
(PS also stop eating a t Taco Bell; it's nasty and there are proper taquerias everywhere).
Over the last 20 years manufacturers have given us more power, handling, efficiency, and creature comforts than we ever would have imagined possible. Not having a stickshift or hydraulic power steering seems like a reasonable trade.
ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) said:Over the last 20 years manufacturers have given us more power, handling, efficiency, and creature comforts than we ever would have imagined possible. Not having a stickshift or hydraulic power steering seems like a reasonable trade.
Heresy.............................you shall be forced to drive a two stroke Saab to work for the next three weeks.
Tom Suddard said:Fine, I'll say it....
Good. The DSG cars are faster, stronger and more reliable. This just means finding your next project car will be easier, as the used market won't be littered with manual cars.
Didn't you say in one of the GRM Porject Car posts that your DSG GTI will sometimes upshift or downshift on track without the driver telling it to? Seems like that should be a non-starter in a performance car. Let me hit the Rev Limiter if I want to.
ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) said:Over the last 20 years manufacturers have given us more power, handling, efficiency, and creature comforts than we ever would have imagined possible. Not having a stickshift or hydraulic power steering seems like a reasonable trade.
I should note that neither my GTI nor my built-up-to-GTI-spec Golf had hydraulic power steering.
Because they were light enough (1900lb, 2200lb) to not NEED power steering.
("built up to GTI spec" = it had the larger front bar installed, and the solid 9.4 rotors swapped for vented. You could still buy 100hp 8v GTIs in the late 80s, The GTI also had shorter gearing, but I liked the 42mpg that the 3.67:1 GL transmission got)
I don't mind automatics, ABS, etc, but manual steering is my personal hill, and this requires light weight and narrow tires. Well, narrow by modern standards. 185/60s were fat hoops at the time. Lose that wonderful steering feel, and everything else is a case of "eh, while you're compromising things, might as well do X and Y and Z".
Tom_Spangler (Forum Supporter) said:The article gives this as the reason:
The manual Golf apparently emits 162g/km of CO2 to the automatic’s 160g/km, which was enough to get it cancelled in the name of manufacturer fleet emissions quotas that apply in Europe.
My snide comment...
Paraphrasing the above, "we can teach the DCT to cheat a result of 160g/km but we can't get the manual to cheat the same answer."
John Welsh said:Tom_Spangler (Forum Supporter) said:The article gives this as the reason:
The manual Golf apparently emits 162g/km of CO2 to the automatic’s 160g/km, which was enough to get it cancelled in the name of manufacturer fleet emissions quotas that apply in Europe.
My snide comment...
Paraphrasing the above, "we can teach the DCT to cheat a result of 160g/km but we can't get the manual to cheat the same answer."
Ooooooo, good point. One of the things I liked about European automatics is that, unlike American automatics, they were calibrated for the driving experience and not a good number on the CAFE test loop.
I wonder if this will change.
CrashDummy said:Tom Suddard said:Fine, I'll say it....
Good. The DSG cars are faster, stronger and more reliable. This just means finding your next project car will be easier, as the used market won't be littered with manual cars.
Didn't you say in one of the GRM Porject Car posts that your DSG GTI will sometimes upshift or downshift on track without the driver telling it to? Seems like that should be a non-starter in a performance car. Let me hit the Rev Limiter if I want to.
It can be a little finicky, but it's pretty easy to learn to drive with. And the data traces don't lie: shifts are so, so, so much faster. Plus there's no risk of money shifting it, and I didn't need to pull the transmission and upgrade the clutch when I tuned the car.
My comment "good" was slightly in jest, and I am sad to see fewer manual transmissions in the world, but having driven and raced with both transmissions in GTIs, the DSG is the better tool for the job.
docwyte said:That's an interesting decision given that the 6MT take rate here was 50%+
50%... of a very tiny sub-group of the buying public. Pretty sure that if 50% of the buying public wanted manual transmissions, we'd still have them.
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