What Car? Bench Seat Edition

My first car was an 80's Buick. It's 2.8 liters of (some) power were great at being cheap and running (most of the time). It was a plain silver car that looked like most everything else from GM at that time. I feel like the bench seat and column shifter is the perfect set up for a boring highway commute. I have a project with a bench seat and column shifter but I'd like to appreciate this throwback on my daily empty highway commute.

1.) Budget of $3k

2.) Built in the last 20 years. I would accept older but I live in Massachusetts and anything cheap and old will be infested with tin worms.

3.) Mid-size is preferable to full size. Crown Vic would be the easy button if I go full size.

4.) My commute is 65% highway at 75mph, 30% at 65mph. So a highway fuel economy rating of at least 25mpg would be acceptable, the higher the better.

5.) 4 door car or wagon, no trucks.

I recently found out that base model Toyota Avalons (94-04?) came with a bench seat. Kind of a Japanese Buick, full size but 2 feet shorter than a Crown Vic. I would love a wagon but I think the only option there is a lower trim Taurus/Sable wagon, also a full size. The last of these wagons (with the 2 valve V6) were only rated for 23mpg hwy. There is the obvious I could add a bench seat but the shifter would need to be moved and the console has other electronics. It would just make it another project I don't need to take on.

Impala's built to 05 with a 3.4 V6 were originally rated for 32mpg (now derated to 29), which is surprisingly good. A little bigger than I would want but if they actually squeeze out that kind of mpg with that size, I might take it. Malibu's were smaller but I don't think they came with a bench. They did come with a hatch option which is interesting and almost make them a wagon.

What good options am I missing?

I'd avoid the Impala unless you like doing lower intake manifold gaskets.

The Avalons are pretty good, but you have to fill up with premium all the time unless you want to be re-wiring knock sensors every year or so.

I'd go for an 03+ Mercury Grand Marquis with the 2.73 axle ratio. Not the fastest, not the most efficient, but when it comes to ease of ownership it's the most effortless of the three.

I will guarantee that the Avalon we have in our pool car fleet at work drinks the cheapest gas available and still runs great with over 100k miles on it .... and without re-wiring anything.

F-I-L has an Impala with 1/4 million miles on it. Bought it brand new, never did anything other than basic maintenance. It still averages nearly 30 mpg on long drives.

I'm over the Panther-love. They're kinda terrible cars. And they never get 25 mpg. Everyone on the internets swears they do, but they're lying, or bad at math, or both. My grandfather had a 2010 MGM and on the highway trips I took it on, I would see 22 or 23 mpg. And it wasn't that comfortable. The Impala is a superior car in just about every way. I'd shoot for one of the 2012-14 MY ones with the 300 horse engine. Dealers have them now for about $12g. That's a LOT of car for the money. I'm sure you can find some private party ones cheaper.

Here's something near you Not a 12-14 model, but closer to your budget.

Buick Park Ave or the lesser Buick LeSabre. As big as the Impala with all the comforts and the stout GM 3800 engine. Still gets surprisingly good mpg especially on the hyw.
Very good winter stability from this fwd'er turns to exceptional if you add winter tires like I did to a '97 LeSabre.

In reply to JohnRW1621:

+1 on this. Mom's had a bunch of these cars. They're very good at doing what they do. All got nearly 30 mpg highway.

JohnRW1621 wrote: Buick Park Ave or the lesser Buick LeSabre. As big as the Impala with all the comforts and the stout GM 3800 engine.

I'm pretty sure those are bigger - the Regal and Century were the Impala's platform mates with the W body, although they are a little smaller than an Impala. I was going to suggest a W body myself. Some do have intake manifold gasket issues, but they are good highway cars.

Yep, I would go with an early 2000's Buick. If you search hard enough, I'll bet you can find one bought new by someone who was 65 when they bought it and is now too old to drive it (or the family now owns it). It'll be low miles and probably dealer maintained. Not exactly your situation, but that's how we found our current minivan. It's a 2010 model which we bought in 2015. It had 17k miles when we got it, and was owned by someone who lived at a senior center and became too old to drive it. He had put less than 500 miles on it in the last 2 years he had it.

Speaking of minivans, did any of the early '00 Caravans come with bench seats?

Also, the 90-93 Oldsmobuick A-bodies (Cierra, Century) with the 3300 V6 were great cars. A little smaller, about comparable fuel economy, and pretty reliable. A friend of mine in the Albany, NY area only drives these- he finds little old grandma specials for about $1000, does all the maintenance on them, and drives them.

The 3800 seies 2 was also available in the impala. Its a much better, more reliable engine imo. If it were me I would definitely take the small loss in fuel economy to have 3800.

I'd say Crown Vic or Avalon if you insist on having a bench, you probably won't find 10+ year old GM stuff in MA that isn't at least starting to rot.

In reply to einy:

Funny, our 1MZ-equipped Sienna chewed through knock sensor connectors like nothing else on regular gas.

JohnRW1621 wrote: Buick Park Ave or the lesser Buick LeSabre. As big as the Impala with all the comforts and the stout GM 3800 engine. Still gets surprisingly good mpg especially on the hyw. Very good winter stability from this fwd'er turns to exceptional if you add winter tires like I did to a '97 LeSabre.

Bingo. The Impala has the bones, but the 3.4 isn't the best engine in the world in terms of reliability. The 3800, on the other hand, will run forever and the LeSabre/Park Ave and the later Lucerne will give you way more toys and comfort than the Impala while being reliable. The only reason I didn't pick one up was because you can't power-over initiate a Park Ave Ultra.

Take the easy button and buy a crown vic. Just about everything else id recomend is likely rusty at this point.

I know it should seem that the Century and the LeSabre are cut from the same cloth. I caution you that this is really not true. The Lesabre and the Park Ave are much better cars than the Century.
Most Centurys got on the road originally as either rental cars or fleet/salemen cars. Said another way, most Centurys were bought new by people who did not intend to drive the car themselves but rather bought it for other people to drive. Purchased more as a financial decision than a comfort decision. After one year, the rentals were sold cheap as lightly used cars and they appeared to be a good price value over the LeSabre. Time now has passed and the last Lesabre was 2005. Anymore the price delta to move up from a Century to a LeSabre is much smaller.

The LeSabre (and more so its chassis mate the Park Ave) is evidently built more to be a flagship model as opposed to the Centry which clearly feels built to a low price point.

Yes, the Park Ave Ultra gets you a supercharged 3800!

I think by the time the Lucenne name was introduced the bench seat had been done away with. The force behind the demise of the front bench was that in theory you could have a 3rd person in the front seat. The rules changed and that 3rd person now needed a shoulder belt (like you now see in standard cab pickups) but there was way to effectively add the 3rd shoulder belt.

G_Body_Man wrote: In reply to einy: Funny, our 1MZ-equipped Sienna chewed through knock sensor connectors like nothing else on regular gas.

Think about it. What would the octane number of the fuel have to do with the knock sensor connector?

I'd say there is something else going on there, unrelated to the octane level used.

I wouldn't so quickly dismiss a truck as an option, either. A Ranger or similar with a bench seat wouldn't make a bad little commuter. Heck, my dad commuted in a 6 cylinder full-size truck for 25 years. The fuel economy was OK, and he never had to drive when everyone wanted to go out for lunch.

I had a GMT400 with the 4.3, 2WD and a 5 speed stick, and that truck got 25 mpg all day long. The bench seat in that truck was surprisingly comfortable, too.

I didn't notice the mpg of the 3800 Impala but just looked it up and it's actually only 1mpg less than the 3400, totally worth it. I also didn't realize the Impala was actually on the same chassis as the Century/Regal cars in the early 2000's. There are a bunch of this era car with super low miles near me.

The 2009 Impala is just about in my price range but rare with a bench seat. I started thinking about bench seats more after reading that the 2012 Impala was the last car to have bench seats. So it was an option but I have yet to find one with it.

Caravan with front bench seat would be interesting. Don't think I've ever seen one of those.

volvoclearinghouse wrote: I wouldn't so quickly dismiss a truck as an option, either. A Ranger or similar with a bench seat wouldn't make a bad little commuter.

I rule it out because I already have a Ranger for a backup commuter. With the 2.3 Duratec and a 5 speed I knock down about 24 with snow tires and 27 in the summer on the highway. Good truck but the bed is starting to become more rust than steel.

volvoclearinghouse wrote: I had a GMT400 with the 4.3, 2WD and a 5 speed stick, and that truck got 25 mpg all day long. The bench seat in that truck was surprisingly comfortable, too.

This is pertinent to me for the rustiness mentioned above. Didn't think they would do that well on gas. Not to derail my own thread but was it a long or short bed? Was this the TBI or MPFI engine?

I like the idea of a Lesabre but the last Buick I had (92 Roadmaster) used an auto climate control system that was extremely annoying. All the photos I looked at of Lesabre's them the same looking climate control. I figure a lowly model Impala wouldn't have those but also a lot less of most everything else too, for better or worse.

EDIT: found a couple of photos without the climate control. I guess most Lesabres had it but not all. I love my knobs and dials.

ThingWithWheels wrote:

volvoclearinghouse wrote: I wouldn't so quickly dismiss a truck as an option, either. A Ranger or similar with a bench seat wouldn't make a bad little commuter.

I rule it out because I already have a Ranger for a backup commuter. With the 2.3 Duratec and a 5 speed I knock down about 24 with snow tires and 27 in the summer on the highway. Good truck but the bed is starting to become more rust than steel.

volvoclearinghouse wrote: I had a GMT400 with the 4.3, 2WD and a 5 speed stick, and that truck got 25 mpg all day long. The bench seat in that truck was surprisingly comfortable, too.

This is pertinent to me for the rustiness mentioned above. Didn't think they would do that well on gas. Not to derail my own thread but was it a long or short bed? Was this the TBI or MPFI engine?

Long bed. I've never owned a shortbox truck, I have strong personal beliefs on that topic. I don't recall the fuel injection type, it just ran and ran and ran and I never did a thing to it. If I had to guess, I think it was TBI (1995).

My brother has a '97 with 300k on the odometer, he's had the 4L60E overhauled once and did the intake manifold gasket at about 250k. Even driving it in upstate NY winters, it's nearly rust-free.

First Gen scion xb was available with a bench in Japan, if you can get the seat imported. I think the Nissan cube was as well.

oldopelguy wrote: First Gen scion xb was available with a bench in Japan, if you can get the seat imported. I think the Nissan cube was as well.

That opens up some options. It makes sense that Japanese cars would still be designed around 3 wide seating in the front. Not quite the old American bench seat and column shifter vein but definitely something to consider.