Currently I guess the daily would be the truck, but given I have seen the office in 13 months, I'm not sure I have a daily. My wife works very part time so her Nissan Rogue / Toaster Oven Appliance could serve that purpose.
Interesting discussion, many of you have had this same internal debate. Call it part of a mid-life crisis in my case questioning all the "norms", work, hobbies, the stuff I own, etc.
wake74 said:LanEvo said:I keep all of my cars street registered ... even the dedicated racecar. That way, I can take it out for an early Sunday drive to Bear Mountain, meet my car guy friends for burgers, or drive it to the shop for service. I'll even drive it to work maybe 1-2x a year just for the heck of it.
Makes the car feel like less of a burden and more of a fun toy to have around.
Thought about that as well, but that ship has sailed at least in the current county. I'd have to get a seriously look-the-other way inspector or the lack of emissions equipment, cats etc. Although I'm quite sure the current tune would pass as it has all readiness monitors permanently set to pass.
Is there a specific reason you want to go completely catless and remove all your emissions equipment? I imagine most cars drive just fine with emissions equipment on, and the power gained is not worth losing the streetability imo.
hunter47 said:wake74 said:LanEvo said:I keep all of my cars street registered ... even the dedicated racecar. That way, I can take it out for an early Sunday drive to Bear Mountain, meet my car guy friends for burgers, or drive it to the shop for service. I'll even drive it to work maybe 1-2x a year just for the heck of it.
Makes the car feel like less of a burden and more of a fun toy to have around.
Thought about that as well, but that ship has sailed at least in the current county. I'd have to get a seriously look-the-other way inspector or the lack of emissions equipment, cats etc. Although I'm quite sure the current tune would pass as it has all readiness monitors permanently set to pass.
Is there a specific reason you want to go completely catless and remove all your emissions equipment? I imagine most cars drive just fine with emissions equipment on, and the power gained is not worth losing the streetability imo.
All of that has been missing from the current dedicated track car for some time. The E36 isn't going to return back to streetable (at least not by me). It's stripped, no front window or regulators, no sound / heat insulation, no AC, no emissions, etc. When earlier I mentioned I went down the rabbit hole with the current car, I really went down the hole :-)
In reply to wake74 :
Ah, I understand the situation now.
So what you're really asking is if it makes sense to buy a streetable "track" car that you'll only use every now and then?
YOLO. If you have the cash, and it's not a problem, and if it's required, the proper security clearance with the wife, then I don't see why not. Sometimes we do irrational things for our enjoyment. Smiles/dollar, not miles/dollar. If you regret it, you could always sell it back and just eat the depreciation (if any).
wake74 said:NOHOME said:That is where my track driving days ended. After spending a few laps with an instructor, he told me that my driving was fine as far as it went, but that my imagination was way to good to ever be a fast driver. "No way to put disaster out of your mind should anything go wrong and you cant fix that". I did a few after as a social thing, but yeah, that killed it.
It's interesting. I understand the physics of driving a car at speed, read lots of books, can comfortable talk vehicle dynamics, predictable on track, etc. But an instructor once wrote in a review, that I need to drive with my butt more and with my head less. Maybe it's the engineer in me.
As an instructor I would totally disagree with driving with your butt, when someone tells me you feel what the car is doing via the seat of your pants I tell them " try the other end, it's faster". I view driving as a mental exercise.
As for dilemma; I think your thoughts on vintage racing may be good as the atmosphere is more laid back. I view it as a track day with open passing. I switched from SCCA to vintage 11 years ago.
As for the rabbit hole; it takes a lot of self discipline. There is also a sweat spot between the car being a burden and easy to own but not as fast. I've gone for ease of ownership.
I'm at a crossroads too.
I have my Mazda2 I've been tracking for the last 5 years 2-4x per year. Was a daily for much if that(not anymore).
Work pays for my fuel, so I can buy whatever truck I want without the MPG being a problem if I want to go the dedicated tow rig route... Though I'd need to get a trailer as well. (Currently use a 19 Escape for work).
But do I really want to spend a bunch of $$ on a cage, seats, harnesses, to justify doing it more like 4-5x per year? Not to mention it'll still be slow, so more $ to "fix" that?
Or buy an SS1LE and just deal with the $$$ consumables but save on buying a tow rig and trailer? It's certainly much "cooler" and I'd be able to enjoy it on the street too. As much as I love my Mazda2, it's just not the kind of car you're thrilled about cruising around in.
That said, I signed up to run Gridlife in August in the Sundae Cup to kind of guage my interest in keeping vs selling the car... Also see what I want to do in regards to the competition aspect and maybe dual purpose vs dedicated track car decision.
In reply to L5wolvesf :
In over 50 years of vintage racing, I've so rarely seen big write offs of cars I'll bet it's about once a decade.
Now Spec Miata's and other extremely competitive classes it's closer to once a year.
My point is that if you don't want that level of risk, don't compete at that level. It's also far more affordable. You don't need to extract every tenth of a second a season out of your car so your budget can be more rational.
Just chiming in with the others that said, keep it street legal. I get that not every serious track car CAN remain street legal, but it's always possible to pick a class or chassis that lets you retain legality, and yes it makes the car WAY less of a burden.
So if I was going to bail out of everything and do a dual purpose car I'd simply get something like a Miata or FRS/BRZ, slap on 200tw tires and run it.
I was at a track day last Saturday and my little Datsun was the slowest car in the group by far. The Hoosiers are 2 years old and I've got the 80whp back up motor in the car...................guess what?...............it was fun as hell to flog.
I think the key is something you find fun and leaving the ego at home.
Tom1200 said:So if I was going to bail out of everything and do a dual purpose car I'd simply get something like a Miata or FRS/BRZ, slap on 200tw tires and run it.
I was at a track day last Saturday and my little Datsun was the slowest car in the group by far. The Hoosiers are 2 years old and I've got the 80whp back up motor in the car...................guess what?...............it was fun as hell to flog.
I think the key is something you find fun and leaving the ego at home.
They told me the same thing about PCA racing. My 1.8 litre 914 has about 85 horspower and most new Porsches come with more than 5X that right from the showroom floor. Not only would I be at the back of the pack but I would be getting beaten by cars that are daily driven and on street tires.
Snowdoggie (Forum Supporter) said:Tom1200 said:So if I was going to bail out of everything and do a dual purpose car I'd simply get something like a Miata or FRS/BRZ, slap on 200tw tires and run it.
I was at a track day last Saturday and my little Datsun was the slowest car in the group by far. The Hoosiers are 2 years old and I've got the 80whp back up motor in the car...................guess what?...............it was fun as hell to flog.
I think the key is something you find fun and leaving the ego at home.
They told me the same thing about PCA racing. My 1.8 litre 914 has about 85 horspower and most new Porsches come with more than 5X that right from the showroom floor. Not only would I be at the back of the pack but I would be getting beaten by cars that are daily driven and on street tires.
This past weekend I was anywhere from 5 to 20 seconds a lap slower on a 3.1 mile course, ironically it was a PCA event, and it just didn't matter. With the 99whp motor and fresh tires my car is 10 seconds lap faster than it is now; I would be faster than a couple of cars but still get lapped in a 30 minute session. Basically the car would be less slow.
I'm brutally honest with myself about the car; not being the slowest car might sooth my ego a bit but it doesn't make the car more fun. I go to track days to have fun. I find 4 wheel drifting the car in and of itself huge fun.
If I was the only car on the track I'd still go and it would still be fun. I like to drive fast and the only place to do that is on a track
My attitude at races and track days are entirely different.
Tom1200 said:I'm brutally honest with myself about the car; not being the slowest car might sooth my ego a bit but it doesn't make the car more fun. I go to track days to have fun. I find 4 wheel drifting the car in and of itself huge fun.
If I was the only car on the track I'd still go and it would still be fun. I like to drive fast and the only place to do that is on a track
My attitude at races and track days are entirely different.
Lots of good stuff in here. Yeah, I'm not worried about being the fastest car on track or needing people to know than mine is larger than theirs. Not my style or mindset, happy to let faster cars/drivers go by, my experience is that at a good HPDE in the advanced group, I can usually find someone about my speed to lap with. I've never worried about "winning" my HPDE group. Even when I raced Club FF's years ago, I knew I was never really going to be fast, as I was too conservative. I've always also been brutally honest with myself, and am always happy to tell my instructors, that I suck at high speed braking consistently, I have a tendency to cheat towards the middle of the track in high speed braking sections, etc.
The Miata is out for me as a dual purpose car, as it kind of overlaps with the TR6, which isn't going anywhere anytime soon, given the hours I have into that restoration. I don't know much about the FRS/BRZ, as I don't frankly know much about cars more modern than an E46. Even my Tundra is a 2007. I really need to loosen up on the wallet chokehold and move into the last decade (or two) :-)
wake74 said:Tom1200 said:I'm brutally honest with myself about the car; not being the slowest car might sooth my ego a bit but it doesn't make the car more fun. I go to track days to have fun. I find 4 wheel drifting the car in and of itself huge fun.
If I was the only car on the track I'd still go and it would still be fun. I like to drive fast and the only place to do that is on a track
My attitude at races and track days are entirely different.
Lots of good stuff in here. Yeah, I'm not worried about being the fastest car on track or needing people to know than mine is larger than theirs. Not my style or mindset, happy to let faster cars/drivers go by, my experience is that at a good HPDE in the advanced group, I can usually find someone about my speed to lap with. I've never worried about "winning" my HPDE group. Even when I raced Club FF's years ago, I knew I was never really going to be fast, as I was too conservative. I've always also been brutally honest with myself, and am always happy to tell my instructors, that I suck at high speed braking consistently, I have a tendency to cheat towards the middle of the track in high speed braking sections, etc.
The Miata is out for me as a dual purpose car, as it kind of overlaps with the TR6, which isn't going anywhere anytime soon, given the hours I have into that restoration. I don't know much about the FRS/BRZ, as I don't frankly know much about cars more modern than an E46. Even my Tundra is a 2007. I really need to loosen up on the wallet chokehold and move into the last decade (or two) :-)
Find an FR-S with a rebuilt title add some fresh brake fluid and pads, oil cooler, sticky tires and SEND IT! About 1/4th the cost of a new SS 1LE (and apparently even used, I looked just for fun after this thread yesterday. People are asking nearly new prices for ones with 40k+ miles on them)
Then if you feel like it later on, add some nice coilovers with wider wheels/tires and you'll have a quick, fun, little car that will fit a stockish size of 17s with sticky tires in the truck with the back seats laid down.
In reply to wake74 :
I have a couple of friends who run FRS/BRZs and they don't seem to have any issues with them. I've driven a couple of them and they are a lot of fun.
I've got know issue with being conservative, especially at a track day, there are a couple fo vintage racers I know who freely admit they aren't ever going to hang the car out. They are excellent drivers, they just happen brake early and only get to about 98% of maximum slip angles...............I find nothing wrong with that at all. This isn't the safest hobby in the world so leaving some margin makes sense.
I mentioned the Miata or FRS/BRZ becuase to me momentum cars make sense if you are trying to make things more low key; they are easy on tires and other consumables.
As for the wallet chokehold.................I run a 49 year old Datsun and a 33 year old Formula 500 for a reason. Note I also use a 31 year old camper van as a tow vehicle.
What about moving? No trailer storage then!
Tuesday. Definitely Tuesday. 
Might be a couple other days of the week too...
if you have the space to store a car and trailer for minimal or no cost.. or those costs don't matter for you..
Yes, dedicate the track car to be a track car... otherwise.. have a streetable track car.. and maybe a super comfy applicance daily..
My Fit is the best combo of toy and DD that i've found so far, keeping it on 14" wheels means it drives pretty good around town and the BC coilovers mean that the car does handle really well.
I've debated on putting a half cage/roll bar in the Fit with seats and Harnesses, but I've determined that right now, I don't want to DD that car if i had to, and I don't want o buy ANOTHER car to DD right now.
So I'm keeping my Fit stock interior and modifying as little as possible for Sundae Cup.
Have you thought about other styles of racing to get more use out of a car.
Drag strip nearby to bracket race.
Dirt track with a cheap fwd 4 banger couple times a month on Sat night and then run it on a road coarse once or twice a year.
In reply to ckosacranoid :
What does a "test&tune" night typically cost to enter? How about a 1/4 mi dirt track race?
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