Why the mazdaspeed6 never got love?

Vigo said:

Changing the CDFP out fixes the falling flat on the face problem at 5500 RPM.

It's possible the tune dethrottles because they knew the stock fuel pump was already questionable, but if the fuel pump itself was directly changing the powerband, it would be by leaning out and the engine would blow up.  Not that stock MS6s don't blow up, but if that was the case they would ALL blow up. 

I want to put a tune on mine but I wont do it until the fuel pump is done. 

That's actually exactly what the mapping on the MS3 did until the CDPF pin was changed. You could feel the power die off at 5500-5700 RPM but it wasn't like the throttle plate was slamming shut. More of a hole in the mapping.

After the change it readily rev'd up to 6500 without a remap where there's a violent throttle cutout. The MS6's tune likely has some characteristics I don't know about so I can't say they're the same for certain. I farm that work out to an actual tuning company. I did play with the OEM+ configuration on my MS3 by changing the pin and changing the RMM. Then I got carried away.

Modifying them is really pulling the pin on the grenade until the CDPF pin is changed out.

Vigo said:

..I will definitely agree that they are flawed from the factory. A lot like every other Mazdaspeed..

<slaps on head>

( points at MazdaSpeed3 )

<slaps on head again>

Kingkong said:

In the northeast they rust to hell too.  Cool car, almost got one 

Yeah, Mazda 3s and 6s of this era rust like it is their job. I went and looked at an '09 Mazda3 with 100k miles 2 years go. Rocker panels were gone as in 2-3 foot long holes, bottom 2 inches of the door were crumbling away on the inside, quarter panels were all bubbled up, bottom 2 inches of the decklid were gone, lower rear edges of the front fenders were swiss cheesed. A salesman at our work had a '10 Mazda6, got towed in one day because the front end was all messed up, turns out the front subframe had rusted in half. He was considering putting a subframe in it, because he had put new tires and brakes and wheel bearings in it recently, but when we put it up on the lift the rear subframe was paper thin everywhere.

Is it weird that this thread is actually making me want one MORE!? (That ESP car doesn't help, thing looks incredible)

In my head I'm like "Fix this, this, this and this, and you've got the perfect car!"

Kingkong said:

In the northeast they rust to hell too.  Cool car, almost got one 

this ^^^

They seem to fare worse than the std mazda6 with the wheel well rust. 

I've heard of rumors on the rear diff or rear diff mounts breaking but I think this is a very rare occurrence. 

Plus it should have been a wagon and one day I will make that car, as long as they dont rust away. 

Vigo said:

I'm not sure how much of the hard to work on comments i can agree with. It's a transverse 4 cyl car. That's generally about as easy as a modern car gets. The only two notable things I would say are that theres an intercooler on top of the motor, and the turbo mounts below the exh manifold rather than on top of it. If not for those two things it would more or less be any other 4cyl Mazda6 under the hood. 

Yeah, the 3000GT VR-4 comparison seemed a mite extreme. The MS6 doesn't seem that awful from the ones I've seen. I still have nightmares about the underhood of the 3000GT VR-4

CyberEric said:

Is it weird that this thread is actually making me want one MORE!? (That ESP car doesn't help, thing looks incredible)

In my head I'm like "Fix this, this, this and this, and you've got the perfect car!"

Not at all. The right care and feeding and they're positively stupid fun. And hey, they're not Italian. 

aircooled said:

Vigo said:

..I will definitely agree that they are flawed from the factory. A lot like every other Mazdaspeed..

<slaps on head>

( points at MazdaSpeed3 )

<slaps on head again>

I dont get it? The MS3 has the same engine/tune issues as the 6 does. They can be worked around and there are a lot of fast Mazdaspeeds out there, but the fact remains that the Mazdaspeeds are some of the only turbo cars in existence that are less likely to blow up after they've been modded (at least, in many cases). 

In the wild today.

In reply to Vigo :

fact remains that the Mazdaspeeds are some of the only turbo cars in existence that are less likely to blow up after they've been modded (at least, in many cases). 

Don’t forget about the many 2.5 turbo Subaru motors out there. 

In reply to CyberEric :

The ESP car is proof that if you put enough effort and talent into anything you “can” make it fast.  But there are easier ways to skin that particular cat.  I’m pretty sure you could go faster with less effort in several other platforms.

Don’t forget about the many 2.5 turbo Subaru motors out there. 

Haha, touche! But unlike a Subaru, the MS6 can do 30mpg hwy which im still kind of shocked about.  

Just going to jump in and say that my MS3 with an intake on a stock tune has been purring like a kitten. It seems to love all the boost.

NickD said:

KyAllroad (Jeremy) said:

If you’re willing to completely rebuild the car and are a gifted driver it has a place in autocross.  There is a Speed6  campaigning in ESP (against the Shelby GT500s and such) and absolutely crushing them.  It’s a badass ride but a bit fragile.  Guys name is Clint.

I've had the pleasure of seeing Clint Griest's E/SP Mazdaspeed 6 in action at the Finger Lakes Champ Tour last summer. What an absolute monster. I was out working on course and had my back to the starting line and heard some wild, anti-lag, open-wastegate AWD launch and turned around expecting to see an Evo or WRX and instead see this thing go roaring by. I believe this was the fastest doorslammer at the event.

FWIW, we have a feature story on this very car in the queue. 

Also, I remember chasing one at Roebling Road a million years ago. I think I was in my twin-cam CRX. I was all over the Speed6's back bumper in the turns but just couldn't get past on the straights. 

In reply to Vigo :

What? There are some stories of stock ones going boom (they don't take lugging the engine well - and if you don't regularly get on them I've heard the build up pretty bad), but I'm pretty sure all the ones I've seen go boom have had a tune or a million other slapped on things (so much better than factory). They're super easy to bolt on do questionable things to - surprise - they also go boom when you don't do the upgrades in the correct order with an attention to detail (even something like exhaust...). My completely stock one has been a fantastic car and I've beat the snot out of it on track and on road (and towed with it...)

torque steer + barrier? jesus what happened?!

In reply to fidelity101 :

lol @ torque steer. People whine about torque steer, but at stock or stock+ power levels it's not even that bad. 

I berkeleyed up at Road Atlanta. Do enough track events and everyone berkeleys up eventually ;) (squint really hard - the worse part was the rear-quarter panel). I have been back to RA since with the MS3 and threw down some very good times for tired street tires. 

To be clear the picture of it towing is AFTER the picture below it. She's all fixed up (yay track insurance). Just making it known I don't go easy on my cars, least of all my MS3.

I just mean that pretty much any boosted car will blow up when its fuel pump fails and mazdaspeed3/6 fuel pumps are more marginal than average even when stock.  To the point that they possibly maybe tuned around it from the factory. But I'm not an expert on these things yet so I'll let any further aspersions come from long-time owners.  My car hasn't blown up for 23k miles, so that's something! 

I got 88k out of mine before I lunched the stock turbo, on increased power. To give you an idea of just how weird the tuning and maps are for these cars, bone stock tune, stock turbo, stock intercooler, cai,tip, cat delete, ported intake mani, deleted dcts- I made 256/280. Same dyno I made...225ish bone stock. Heres the kicker- I made the bigger number on 3 LESS psi. 

Count me in the group that doesn't understand the lack of love for these cars compared to the WRX's. They both share a fragile drivetrain and engine and while the WRX is lighter, the interior of the Mazda is so much nicer. 

With these getting into Challenge prices, I am really considering one. They are half the price of a similar WRX around here. 

I had a nice black cherry mica MS6 with just about everything from the Corksport catalog.  Awesome modern day sleeper.  

After about 2 years of track use I bought a Spec Miata and I really don't miss the Speed6.  It had some goofy handling at the limit and the AWD was so-so on track IMO.  

If they are rusty they will be totally miserable to work on.  Mine was rust free but was starting to show it's age after about 4 years of turbo spoolin' madness.  

(I have pics but photobucket really seems to be bad at hosting them without surrendering $)

In reply to fanfoy :

That’s how I ended up with one. I wanted a WRX but the Mazda was half the cost. No regrets. 

fanfoy said:

Count me in the group that doesn't understand the lack of love for these cars compared to the WRX's. They both share a fragile drivetrain and engine and while the WRX is lighter, the interior of the Mazda is so much nicer. 

With these getting into Challenge prices, I am really considering one. They are half the price of a similar WRX around here. 

The WRX wasn't what the Speed6 was trying to go after. It was the Legacy GT, which has just as nice of an interior and an equal lack of love from most people.

I think the real beauty is the front suspension - not many cars have a double wishbone up front.  Second to that the awd system is totally seamless in operation.  I literally haven't done anything to the rear drive except feed it a coupler every year or two.   They're like a motorcycle wet clutch...they wear out kinda quickly with what we do.

NickD said:

I wish I had video of it, because it was an evil-sounding machine too. Like I said, I expected some wild Evo and then this thing goes flying past my worker station

I believe Finger Lakes was the last event where I had it completely uncorked.  We put a temp fix in after we got dinged for sound on the 2nd day - that eventually failed and popped off...which led to some exhaust blowing directly at the diff controller wires.  I can say for sure that the car is not as fast with only FWD, lol.

Finger Lakes Day 1