FSP_ZX2 said:
MoCo,
What is this supposed to mean?
FSP_ZX2 said:
MoCo,
What is this supposed to mean?
In reply to Suprf1y :
Short for motor company. As in Harley Davidson.
There's not enough skulls on them.
They need more skulls and tassels.
And some safety pipes.
And maybe a get-back whip so people know you're legit.
Harley Davidson is dammed if they do, and dammed if they don't. This thread proves it.
The VRod wasn't accepted by the old schoolers, because of it's new fangled water cooled, furrin' motor. It didn't attract newcomers, because it was a Harley Davidson.
I hope enough of the old schoolers have given up riding, and that these new bikes can succeed.
When I was trying to decide on my next bike purchase, I wandered into one of the local HD dealerships. Three salesmen walked by me like I was a random traffic cone. A younger salesman intro'd himself (Chris) and was extremely attentive and helpful. After working with him, the other three wanted to join the conversation.
I took Mrs. Zero back a few days later and Chris greeted us. He told me to sit on as many bikes as I wanted and he would be back in about 10 mins. After sitting on few bikes, a different salesman came over frantically asking why I was sitting on bikes. I told him I was working with Chris. This guy asked me which Chris and where did he go. o_O "Uh, I have no clue, but it appears I may need take my leave."
If the other salesmen were like Chris, I may have purchased an HD instead of the Beamer.
The sad thing is I know HD has the chops. They have or can get top notch engineers to design bikes to kick everyone's ass, for what Ducati sells them for or less. I truly believe this. I also believe I will never see these things. This thread is partial proof as to why.
It would be irony of ironys, if they hired Erik Buell back. My fantasy is if they gave him free rein, with the stated goal of, "DESTROY THE COMPETITION. "
I can't imagine Buell would really want to be back there.
I generally don't blame engineers for a bad product; I blame marketing and management.
NoMini said:Harley Davidson is dammed if they do, and dammed if they don't. This thread proves it.
The VRod wasn't accepted by the old schoolers, because of it's new fangled water cooled, furrin' motor. It didn't attract newcomers, because it was a Harley Davidson.
They created that situation entirely on their own and they would have to be complete idiots to not realize it while it was happening.
At least with Italian bikes you go into the deal knowing that the company is run by incompetents and will eventually put itself out of business.
Appleseed said:It would be irony of ironys, if they hired Erik Buell back. My fantasy is if they gave him free rein, with the stated goal of, "DESTROY THE COMPETITION. "
Seems I recall some other cat had a similar falling out with a manufacturer, he left and came back later. Carroll something or the other.
My bike's frame/suspension was designed by Erik Buell. The guy is good.
Friend of mine has a 140HP V-Rod. It's fast. However, when they were still selling them, I mostly saw women on them.
I want a "Loud pipes save lives" T-shirt when I ride my electric HD...
A KTM V-twin LC-8 is dropping a creamy 172HP from a very light, small packaging hi tech engine and they are mostly very reliable. BMW and Ducati are right there in the ballpark with flat/V twins and way ahead in other configurations. V-4, inline 4, flat 6... etc. All the bikes handle very, very well.
People who buy ADV bikes buy reliability and toughness, people who buy street fighters buy numbers. I think, if that new 1250 motor doesn't best one of the euro brands on paper and in the real world this game is over before it starts. I hope they get it right but man.... they have a lot of catching up to do.
I read somewhere that Harley is also trying to break into the foreign market more as in sell more bikes internationally. This line up of new bikes are supposedly supposed to help them with that. As well as be more modern and have more variety for HD riders.
It doesn't help that some countries an HD cost twice as much as it should in the USA because of politics.
I had been curious about the Harley Livewire and thought it was pretty cool they were expanding their market. I was listening to the radio yesterday and heard they finally set a price $29,799. I am assuming they don't want to sell any.
Steelpig said:I had been curious about the Harley Livewire and thought it was pretty cool they were expanding their market. I was listening to the radio yesterday and heard they finally set a price $29,799. I am assuming they don't want to sell any.
Right or wrong--the thought is to introduce Livewire as a halo model in the lineup. Future (electric) offerings will be less costly. FWIW, the dealership I work at has 4 deposits already.
I want one so bad. But not for what my FR-S cost me. Ouch.
Yeah, doing some quick beer math, the Zero S model with optional bigger battery is 2/3 the weight and half the price of the Livewire with similar performance specs. To me, that means either the HD dealer network is 100% on-board with supporting the Livewire OR you're paying in excess of $10k for the badge on the "tank". Again, beer math based on cursory Google-fu, take it for what its worth.
I want HD to succeed. I'll probably own one of their products in the next few years (albeit almost certainly a used one). I have hoped that their recent realization of just how bad their situation is would kick start their development and marketing teams, but even with this new lineup, I'm not confident they can buck the monster they've helped create. 
In reply to JohnInKansas :
Only dealers that buy into the service training and infrastructure requirements will be allowed to sell Livewire--as such it will likely only be at larger stores.
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