Anyone have experience with patellofemoral knee pain or bursitis?

So, about a month ago I went for about a 4 mile hike, which I usually do weekly or so. Less during the winter. Lately I had been wearing my red wing work boots as they are fairly water resistant and it's been a muddy winter. Normally I hike in my new balance trail runner whatever shoes as our trails are not overly challenging. This time I wore these adidas hikers I have that turned out to be very uncomfortable. Everything was fine until the next morning when walking out the door for work I felt a bit of pain in my knee... and it kept getting worse. This dull intense ache. Almost feels sour if it had a flavor. Basically just below the knee cap and feels like it cuts back into the knee. Doesn't hurt to just stand there, but especially painful when I lift weight off of it. Such as walking down stairs, or when I'm lifting my foot off the ground and about to swing it forward as I step. Hurts if left bent for a while and then go to move, such as when driving on the freeway for 15 mins and then lift leg to push in clutch. Went to my family doc and they tasted my range of motion, and nothing showed up. They did X-rays and all the spacing looked good so they do not suspect a meniscus issue. They did notice an effusion, and they think it may be bursitis, but there is no visible swelling. There is a infrapatellar bursa under the tendon that may be causing the issue. I've been squatting down low at work lately. Not kneeling, more sitting on my heels. I suppose that could be stretching my knees tight. I've since started avoiding squaring like that and started using a stool. Looking at the symptoms they seem very similar to the Patellofemoral knee pain... elevation and ice seem to help a bit, but compression seems to make it worse. In the past I've had experience with similar pain, if I ran for more than about two miles. I'd be hobbling along in lots of pain. But then I'd go to bed for the night and in the morning or would be like new. This hasn't cleared up for a month, and I'm not sure my doctor has any idea. Maybe a sports medicine doctor would be better...

Ooh, me! A few years back one of my knees started acting up. It ached and seemed unstable. Though far from an anatomy chart, I'm no stranger to the gym either and was pretty bummed about the whole thing.

After some poking around on the web I did two things that totally solved the problems with the offending joint. Step 1: buy a patellofemoral strap off Amazon or at a discount retailer. The strap will give you a great deal of symptom relief and provide stability while you undertake Step 2: use the recumbent cycle in the gym. I switched from the treadmill to a recumbent and found it was a great choice. The recumbent burns way more calories in the same half-hour than the treadmill and helped condition and build strength in the structure around the joint. After a few weeks both knees felt better than they had in literally years. I'm still on the recumbent but haven't needed the strap since the first few weeks.

My knees have been hurting off and on since a go-kart crash when I was 15, destroyed the cartilage in one knee, and roofing a house, a month later, screwed up the other. Overworking or abusing them, can make them hurt for days. Squatting for any period of time is a definite no no. I was told I would need knee surgery by the time I was 25. I'm at 50 now and they still don't bother me enough for surgery, but I take very good care of them.

Wear a brace for a week or so and give them a break. It sounds like you have injured something and aren't giving it a chance to heal. A long weekend of watching movies or reading books will do them wonders. Don't sit with you legs propped up and knees hyperextended. That makes any pain I have, much worse.

Yea, taking it easy would probably do me good. Toyman, I know you follow me on insta, so if you saw all those pics I posted out west, those were all taken when I could hardly see straight my knee hurt so bad!

And conesare2, which knee brace did you use? Amazon has a bunch of different versions! I'll try the recombant bike after taking a few days off!

Thanks guys

As another side note, my knee feels pretty good in the morning, but by a few hours in it's usually sore again, depending if it's a weekday or weekend, and activity level.

Mine is a bit different. Retropatellofemoral is what it was diagnosed to be. Basically every time I bend my knee my kneecap slides sideways and stretches the inside ligaments. Doc told me it was genetic aggravated by a couple motorcycle accidents and 20 years in the army. We used to run 5 miles in boots. Hurts to run fast but can run slowly for a long distance. At least when I was younger. I'm old now and can't go as far as I could. Don't even try anymore, just walk. A lot. Basically speed hurts. Weight hurts also. Can't cross that leg as below my knee will go numb. Can pull the outer knee joint apart enough to put my finger in the joint if I do cross that leg. I exercise regularly and have a brace w/stabilizer for exercising and weight stress. Other knee has the same problem but not nearly as bad. Surgery won't fix. If I tear it up too badly it can be put back together with surgery but would still have the problem. So I do my best to avoid tearing it up.

Strap

I also used one from Wal Mart and honestly can't remember which one was more comfortable.

Do the ice a few times a day, 10-15 minutes at a time. Alternatively, put an ice pack on it for 3-4 minutes, then put a heating pad on its lowest setting on it for a minute, then the ice pack for 3-4 minutes, repeat to total about 20 minutes. Start and finish with with cold. Reduces inflammation well, better than just ice.

The cho pat strap, which is the style in the above link, tricks it into not being as painful, feel the pressure more than the pain. I understand they are fairly effective.

Ok thanks! I'll try the Walmart strap tomorrow, and if I don't like it I'll try amazon. And I'll also try the cold-warm-cold method. I've just been icing it for a while... like an hour!

i wear the ace brand knee support brace that wal mart sells on my right knee every day. Started out as broken knee cap and pinched nerve when i was 13. its since turned into a combination of hyper extended tendons and meniscus tears thanks to a few years as a gym rat and improper stretching. The support helps me alot for work, since i climb concrete stairs all day, but nothing helps as much as a quality Shoe. New balance has been my go to for the last 2 years and its cut down on a bunch of the pain. If im really busy ill still feel the dull ache in the back of my knee but otherwise its worked out pretty well.

I had a ski crash that resulted in "unhealthy triad" surgery shortly after. As a result, I have some advice.

First: talk to people in town and find out what surgeons are recommended. Go talk to them. Get a second opinion if you question their diagnosis.

As others have said, ice helps a lot. I use an ice therapy machine (think cool shirt for your knee) but the gel packs or even a bag of peas will do.

I also get a lot of relief from stretching. Wearing the right/good shoes goes a long way too.

Bracing is a touchy topic for some reason. There is research to show it does help, and other research that says it does not. For me, a $150 brace for heavy activity is worth the minor inconvenience even if its only in my head that it will save me from a very expensive surgery and long recovery. I have a few different models, but I usually go for my Shock Doctor Ultra with bilateral hinges as it fits me best.

Regardless, go see the knee doctor.

I recently came across this article from Ohio State, which was aimed at ACL injuries but applies to any injury that has you hobbling around: https://wexnermedical.osu.edu/mediaroom/pressreleaselisting/research-finds-brain-needs-to-be-retrained-after-acl-injury

My Ortho said I have patellofemoral syndrome on top of the torn meniscus in both knees. She said I need to stretch my hamstrings and that would help relieve it some. It comes and goes but it's been steadily getting worse over the last year or so. Some days it's all I can do to just get up and move.

In going to try some of the things mentioned in this thread. Bad knees sure make you feel older than you are.

Tight hamstrings and calves have a E36 M3load ton to do w/ premature knee pain, whether you're 30 or 50. Ask me how I know, BTDT. There are simple everyday stretches and exercises that'll put off knee pain/ problems if ya just stick to 'em.

Go easy on it for a bit. Ice it down if it does swell.

In high school I wrestled and berkeleyed my knee up by repetitively slamming it against the mat. After two years it started swelling severely. Swelling went down and I went on with life. Ever since then, I've walked with a slight limp that I never payed much attention to.

(12 years from the initial damage) About a year ago after regular visits to the gym, my knee started swelling. X-rays are normal (no traumatic arthritis) and the expensive MRI was normal (no visible damage to my suspension) as well. My doctor has told me my knee is fine, but keep doing exercises for bursitis. I was told that working through the pain will not cause harm, so I'll keep working through it unless pain is unbearable, which is extremely rare.

Sometimes it hurts to put pressure on it, sometimes it hurts when I take weight off. Sometimes it throbs ad sometimes it feels like it's being stuck with needles.

I'm only 30 BTW....

Wow, thanks guys. Seems knee issues are common. I bought a cheap ace compression brace thing today, it has a cut out for the knee cap. Seems to help a ton. I think it helps the cap not slide around as much. Makes me think I need to be focusing my leg workouts on supporting that. And the stretches, fasted58? Which ones work well for you?

I had knee pain problems like you describe from over developed hamstrings which apparently puled on my kneecaps and deep, narrow foot spacing squats with heavy weight. What I was prescribed to do was very helpful and has been helpful over the years. It can't do any harm so maybe try this:

When you are watching TV or waiting for dinner to cook or just have time, sit on the couch with both feet on the floor. Lift one leg and place a small pillow under the thigh close to the knee. Now, do leg extensions in slow motion, like 20 seconds up and 20 seconds down, as slow as you can while maintaining movement, and at the top of the movement, flex and hold the leg extension for a few seconds, then slowly moving back down again. Do a set of 10 each side.

I was told this would tighten the tendons in the knee and help maintain consistent kneecap placement, which for me the lack thereof of causing my kneecap to scrape against my leg bones and causing injury to the cartilage behind it. I don't know if thats true but it worked and I have never forgotten it.

If it is bursitis this wont help I think.

In reply to mattmacklind: Thanks Matt! I tried it tonight. I'll keep at it and see how it goes. The hamstring point you make is interesting. While not a body builder I do try to get to the gym every other day. I don't squat with heavy weights, but one of my favorite excersizes is squats on a bozu ball while swing battle ropes. Great core workout, but I did few like my hamstrings were much more developed than the front of my thighs..

Thanks!

This is the easiest, should do it every day but definitely when you feel hamstrings tighten up or have any trace of knee pain coming on. I usually first notice tight hamstrings walking up stairs. Cold weather and inactivity doesn't help.

Just as good and better to use in the workplace is sit in chair, back square against the chair back. Extend leg as shown w/ a belt, strap, hose etc. Pull tight, feel the burn, hold 30 seconds, repeat. Really makes a difference.

I've learned to spot people w/ tight hamstrings, they walk a little hunkered over and don't take full steps/ strides.

Simple calf stretch. Place foot on block as shown, lean forward and feel the calf stretch, you can moderate pressure by the lean in. Hold for 30-60 secs, repeat. PT had a wooden block angled about 45° to plant the foot against and lean in. You could make that outta plywood. You can do similar at work, balance foot as shown on edge of a stair step and lean in etc. At work I've used the bottom rung of a step ladder too.

There's plenty more stretches and exercises in the Googles, tailor a routine for yourself, doesn't take a whole lotta time either.

In post knee surgery PT I met a lotta people doing PT trying to put off knee surgery, it worked for a lot of 'em. Don't let it go too far, a lot of knee problems are preventable.

Again, these are just basic but they matter.

fasted58 wrote: Simple calf stretch. Place foot on block as shown, lean forward and feel the calf stretch, you can moderate pressure by the lean in. Hold for 30-60 secs, repeat. PT had a wooden block angled about 45° to plant the foot against and lean in. You could make that outta plywood. You can do similar at work, balance foot as shown on edge of a stair step and lean in etc. At work I've used the bottom rung of a step ladder too. There's plenty more stretches and exercises in the Googles, tailor a routine for yourself, doesn't take a whole lotta time either. In post knee surgery PT I met a lotta people doing PT trying to put off knee surgery, it worked for a lot of 'em. Don't let it go too far, a lot of knee problems are preventable. Again, these are just basic but they matter.

Thanks! I'm all about exercise. Have been for a while, so any kind of pt is much rather than surgery or meds.

Thanks for the advice!

You have to do the calf stretches with the knee straight and with the knee bent.

I just knew there would be a lot of good advice here after reading the downsides of a manual thread.

fasted58 wrote: Simple calf stretch. Place foot on block as shown, lean forward and feel the calf stretch, you can moderate pressure by the lean in. Hold for 30-60 secs, repeat. PT had a wooden block angled about 45° to plant the foot against and lean in. You could make that outta plywood. You can do similar at work, balance foot as shown on edge of a stair step and lean in etc. At work I've used the bottom rung of a step ladder too. There's plenty more stretches and exercises in the Googles, tailor a routine for yourself, doesn't take a whole lotta time either. In post knee surgery PT I met a lotta people doing PT trying to put off knee surgery, it worked for a lot of 'em. Don't let it go too far, a lot of knee problems are preventable. Again, these are just basic but they matter.

It's really amazing how much stretching the calf can affect pain in the knee cap. Seems to relieve the pain for a period when it starts coming on. Makes me wonder if my boots which have a bit of a heel on them is causing some of my problem. Not stretching my calf enough

Also work out the backs of your legs, flute and lower back.

I tore my meniscus a few years ago, no surgery, immobilization and light focused exercise. Assisted very slow squats where it takes you 30 seconds to squat and return, balance pad (flat on top with a ball on bottom), single leg lifts from a half crouch (thigh at 45 lifting one knee to 90 from floor while maintaining balance holding the wall if necessary. It is all low impact but like planks it focuses a specific grouping of muscles.

I have subluxed my right kneecap six times and seem to have finally found an approach that works. I may be helpful to you, but probably only if you've had previous traumatic injuries to the leg.