Can we talk about something illegal?

^Bingo.

I don't think you told me that thing had aftermarket cams, btw....

If it's the car i'm thinking about.

If we exclude the issue of how legal or moral it is, then yes there are options. Subarus have options such as RomRaider that allow you to set the sensitivity of the sensors to set a code. Or you can also just turn off the sensors ability to set error codes. You can also force pass the readiness monitor which is very different than just turning off the light.

I know it isnt legal, and I sure dont think its ethical, to drive around in a Subaru with no cats. But I have seen a lot of kids do it. In my case it let me adjust the sensitivity of the cheesy Subaru knock sensor.

On DSMs with DSMLink, you can just set the readiness monitors to DONE and turn off the codes. I am sure you could do the same with any modern GM if you were good with code and had access to LS1Edit, HP Tuners, or EFI Live. I know you can turn off the CEL, don't know about the readiness monitors but can't be too hard.

You can use CRC guaranteed to pass if you have cat efficiency issues, you can also run some E85. Or you can register your car in a way that lets it not have to pass emissions. Thats the easiest. Either at a friend's farm out in the country or in a special class of vehicles (hobbyist, commercial, over a certain weight, antique, etc)

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: I don't think you told me that thing had aftermarket cams, btw.... If it's the car i'm thinking about.

Same car. I forgot about it, honestly. That poor thing was so abused by so many owners and shops that I lost track of who did what to it.

It's now living happily in a KY suburb of Cincinnati with an old pasty chef buddy of mine. Only a very secure man can be a pastry chef and drive a Miata.

Ranger50 wrote: There is a readiness monitor. Basically it runs all the tests related to emissions and such and when it finishes them all, it basically gives you a green light. So if you have a known code and clear it, the readiness monitor says not so fast. You fail until the monitor says you can pass go and collect your signature to get your renewal processed.

Do all OBD-II cars have this monitor? Reason I ask is that my BIL has a 96 F-150 that throws a code for a "seconday air pump failure". The last 2 times he has had to have it tested he has stopped at my house and I cleared the code with my scanner.

The CEL goes out and then he drives the 3 miles to the testing station and it passes. By the time he drives the 10 miles back home the light has come on again.

Or is this a case where they don't check the readiness monitor and only look for specfic codes?

I'll chime in a little late.

Having lived in CA (sniffer and plug in), PA (visual, safety, and plug in) and TX (plug in and safety) ... and having helped tune several cars, I can offer these tidbits FWIW.

I understand the frustration with the plug-in emissions test. I understand if the code were for an O2 sensor or bad cat, but the CEL comes on for darn near everything. For instance, I have a code for transmission component slipping. It isn't slipping, but the input shaft speed sensor is giving a weak signal. I'm not polluting any more, but I would fail the "emissions" test. There was a narrow range of VW Jettas and Passats that would oddly report low engine oil pressure when the ABS module failed. ABS doesn't affect emissions, and in most cases neither does low oil pressure, but the CEL would prevent it from passing.

The sniffer is a whole different thing. Sniffer test limits are pretty generous. For instance, HC limits in CA on my OBD2 car were 363ppm and I consistently tested under 70ppm. If you fail a sniffer, something is pretty far out of whack and I agree that it should be fixed.

Put it this way, I knew several guys who passed the OBD2 sniffer/plug-in in CA with lumpy-cammed, carefully-tuned LT1s pushing 450 hp and they did it the kosher way - carefully selected LSA, tuned spark timing for max WOT advance but modest timing for test positions to mitigate NOx vs HC...

In fact, many guys in the SS club removed the cats from a stock LT1, used O2 simulators for the downstream, and passed the sniffer with NO cats at all. So the sniffers are usually VERY generous. If something is not passing a sniffer, something is actually wrong.

I'm not concerned about the legal or moral issues... I'm a Libertarian. Club some baby seals while you're at it. I know why nobody has tackled this issue with the aftermarket... because if a company like MSD came out with a "fake" OBD2 port that filtered or modified the information to the tester, they would all end up in jail and MSD would be auctioned off piece by piece to make their bail. I also think its a bit too much of an undertaking for most grassroots endeavors, but it could be done.

The advice that a different address should be used for registering your non-compliant vehicle is what I think is majorly wrong with emissions testing. I've lived in 2 or 3 states that did / do inspections, in all of them the zipcode for the registration is what determines whether you need the emissions tests done. When I lived in Memphis, folks who lived a mile or 2 north or east of where I lived got a "free pass" on emissions, because of their zipcodes. I have to drive through their neighborhoods, and they drive through mine...we should all have to get tested, or no one should have to.

BTW, I once owned a G20 that was very sensitive to tune for emissions testing. You would get one gas low enough to pass and another would go too high. It was a real tough balancing act to get that car through the inspection.

Note to self: buy DSM or Subaru for next toy...

slefain wrote: Note to self: buy 73 Cadillac for next toy...

Fixed that for me

Hal wrote:

Ranger50 wrote: There is a readiness monitor. Basically it runs all the tests related to emissions and such and when it finishes them all, it basically gives you a green light. So if you have a known code and clear it, the readiness monitor says not so fast. You fail until the monitor says you can pass go and collect your signature to get your renewal processed.

Do all OBD-II cars have this monitor? Reason I ask is that my BIL has a 96 F-150 that throws a code for a "seconday air pump failure". The last 2 times he has had to have it tested he has stopped at my house and I cleared the code with my scanner. The CEL goes out and then he drives the 3 miles to the testing station and it passes. By the time he drives the 10 miles back home the light has come on again. Or is this a case where they don't check the readiness monitor and only look for specfic codes?

It's not really a monitor, but a switch to say that all of the main test are not done yet. As for clearing the code in three miles- that actually makes sense, assuming the drive cycle is close enough- all of the monitors should be calibrated tun run in Bag 1 which is just about 3 miles.

Well, I'd sure like to know, because the Manic Miata is not using a factory ECU. It does have a cat, though I don't have any idea what the exhaust output is. But taking it off means I have to remove the blower, injectors, and other stuff, and plug in the factory ECU. Frankly it's a pain.

I know a friend that uses VAG-COM and software to remove, change certain settings on VW and Audi products to make systems blind to the readiness codes. Like when a swap goes from having secondary air to not having it. There are ways to fool the ecm, not to mention ways to change what it sees. In Vermont where I live only ODB2 cars are checked via the OPD port on the car. No rollers, and just a visual check for older than 96. Most states however don't allow backdating of engines and therefore emissions control. The chassis (and therefore the year of said chassis) dictates what engines are allowed.

nderwater wrote: A dead ODBII port is pretty hard to work around. What tailpipe test results lead to the failure?

in my case, the truck spat out 2100ppm of NO - the limit is around 700ppm. i was under it yesterday and noticed a way smaller than stock aftermarket converter had been installed, looks like a catco and i hear about their weakness, but 3x the limit is a little silly.

the parts store guy told me dump about 4 bottles of rubbing alcohol in the tank and go try again, but i got to the end of my temp tag and had to register the truck.

the stupid thing about ohio is 8 counties - greater cleveland/akron/youngstown have testing. the other 44 or so counties do not. so i get boned.

i passed the sniffer test in my 89 silverado with NO cat and half a tank of 6 year old gas.

In reply to patgizz: Rule are not the same. Unless both the hc and nox rules are total nurf tosses.

2100ppm isn't good, but I doubt that a non cat car can pass a 700ppm limit.

Btw even with a small car, you should be easily under 700ppm.

alfadriver wrote: In reply to patgizz: Rule are not the same. Unless both the hc and nox rules are total nurf tosses. 2100ppm isn't good, but I doubt that a non cat car can pass a 700ppm limit. Btw even with a small car, you should be easily under 700ppm.

the truck without cat passed NO with flying colors and HC passed iirc 385-390ppm on a 4xx limit.

this blazer may end up being the end of me, or it may run a little rough for a million miles. replaced just about everything having to do with fuel or spark or EGR and cant get it to run smooth.

What you are looking for is an OBD2 port simulator. It essentially handles all requests from an OBD2 code reader, and reports that everything is kosher.

These are incredibly illegal, and everyone in the history of mankind to sell them openly has received a firm cease and desist letter from the EPA.

Someone was selling one for people who prototype OBD2 readers, and he was shut down very quickly.

Although, anyone who is familiar with serial data and embedded systems should be able to churn out a couple basic ones pretty quickly. But I'm certain the people who do keep it very, very, very, VERY quiet.

Instead of a dead port... why not get an ECU from something OBDII and well understood and fake the inputs? Think of an MS "stim" only a bit more active to provide a nice clean 800 RPM steady state to the ECU with good values for the temp/o2/etc... then just stuff it under the dash and leave the port handy when you need it?

It would probably be unethical to form a small business selling "cheater boxes" but if you call them testing harnesses they are perfectly fine

xd wrote: I Think This is What You Want There is a program for android phones called torque. It connects with a blue tooth ODB adapter that runs about 30 bux. You can clear all the codes out you want with it. It's fun.

...and then they fail you for not having had the monitors run, or they run you on the rollers and then fail you for high emissions.

Didja know that many Fords will pass the internal catalyst monitor with a completely hollow cat?

Run the roller test with one of those, and you're going to spend serious bucks for a new converter (failing the roller test means you have to pass the roller test), when the whole probably all along could have been something as simple as a cracked evap hose.

Always breaks my heart when people go to Autozone and have their check engine light cleared, then fail the roller test. That always means they are about to spend a lot of money, and the kind of people who do that crap are generally the people who don't have $2500 for new catalysts...

patgizz wrote: my problem is my OBD port is dead, so they had to run my blazer on the sniffer because it wouldnt scan.

They should have given you the option to have the vehicle repaired before doing the roller test.

Mostly likely the OBD port is dead because the cig lighter fuse is blown.

93gsxturbo wrote: On DSMs with DSMLink, you can just set the readiness monitors to DONE and turn off the codes. I am sure you could do the same with any modern GM if you were good with code and had access to LS1Edit, HP Tuners, or EFI Live. I know you can turn off the CEL, don't know about the readiness monitors but can't be too hard.

IIRC, on GMs the monitor is set to run only if the coolant temp is over 250degF. basically, never...

Knurled wrote:

patgizz wrote: my problem is my OBD port is dead, so they had to run my blazer on the sniffer because it wouldnt scan.

They should have given you the option to have the vehicle repaired before doing the roller test. Mostly likely the OBD port is dead because the cig lighter fuse is blown.

no, its not

I do my best to buy exempt vehicles. Here in TX that means diesel or pre-88 (I think). In CA its diesel or pre-76 (I think).

I had many of the monitors voided on my OBD2 and it won't pop the CEL on for nearly anything. The rotor broke in my distributor and the car would barely run, coughing and sputtering, backfiring. I limped it home for 1 mile and it never tripped the light.

But... its also a bit frustrating since I didn't have any codes to narrow down my diagnosis.

patgizz wrote: in my case, the truck spat out 2100ppm of NO - the limit is around 700ppm. i was under it yesterday and noticed a way smaller than stock aftermarket converter had been installed, looks like a catco and i hear about their weakness, but 3x the limit is a little silly.

That sounds about right for a Catco. We've had brand new Catco converters blow double the limit for NOx on certain GMs. (The GM strategy seems to be run the cylinder hot and high pressure for good fuel economy, and clean up the NOx with really huge, badass converters) Replace with a Walker or other reputable brand and, magically, NOx drops to well under the limit.

Alternatively, if it's possible for your truck, you could run 93 octane and roll timing out of it. I don't think the Blazer's engine has adjustable timing, though.

The alcohol may work. On the other hand, I've seen an emissions failure that was entirely due to the owner putting a couple bottles of alcohol (RUBBING alcohol!) into the tank, causing it to run lean enough to misfire and make HC skyrocket.

Of course, that was one of those where we weren't told about that until AFTER we wasted time trying to find out why it had an apparent misfire (high HC and low CO = misfire) through all of the usual routes.

In reply to alex: Here in Canada we have got the new emmission testing procedure, same as the US. It is a f*#king nightmare for us used car dealers. It's adding hundreds of dollars worth of time & repairs to some vehicles, the cost of which can't be recovered. A 'cheater' adapter that tells the testing equip. that all systems are good, would be good. To ALFADRIVER, the US has been polluting this part of Canada (Ontario) from the Ohio Valley for years, so don't mention "dumping you garbage in your neigbours yard" to us!