Getting a dog from a breeder - have any experience with this situation?

We've rescued 8 dogs over our 33 years of marriage. Two were purebreds. Both were a PITA in different ways. All the mixes or blends were much easier to train and less high strung, which is saying something when your preferred dogs are herding breeds. We managed to avoid health problems, but temperament was another story.

Rescue groups nowadays are often as nutty as the breeders are, with all sort of restrictions and hoops to jump through to 'qualify' to be a pet parent. Too many are looking for the 'perfect' homes, which don't exist. 

I now oddly lament the lack of dogs in our local shelters that aren't either bully breeds or Chihuahuas, as I'd much rather pull a dog from the shelter. 

I understand wanting a certain type of dog with a predictable (Ha-Ha, oh that's hilarious, sure that will happen) temperament but most breeders are just money and status hungry idiots. The few that actually are decent charge a lot for their pups. I'm not paying $1500 for a dog when I can get a perfectly good pre-owned model elsewhere for a third or less.

I got my dog (English Cream Golden Retriever) for free from the breeder.  She retained breeding rights for ~2 years and if she used him twice I got first pick of the litter.  She did use him, that's why I've got another golden right now.  So basically, I got two free dogs out of it, so I'd say the deal you've been offered is unusual and I wouldn't accept it.

grover said:

What do yall do for allergies? My chocolate has been a scratching fool for the last few months and she's 8!

apoquil, my chocolate labradoodle gets her "daily cheese" which is basically pub cheese wrapped around an apoquil pill.  

wae said:

grover said:

What do yall do for allergies? My chocolate has been a scratching fool for the last few months and she's 8!

Our dog had terrible allergies that would cause him to scratch himself into staph infections and ear infections over and over and over.  The old vet would let him get bad, give him steroids and an antibiotic, and then after a couple months he'd be right back there.

The new vet, however, has us keeping him on Apoquel for about 6-8 months now and he has never been better.  No ear infections, no lesions on his skin, and no significant scratching or itching.  As much as I hated to take the business away from the local vet, Costco is about $60/mo cheaper on the prescription so we do it that way.  They also have a beef-flavored chewable which is a game-changer   instead of having to wrestle this dog like an orderly in a mental institution, he takes it as a treat when he comes inside in the morning.

That said, apparently different dogs react differently to different allergy medications, so there are others out there.  But this one has been the one for us.

i've been getting appoquil from Chewy and I think a 3 month supply is around $3 per pill per day, what are you paying at Costco?

https://www.chewy.com/apoquel-oclacitinib-tablets-dogs/dp/173044

The breeder can take the dog from you and breed it twice.  I would have to say no.

We have poodles, because of the no shedding thing for one and the fact that they're very smart, have great personalities and are fun to train - they learn really quickly and are an absolute treat to have in our lives. They have their downsides of course, grooming has to be done regularly - which the wife takes care of.

It's nearly impossible to find a purebred poodle in a shelter or rescue, we looked for several years as we preferred to adopt one that was a couple years old, not a puppy. Virtually all the ones in the shelters are mixes, which bring problems from both breeds. The few that we found that were pure bred were usually at the end of their lives - and I felt so badly for them. A dog that has lived with it's family all its life finds itself in a cage in a strange place because the owner died or went to an assisted living place.....it's horrible to think about. But we had just lost both our 16 year olds within three months of each other and couldn't bear to have to go thru it again within a year or two, so we found.......puppies. <sighs>

We've considered ourselves fairly lucky with the dogs we've had, even tho I just spent $1400 on one getting some teeth issues fixed.....whadya gonna do? My wife has no children of her own, so these are kids in fur suits to her and they live accordingly.

One of ours has some issues with allergies (just like me) and a shot at the vets seems to fix him up, usually spring and fall...... I wish there was a shot I could get that would fix mine!

In reply to ClearWaterMS :

Dozer gets one and a half of the 16mg pills every day and the Costco price is $89 for a 30 day supply.

ClearWaterMS said:

tonight I was at my dog school where I run agility with 2 of my dogs and I had a chance to ask a few of my classmates who all show dogs and have bred dogs as well if what they are asking was a reasonable request.

They said yes it is, stud contracts and show contracts all have their place BUT... most of those dogs have some form of lineage (championship blood lines, the last of a line, etc, etc.) and those dogs should only go to homes that understand what they are getting.  If you're buying a show quality dog from somebody who envisions that the dog will be shown and then accordingly kept intact for breeding, that isn't a typical pet.  

Another person who joined the conversation even went as far as saying that you should go in with eyes wide open.  Those types of expectations are not unusual but are usually reserved for people who have a special affinity for that breed and want to preserve something in the breed.  Those breeders should be helping you select a pet quality dog if you don't want any of those caveats.  

to that person's point buyer beware.  

Thanks for asking around on this for me! The breeder doesn't show much or at all from what I understand, and is not requesting that I would show either. She's building her kennel and is working with another breeder to produce the dogs they want.  

I appreciate the input from everyone. We decided to pass on this dog for a few reasons and I think we made the right decision. And for anyone interested, the breed in question is Silken Windhound. They're a relatively young breed, having started in the 80s and gained their UKC recognition in 2011. Cross bred from Borzoi, Whippets, and a little dash of some sort of collie, they're a small to medium size, long coated sighthound. Think mini Borzoi. Long snouts, narrow bodies, calm and graceful. 

We're talking with another breeder that has a young adult that needs a pet home, and she sounds like a much better fit for us. Both in the intensity/personality of the breeder and in the dog. 

Karacticus said:

Would there be a reduction in price if you signed an agreement that you weren't intending to breed the dog and committed to neutering it at an appropriate age?

Depending on the breeder, this could illicit anything from a furrowed brow to fisticuffs.  Many breeders view neutering the same way a Ferarri owner would view putting a Briggs and Stratton in a 308 GTB, or buying a priceless antique Ming vase and painting it with Glidden.

Once. My father bought a beagle from a breeder of champion rabbit-hunting dogs. That Christmas, he bought mom a coat and gloves lined with genuine rabbit fur. You can guess the outcome; the dog went to the pound that afternoon. Lesson learned: hunting dogs that are bred to live outside and chase game are not ideal as lap dogs. 

Bwahahahaha!

Sorry dog.

pinchvalve (Forum Supporter) said:

Once. My father bought a beagle from a breeder of champion rabbit-hunting dogs. That Christmas, he bought mom a coat and gloves lined with genuine rabbit fur. You can guess the outcome; the dog went to the pound that afternoon. Lesson learned: hunting dogs that are bred to live outside and chase game are not ideal as lap dogs. 

This times 1000.  I bred my rescue AKC Bassett with an AKC Beagle.  The resulting pups were (of course) no longer valuable as breeders, so I sold them for $35 each back in the 80s.  I had one lady come out and marvel at how healthy they were, and she wanted one for her ritzy townhouse as an indoor dog.  I refused to sell it to her.  The guy who ended up buying that pup showed up in a Jeep with two other hounds and 6 field-dressed pheasants.  He plopped the puppy in the back with the other dogs on top of the pheasants, and judging by how healthy and well-trained his hounds were, I knew she would have an absolutely blissful life chasing rabbits, retrieving ducks, and being fed by a fireplace in a cabin somewhere.  He brought her back a couple years later to re-visit her momma.

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

Love that!

We had an opportunity to get one of Lolly's pups. I passed as we didn't really want a third dog, I regret that decision on occasion.

pinchvalve (Forum Supporter) said:

Once. My father bought a beagle from a breeder of champion rabbit-hunting dogs. That Christmas, he bought mom a coat and gloves lined with genuine rabbit fur. You can guess the outcome; the dog went to the pound that afternoon. Lesson learned: hunting dogs that are bred to live outside and chase game are not ideal as lap dogs. 

Facts.  Our shorthaired pointer/sheperd cross requires no less than 1.5 hours daily of active, off-leash running just to get her to a somewhat reasonable baseline, haha.  More is better.  Anything less than 1.5 and some sort of Berkery is imminent, both out of spite and unreleased energy.  She never runs off, but she will mess some stuff up if she's not given proper run to do what she was meant to be-  a tracking, hunting MACHINE.  I once took her on a pretty high-paced mountain bike ride.  My gps said I went 32mi, so with her zig-zagging through the woods, she probably ran closer to 40.  She never faded, happy as a clam.  Sometimes I wonder where her physical limit is, because I've yet to find it.   

There are so many unknowns in breeder "quality" and new owner intelligence.  Buying the right breed based on characteristics not just looks matters.  And there are (hopefully) still breeders of purebreds that are fine with housepets.  On the other hand rescues are just "buy it or it dies" retailers IMHO.  We did a ton of research before getting our first dog, decided on airedale due to intelligence, size and temperament.  We hoped the stubborn and jumping would be minimal.  The breeder was great.  After going thru the grilling process we were deemed acceptable.  She bred dogs but knew that all were not going to have show quality.  The dog turned out to be better than expected.  She loved kids, was easy to train and lived 15 years without a major vet bill.  Only problem was the breed stinks when wet, which was a minor issue as she loved paddleboarding and jumping off.  Year later a rescue dog joined us and was a nightmare.  Ate anything left out.  Raw chicken, anything on the table if we left the room for 5 minutes and even learned to put her foot on the trash can pedal and chow on the contents.  Refused to heel on a leash for everyone but the wife.  Had to be put down at 5 due to pancreas problems which the doc thought were due to inbreeding and the cause of her eating issues.  If we do get another dog it will not be a rescue.  The heartbreak of putting down a dog at 5 years old was too much, and the vet bills were twice the breeder price.

Mezzanine... have you bought or owned a purebred dog before?  I will never judge anyone's choice to do so, but they sometimes come with... um... foibles and faults.

I bought two puppies from one breeder.  She was a dear friend and bred Chihuahuas.  We got to know how she raised them and all of her dogs were absolutely lovely critters with zero inbreeding.  She had a pretty wide network of studs.  The two we bought from her were both undesirable for breeding stock and were sold as pets.  They were absolutely lovely dogs, and both of them lived very long, healthy (but medically expensive) lives.  Sometimes as breeds are developed INTO the traits that are desired, they get defects bred into them as well.  I'm thinking of the hip problems of German Shepherds, knee problems of some Terriers/Chihuahuas, Lipoma frequency in Pit Bulls and Retrievers, not to mention the personality tendencies of some breeds.  Of course, it's more in how they were raised, but there are inherent behaviors that are often associated with certain breeds.  Sheltys tend to be more shy and less trusting, Spaniels tend to use their mouth for defense more often, and Bassetts are just bloody stubborn.

Sorry if I'm explaining something you already know, I just personally choose to get rescues that are not puppies so that I can see what their personality is like after adolescence.  It's kind of the same reason I buy used cars, so I can give the internet time to report on whether or not they're a good buy.

Buying a puppy from a breeder could turn out like buying a 6.0L Powerstroke brand new off the lot and ending up being a regret when the oil cooler ruptures and turns your oil into a milkshake, or getting a brand new EJ Impreza only to realize how many head gaskets it will require.  Getting a rescue mutt is like buying a Corolla that is out of a 2-year lease and the owner experience has already determined they are reliable cars.

Just personal preference.  I've had a dozen dogs in my life and the mutts have always been the best ones.

But again... I offer zero judgment on what YOU want.  

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) : 

I've only had mutts and dogs without any known lineage like the common labs that were everywhere years ago. I posted on this page about the breed: whether it's because it's a younger breed or just an inherent trait, this one is known to be quite healthy with average lifespans of ~15 years. As with most sighthounds, thyroid problems are most common. It's pretty low on the ailment scale given it can be treated with medication that's inexpensive and common. We're looking into another dog with a different breeder that both parents test negative for this genetic predisposition. So, yes, we're considering the foibles of bred dogs. This one has a temperament and activity level that aligns well with our lifestyle. 

I think it's interesting to read the cross section of experiences with breeders, purebred dogs, and rescues here in this thread. There's more anecdotal evidence of issues with rescue dogs than I would have anticipated. Perhaps the outcome is that every dog is rolling the dice? 

As others have said, breeders are weird. It's just how it is. 
I haven't read the whole thread, but I think jHarry3gave the best advice; talk to a few local veterinarians for their thoughts on this, and other breeders.  
My last two dogs came from breeders. Both were (RIP Cody) and are (Comet) great dogs. In both cases we had the choice of 'fixing' the dogs to purchase at a lower price, or in the case of our current dog the breeder gave us a price break if we didn't breed him, but she retained rights to breed him 2 times, and we had lifetime boarding privileges. It was great. If we were going out of town he could go hang with his family and friends. She loved it because she loved the dogs and got to see her puppies for years.

There's no way I'm paying full price and can't breed (no interest) but have to have a unfixed dog (very different behavior patterns) that he/she has the right to breed.

Mezzanine said:

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) : 

I've only had mutts and dogs without any known lineage like the common labs that were everywhere years ago. I posted on this page about the breed: whether it's because it's a younger breed or just an inherent trait, this one is known to be quite healthy with average lifespans of ~15 years. As with most sighthounds, thyroid problems are most common. It's pretty low on the ailment scale given it can be treated with medication that's inexpensive and common. We're looking into another dog with a different breeder that both parents test negative for this genetic predisposition. So, yes, we're considering the foibles of bred dogs. This one has a temperament and activity level that aligns well with our lifestyle. 

 

I think it's interesting to read the cross section of experiences with breeders, purebred dogs, and rescues here in this thread. There's more anecdotal evidence of issues with rescue dogs than I would have anticipated. Perhaps the outcome is that every dog is rolling the dice? 

 

 

what breed are you considering?  its not a boykin is it?  

In reply to porschenut :

Your "buy it or it dies retailers" description tells me you don't actually have much experience with rescues, especially those of the no-kill variety.

What you describe also does not sound like a purebred vs rescue situation, but rather high upfront effort vs low upfront effort situation. Taking any random rescue from any random shelter/person is no different than taking any random purebred from any random 'breeder'.

We've had purebred, county shelter, and private (foster) rescue dogs... Honestly, the foster rescue experience was the best of both worlds for us.

In reply to ClearWaterMS :

Silken Windhound. I added some more info in a post about halfway down the page. 

Here's a windhound in the foreground and a Borzoi in the background. Their coats come in a rainbow of colors. 

Mezzanine said:

Perhaps the outcome is that every dog is rolling the dice?

Anybody who thinks otherwise is living in a confirmation-biased bubble.

Driven5 said:

Mezzanine said:

Perhaps the outcome is that every dog is rolling the dice?

Anybody who thinks otherwise is living in a confirmation-biased bubble.

Yeah... every dog is a roll of the dice, just like humans.  Some are companions for life, others make you want to punch a wall.

Always a good time to share one of my favorite memes: