Help me build a new gaming PC

02Pilot said:

In reply to The0retical :

So the obvious follow-up question is: Is there a significant performance drop going back to the 12th-gen processors? I realize this is sort of an unknown, given your statement about benchmark validity, but I've been completely out of the loop on processor developments in recent years. I'm not looking for bleeding-edge, but I don't want to buy something that's already obsolete.

 

You should be fine with the current gen Intel CPUs since the microcode updates were made available. 

02Pilot said:

In reply to The0retical :

So the obvious follow-up question is: Is there a significant performance drop going back to the 12th-gen processors? I realize this is sort of an unknown, given your statement about benchmark validity, but I've been completely out of the loop on processor developments in recent years. I'm not looking for bleeding-edge, but I don't want to buy something that's already obsolete.

 

(Source)

Premicrocode update there's about a 10% uplift between generations for things like video encoding and other CPU intensive workloads.

For games, it gets a bit more complicated. There's an uplift of 0% to 10% from the 12th to the 13th generation but often no significant uplift from the 13th to 14th generation Intel CPUs. You'll see more of an uplift in the low end and extreme high end (xx900K's).

Honestly, the LGA1700 socket is already deprecated with the release of the new 15th gen ArrowLake processors (they're called Core Ultra 200 something or others, not 15xxx by the marketing wonks) so it's sort of a whatever situation at this point. The new Arrow Lake processors don't appear to offer any sort of performance gains but they're supposedly close to 50% more power efficient.

I wouldn't worry about buying a new 13th or 14th gen cpu personally as long as you apply the update. So if a 13th or 14th gen xx400 or xx600 fits in your budget, I'd say it's a good buy as they offer very similar gaming performance. Check the GN benchmarks for your use case.

If you're doing other workloads than gaming, the 13600 and 14600 rival the 12900's in CPU intensive work loads and are a pretty big step up from the 13400 and 12400.

I'd absolutely stay away from the used 13th and 14th gen chips because you have no idea how old they are or kind of workloads they were exposed to without the update.

Looking at current pricing and the $1k budget I'd probably opt for a 13400F or 14400F ($169 and $176 respectively) and pump the $50-$60 I'm saving over a 13600 or 14600 into a better video card.

Edit: Actually I'd go get the 13400 on sale at Best Buy right now for 130 dollars and use the extra 100 to buy a RX7700.

Great advice here. There was some chat about hard drives and moving files and/or OS's to newer drives. You CAN google it but since I already did I'll share with you what I did. I needed to upgrade my 128 GB SSD that I installed my OS on back in 2018 to a larger drive due to everything that installs on C: drive automatically. Anyway with all the options out there I settled on AOMEI partition assistant. They have a freeware version that is very capable but to migrate an OS you have to upgrade to PRO which is what I did. 70 bucks for a lifetime license, worth every penny and it made it so easy. the link--AOMEI partition assistant 

Another neat piece of software I found myself needing/wanting after I found out all it could do is CPU-Z. If you ever wanted more info on every component in your PC this is the freeware for you. (yes its free) CPU-Z

Bonus that you can download these on your current PC now and used them after you upgrade as well.

In reply to gunner (Forum Supporter) :

Would AOMEI be able to assist in migrating an installed OS to a new computer? I'm strongly in the camp of "just buy a new PC" but I absolutely do not want to go through reinstallation of everything: I'd rather just migrate over to new hardware, keeping my existing hard drives in an array.

With BF approaching, has anyone seen deals on prebuilts? I no longer care to assemble my own rig. 

I'm planning to buy something prebuilt at this point, and very likely on BF. Amazon seems to have a few options around $1500 that are suitable - it's just a question of how big the discounts are.

Happy to hear specific recommendations.

BF deals are active on Amazon. What do we think about this one: iBuypower Slate 8 Mesh ? I don't think I could replicate it for less by building it myself, even with many components on sale as well.

And here's another option: CyberpowerPC Gamer Xtreme . It's pushing my price ceiling, but it's already got the 32gb of RAM that I'd want, so I wouldn't need to buy anything else.

Have you looked at SkyTech? That's where I bought my prebuilt from a few years ago when buying any 30xx card was nearly impossible. Super high quality and came in less than other 2 you just mentioned, but they didn't substitute cheap versions of the parts. 

EDIT: Let me rephrase that. It was very expensive at the time (May 2021 $2800) but it was less $500-600 cheaper than those two brands with basically identical specs. 

In reply to z31maniac :

I had never heard of SkyTech before. I looked at their systems, but they seem priced a bit higher than the ones I posted for comparable specs, at least from my cursory glance. I'll look more carefully tomorrow when I'm not falling asleep.

I'm looking for something similar, but maybe $1k-$1500. I'd also prioritize 64GB RAM, as much of what I do (ahem, CAD) is RAM-hungry. 

02Pilot said:

In reply to z31maniac :

I had never heard of SkyTech before. I looked at their systems, but they seem priced a bit higher than the ones I posted for comparable specs, at least from my cursory glance. I'll look more carefully tomorrow when I'm not falling asleep.

Yeah, could have changed since that was 3.5 years ago. I just know I've been very happy with the purchase.

Well, I pulled the trigger on the iBuyPower unit linked above. I was actually leaning toward the CyberPowerPC, but it's already sold out. I will upgrade the RAM to at least 32gb and add some storage (I'll have to see how much I can transfer over from the old machine (SATA drives)), but it's going to be a major upgrade even straight out of the box.

Thanks for doing the legwork. I pulled the trigger on the same PC and bought 64GB of DDR5 as well. Fusion 360, as well as my really poor browser tab hygiene, consumes a lot of RAM. 

In reply to brandonsmash :

Let me know how you like it. I only held off ordering more RAM because I wanted to see exactly what the motherboard offered in terms of options for additional storage as well. Once I figure that out, I'll order what I need. I'll probably stick to 32gb - that's what I've got in my current machine, and it's never been a limitation.

So I've got the new machine up and running, and getting things transferred over and slowly making it functional. I figured out how to turn off the godawful hippie acid trip lights in the case, but I have not yet managed to figure out how to stop the case fans from running at full speed all the time, and it needs to happen because this thing is loud. It's an ASUS motherboard, so I downloaded their software controller, but all it does is tell me that the range of available speeds for that fan is 1700-1700rpm, which is not helpful. Anyone got any suggestions beyond yanking the wiring off (I already thought of that, but am trying to resist)?

Well, at least make with the deets on how to turn off the lighting! Mine arrived today and I have yet to take it out of the box. 

Maybe something like this, but in English?

https://www.asus.com/support/faq/1034000/

or this?

https://github.com/Karmel0x/AsusFanControl/releases

In reply to brandonsmash :

I tried those - no luck.

Here's the iBuyPower page that got me to killing the lights. Basically, download the nonsensically-named Armory Crate software from ASUS, then go in and kill the lights (excuse me, "Aura"). There's fan control software in there too, but as I said, it lists the fan speed range for the case fan (Fan #2) as essentially fixed.

I'm going off memory here but you might want to try poking around in the BIOS for some fan settings, I seem to remember being able to set some fan curves in there with my ASUS motherboard.

In reply to adam525i :

I looked in there but couldn't find anything that allowed actual changes, except for choosing between DC and PWM modes, about which I know nothing.

You might be past this already, but...

I don't know what you have for Asus software, but mine that I'm sitting at (old) has ASUS AI Suite 3, which looks like this:

Under the Fan Expert (top) there are different fan profiles to choose from in the middle. It might be on the highest setting. You can pick on others and it will change the speeds. But be careful, it might be factory set at top speed to prevent overheating a certain component.

Or the fan might be fixed speed...

I bought a CyberPower gaming system a couple of years ago, it's been great. I usually build my own, but I couldn't build it for that price.

In reply to llysgennad :

Mine looks similar, but the chart for Case Fan #2 shows the PWM at 100% despite the graph indicating it's only calling for 60% (which still seems high for essentially no load). I did find something online about fans being plugged into the wrong type of connector (3-wire vs. 4-wire, DC vs. PWM) and having something like this happen. I'm going to look when I open the case to add the additional RAM and see where it's connected. I may switch it to another plug on the motherboard if I can find something suitable.

You're probably on the right track there.

I looked at the fan setup. It's a bit complicated, I think since these fans have the stupid multicolored lights. The Fan #2 wire runs from a 4-pin header on the motherboard, but there are only three wires. This goes to what I can only assume is an RGB/fan controller board, which then feeds the fans. I left the wires alone.

I went into the BIOS and looked at things there. Fan #2 was set to "Auto Detect" - I switched it to PWM, which seems to have done something, as it has slowed down considerably. That said, the readings in the ASUS control software are still weird, but at this point I'm just happy for the quiet. I'll have to stress the system to see if the case fans spool up when it gets hot.

Related to this, the CPU cooler on this thing is huge and unlike anything I've encountered before:

I wonder if yours is an outlier. I bought the exact same unit and the fans are noisier than my current rig but not obscenely so, and they do vary speed based on load (what little I've seen).

What is frustrating is the RAM. I bought an additional 64GB of DDR5 (Corsair) at the same speed as the T-Force memory that comes from the factory. I figured, hey, if 64 is good, why not 80? Nope. No workie. BIOS recognizes all the RAM but will not POST with all of it installed. It works with the Corsair in position 2 *or* the T-Force in position 1 but not both, no matter how many times I remove and reseat the modules. 

Also annoying: Windows 11 won't find my backup from my Win 10 PC. I even paid for a One Drive subscription. Nope. It finds the backups from my 3 laptops, but not the desktop. Fine, I'll just configure it from scratch. . . *sigh*