T.J. wrote: Any parent with kids in public school is doing their kids a disservice.
Not as long as you supervise the school as closely as you supervise the child. 
T.J. wrote: Any parent with kids in public school is doing their kids a disservice.
Not as long as you supervise the school as closely as you supervise the child.
Fueled by Caffeine wrote: That kid should be thankful. He will now not to have to worry about paying for college. The town and school district of Irving will be providing enough "restitution" that he'll be set for life.
WTF are you talking about? He was public harassed by the authorities and you think that he should be thankful for something that might or might not occur? For him to get said "restitution" he would have to take up another time honored American tradition of suing the E36 M3 out of someone that wronged them. At this point, he would be right to do just that.
In reply to Toyman01:
Thank you for replying to that before I saw it...
So did we find out if it was actually a clock yet?
Toyman01 wrote: Short version. School system over reacts to nothing. Why are you surprised? This is the new normal.
Agreed - Nothing to see here. Move along, move along. All Hail Oceana.
4cylndrfury wrote:Toyman01 wrote: Short version. School system over reacts to nothing. Why are you surprised? This is the new normal.Agreed - Nothing to see here. Move along, move along. All Hail Oceana.
They honestly don't have a choice. The one time they don't over react and something happens, they will be crucified.
Anti-Muslim Mayor, Father with national notoriety because he debated crazy Quran burning Florida preacher, police officer who states something along the lines of "That's who I thought it was" when seeing the kid. The "clock" incident feels like a part of a larger story.
Did it look like this? (This is actually an alarm clock that you can buy)
singleslammer wrote:Fueled by Caffeine wrote: That kid should be thankful. He will now not to have to worry about paying for college. The town and school district of Irving will be providing enough "restitution" that he'll be set for life.WTF are you talking about? He was public harassed by the authorities and you think that he should be thankful for something that might or might not occur? For him to get said "restitution" he would have to take up another time honored American tradition of suing the E36 M3 out of someone that wronged them. At this point, he would be right to do just that.
Yup. This kid just won the legal lottery. Now that he's been invited to the White House, I sense some 7 Figure pay outs.
That still doesn't make this ok. At all.
Hey back before 2000 (but after Columbine) my brother got hauled into the principals office because someone heard him talking about his 35mm that was in the case he was carrying around.
That would be one HELL of a handgun (yeah, camera...)
didnt go any further than that, and yup, schools and zero tolerance are pretty retarded.
Its funny how we have to tolerate a-holes our whole lives, but they teach intolerance through zero tolerance. Noone wants to be responsible for the little thing called "discretion", its been sued out of them.
NOHOME wrote: Did it look like this? (This is actually an alarm clock that you can buy)
Nope:
It's not the most innocent looking thing, but it does appear to be missing something that all bombs have....
...EXPLOSIVES!
The part I can't get over is this (quoting from the BBC story): "Police spokesman James McLellan said that, throughout the interview, Ahmed had maintained that he built only a clock, but said the boy was unable to give a 'broader explanation' as to what it would be used for."
Well, I guess not: at only 14, and looking (from his picture) like a pleasant, respectful young man, he's not quite old enough or cocky enough to say, "Look, guys, there IS no 'broader explanation.' It's a CLOCK. It's used for TELLING TIME. If you think you can also use it to make donuts or something, knock yourself out. Right now, the big hand is on the Stupid and the little hand is on It's time for you to get your head out of your ass. Personally, I've gotta get to math. Have a nice day."
Yea, the police and their allusion of guilt over a kid not giving a "broader explanation" to "it's a clock" is the biggest eye-rolling part to me.
Would have been nice if the school and the cops also would have talked to the science/engineering teacher the kid brought the clock in to show, and who liked it. But I suspect they did, and didn't like that answer of "it's a clock" any better than the kids.
T.J. wrote: Any parent with kids in public school is doing their kids a disservice.
Yay for sweeping bullE36 M3 generalizations! 
Tom_Spangler wrote:T.J. wrote: Any parent with kids in public school is doing their kids a disservice.Yay for sweeping bullE36 M3 generalizations!
Yay I'm a bad parent!!
Toyman01 wrote:4cylndrfury wrote:They honestly don't have a choice. The one time they don't over react and something happens, they will be crucified.Toyman01 wrote: Short version. School system over reacts to nothing. Why are you surprised? This is the new normal.Agreed - Nothing to see here. Move along, move along. All Hail Oceana.
Insert quotes about trees of liberty and what they are refreshed with.
Man times have changed
When I was in highschool chemistry 2 we discussed trinitrotoluene in detail for several days,along with some other notorious volitle compounds, and although we didn't make a sample, it was clear that it wasn't impossible to do at home.
Me and a friend did try to make black powder in his dad's garage. It sort of worked too, I guess we'd be on the no fly list today.
Nice.
Sorry to interrupt a perfectly good rant but we have none – nada – zilch indication of what would have happened if the student with the improvised time keeping device didn’t have a Muslim name.
Maybe his name played a role, maybe it didn’t but everyone should know that the burden of proof lies with the accuser and there clearly is no proof here.
I’m perfectly fine with conjecture but to “be depressed as hell” implies that you’ve drawn a conclusion…a conclusion that’s very disparaging and clearly lacks objective support.
I have a tendency to like people in general and I specifically like you Rob so I hope nobody gets the wrong impression that I’m bent out of shape or anything like that.
However, I do feel the need to interject rational thought here.
ASSUMING the kid received harsh treatment because of his name is absolutely as bad and in the exact same vein of injustice as treating him harshly because of his name…does everyone get that?
Duke wrote:pilotbraden wrote: Those public servants are morons.To be fair, they are serving a public that has proven time and time again that they are hysterically allergic to even the slightest perceived risk, and who are backed by a huge pool of lawyers willing to get rich by pandering to those fears. In other words, we've gotten exactly what we've consistently screamed for and voted for.
This. The poor kid reached the intersection of "Zero Tolerance" and "If you see something say something". I have dozens of stories where my coworkers or I have failed to respond with the proper amount of panic to what a customer, pedestrian or random nut has felt was a security threat or other cases where Emergency Services have had to remove a pizza or piece of trash because some nosey do gooder called the police after a bus driver dismissed their concern of a suspicious package. Somehow a disturbing percentage of the population has high enough self esteem to believe that they are both important enough to attack and that they are out last line of defense against the enemy.
Looking at the clock we have a dangerous movie villan looking briefcase with wires and an ominous digital display. The media went with the terrorist angle because of his name. Had he been white they would have been a Columbine type crazed loner and had the school or police done nothing they would have been guilty of ignoring what was probably a dry run for his plot to see if he could get his suitcase dirty bomb past authorities.
There is a lot of blame to go around but none of the people to blame will recognize that they got what they wanted.
Stealthtercel wrote: Well, I guess not: at only 14, and looking (from his picture) like a pleasant, respectful young man, he's not quite old enough or cocky enough to say, "Look, guys, there IS no 'broader explanation.' It's a CLOCK. It's used for TELLING TIME. If you think you can also use it to make donuts or something, knock yourself out. Right now, the big hand is on the Stupid and the little hand is on It's time for you to get your head out of your ass. Personally, I've gotta get to math. Have a nice day."
While I agree with the general concept of what you are saying, that is exactly what I'd have said at that age. 14 year olds are pretty smart, I've been surprised by quite a few 
That is not a 'home made clock', it is a commercially available alarm clock that has been disassembled and crudely repackaged into a suitcase. It appears that it runs on AC and has a 9VDC backup battery. I hate to be a jerk, but unfortunately that 'clock' has the appearance of an IED. I dare anybody to try and take that through airport security.
RX Reven' wrote: Sorry to interrupt a perfectly good rant but we have none – nada – zilch indication of what would have happened if the student with the improvised time keeping device didn’t have a Muslim name. Maybe his name played a role, maybe it didn’t but everyone should know that the burden of proof lies with the accuser and there clearly is no proof here. I’m perfectly fine with conjecture but to “be depressed as hell” implies that you’ve drawn a conclusion…a conclusion that’s very disparaging and clearly lacks objective support. I have a tendency to like people in general and I specifically like you Rob so I hope nobody gets the wrong impression that I’m bent out of shape or anything like that. However, I do feel the need to interject rational thought here. ASSUMING the kid received harsh treatment because of his name is absolutely as bad and in the exact same vein of injustice as treating him harshly because of his name…does everyone get that?
Totally understood. Again, I really DO try to see all sides of something, but this one just struck me as a stink to high heaven. You're exactly right, we don't know (or will EVER know) if this happened because of his ethnicity or if it's just a zero tolerance. And I would love to believe that it would be applied to anyone. But I really struggle making that assumption. I want to. I really do. But I just can't. Especially with this excerpt from the DMN when they interviewed the kid:
They led Ahmed into a room where four other police officers waited. He said an officer he’d never seen before leaned back in his chair and remarked: “Yup. That’s who I thought it was.”
Now, it could be because the kid was as problem before. And I'm willing to bet the slandering will come out soon enough against him or his family showing that the above statement had merit. I hate to say it, but I HOPE that's the case, that he's a problem kid. Because if not, why would a comment like that be made?
On to a much more pressing issue. Let's say that the exact same thing would happen to any kid at that school. Would it get the media attention it has? Would I have even known it occurred? Of course not. Nobody would know that some kid was hauled off to jail for making a clock. BUT, it would STILL be ridiculous that it happened. I'd have the exact same frustration and anger that we've nanny-stated ourselves into this utter moronic state. That we jail someone for trying to do something cool and impress a teacher or peers at what they've learned. In some ways, his name has been a benefit because we wouldn't have known about it otherwise.
Yeah, I made the comment about his name in the original post. Yes, I'll admit irrational thought that I assumed it played into it (and still lean that way, although I'm trying not to). But it's still sad that it happens in our schools (or hell, pretty much everywhere).
Along those lines, the outpouring of support for this kid (no, not the bobble head politicians looking for brownie points, but astronauts!) has helped to cool my blood. That although idiotic things happen, we as a nation still lean towards the greater good.
-Rob
In reply to RX Reven':
I think my sense of outrage might be less if we could definitively say this was a case of good'ol boys simply hassling a brown kid because he has an Islamic name. It would be much easier to shrug off a handful of racist Texans that showed their true colors and will be dealt with appropriately (which would mean dismissal from their positions of authority in my perfect world). I find the thought that this is a new normal, in which any kid caught with E36 M3ty looking electronics projects on their person get booted out of school and arrested, and everyone thinks that's OK much more troubling.
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