While watching a video of passengers escaping the wreckage of the jet, I see what looks like the engine still running and shooting sparks out the rear. Seems rather odd that the pilots would not have the engine shut down at this point.
Or not?
While watching a video of passengers escaping the wreckage of the jet, I see what looks like the engine still running and shooting sparks out the rear. Seems rather odd that the pilots would not have the engine shut down at this point.
Or not?
Not enough info yet as to why engine was still running.
You're supposed to fly the plane all the way to the scene of the crash. Maybe shutting it down after wasn't a priority.
Maybe the APU was fubar and they kept them at idle for power? Lights, comms, etc...
They would have immediately pulled the throttles to cutoff and probably pulled the fire handles as part of the shutdown and evacuation process. I don't have any personal experience with Airbus, but I don't think there's any mechanical linkage between the cockpit and engines, it's all electronic. They may not have been able to shut it down due to damage from the collision.
I saw on the news this morning that the entire plan was evacuated in 90 seconds. There is a lot of energy stored there so it isn't going to just stop. I think that engine would spin for longer than 90 seconds after cutting power.
In reply to NY Nick :
90 seconds is the design requirement specification. It took more like 5 minutes to get all the passengers out once you factor in the realities of shifting that many humans.
A thought I had was that the engine would pe pulling in cooler air for the people coming down the slide.
That the crew made the snap decision to deploy the three specific slides that they did is pretty impressive. With a crew of 12? someone had to observe, decide, commit, communicate and execute the plan where most of us would still be sitting there going WTF just happened?
I would bet it was crash damage that damaged the plane causing the engine to not shut down.
My understanding is there are eight escape doors on that plane. Law requires you to be able to evacuate all the passengers only using half of the doors in 90 seconds. From what I read they only had three doors available and they got all 300+ passengers out in under 90 seconds. A huge Kudos to the flight crew. This will be studied for years as a how to do it right case.
I watched the linked video but didn't see a video of the engine turning, just the pic. I doubt that engine was under power any longer, they would have had to cut fuel and I'm sure initiated the fire suppression. They turn really easy, like you can turn it with your hand so without video showing how fast it's going it is hard to tell what is going on. Could be spooling down, could be wind milling, I guess it could be running but that would shock me.
Nick, go to 0:30 in the video, view of the front of the plane, it looks spinning. But even after shut down, does if gyro for a few minutes after?
dean1484 said:I would bet it was crash damage that damaged the plane causing the engine to not shut down.
My understanding is there are eight escape doors on that plane. Law requires you to be able to evacuate all the passengers only using half of the doors in 90 seconds. From what I read they only had three doors available and they got all 300+ passengers out in under 90 seconds. A huge Kudos to the flight crew. This will be studied for years as a how to do it right case.
I presume the passengers were Japanese. They are very good at making things run well, and making use of all the space available.
Buncha fat Americans would still be jammed in the doors, yelling at each other.
Fat Canadians would be, "You go first." "No, I insist, after me."
Somebody is going to be in deep, deep trouble for letting those planes hit each other.
This sort of evacuation is exactly what cabin attendants are for. They're not there to serve drinks, they're there to evacuate the plane as fast as possible - as Dean said, 90 seconds with only half the available exits. This includes memorized scripts and a command voice.
I worked as a cabin attendant as a summer job for a couple of years. Six weeks of safety training. And an afternoon on drink/meal service. I still remember where the manual gear release is on C-FRST, even if the plane has been scrapped.
I saw a news report citing the fact that recent U.S. passenger evacuations were hampered by people who took their carry-ons with them. Doubt the Japanese would flout the rules to that degree. "People could die if I don't follow the rules--I don't care, I really like those shoes" doesn't really seem like the vibe in a society that values conformity in the interest of the common good.
Margie
In reply to 914Driver :
Yeah That engine looks like it is just spooling down to me. If it was under power it would be moving way more air. For scale that engine has a 118" fan on the front of it. Here is the spec sheet stolen form Wikipedia. That thing weighs 16,000 lbs. ! Much of that (I don't know the %) is rotating mass that was spinning around at 2,700, 8,200 or 12,600 RPM with no brake and minimal friction.
Jets will continue to run until commanded to stop. They're self-igniting from air pressure, so unless you have direct control of the fuel, they can keep running. I agree with Nick, though. It's not really making much thrust, so it's probably just exhausting the last of the fuel in whatever broken fuel line is hanging off the wing.
Keith Tanner said:I worked as a cabin attendant as a summer job for a couple of years.
dang, that's a long summer!
every aircraft goes through a full on live person test to ensure they can get the full passenger load off in 90 seconds.. It's berkeleying chaos.. but it is the right thing to do.
Soure: worked for company that made emergency slides and rafts for aircraft. I worked for the repair and service side.
In reply to Appleseed :
OMG that was incredible. today i am thankful for you posting that.
Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:Jets will continue to run until commanded to stop. They're self-igniting from air pressure, so unless you have direct control of the fuel, they can keep running. I agree with Nick, though. It's not really making much thrust, so it's probably just exhausting the last of the fuel in whatever broken fuel line is hanging off the wing.
I also wonder if it could have been a partial runon from the fuel in the Dash-8's wings that it had just ingested.
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:In reply to Appleseed :
OMG that was incredible. today i am thankful for you posting that.
And that was with French passengers. Anyone who's been to France can attest that orderly lines just aren't their thing :)
In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :
“We’re all dead!”
If it was a spirit or frontier flight, everyone would be dead
DirtyBird222 said:If it was a spirit or frontier flight, everyone would be dead
Pretty much any domestic US airline. People were acting like complete idiots back when I left the industry 20 years ago. It's several orders of magnitude worse now.
BenB said:DirtyBird222 said:If it was a spirit or frontier flight, everyone would be dead
Pretty much any domestic US airline. People were acting like complete idiots back when I left the industry 20 years ago. It's several orders of magnitude worse now.
Yea but have you been on a Spirit or Frontier flight lately? I recently took a redeye from Orlando to Vegas for work on Frontier and it was the 7th layer of hell. From the terminal to landing. At least people on the Southwest flight back weren't acting a fool the whole time.
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