Teach me about doing hardwood floors

Our house is kind of a split level on a hill. The bottom story is carpet as is a little 8x10 room off the main floor. I want to get rid of the carpet. Both these parts are on slabs (the rest of the main floor is a crawlspace). What do I need to know about hardwood? How hard is it to install? Should I consider engineered hardwood? The bonus room would really need to match the main hardwood. Is that possible or are there some tricks to make it work?

so the two rooms are same level or separated by stairs? If separated by even a few stairs no one will notice slightly different floors. 

Robbie said:

so the two rooms are same level or separated by stairs? If separated by even a few stairs no one will notice slightly different floors. 

Well it is three rooms. Two downstairs separated by stairs. The little 8x10 is directly connected to the existing hardwood.

Depending on moisture levels, it may not be advisable to install hardwood over a slab.  An engineered product may fare better. 

1988RedT2 said:

Depending on moisture levels, it may not be advisable to install hardwood over a slab.  An engineered product may fare better. 

On a similar subject, the slab floor on my cabin sweats in the spring and fall.  Is DRICORE the best option, placed under an new floor.

This is an option for the basement also, but it adds another $1.5/sq ft to the cost.

Vinyl flooring is better for moist areas but I don't think it will help my sweating problem.

Floating engineered pre-finished floor with a moisture barrier on top of the slab. 

Here’s why:

- Gluing solid wood to a concrete surface is a bad idea

- Adding furring strips to the concrete to attach the floor makes the floor thickness too much to match adjacent areas

- Wood will only have finish on the top (visible) surface. The exposed raw bottom will absorb moisture from the slab, and the floor will eventually warp. 

- Prefinished because sanding flooring in place is a specialized skill that requires experience, equipment, and/or money. Plus, the bottom will still not have a finish

- Engineered is typically thinner than solid wood. This sounds like a bad thing, but it is actually a good thing because of your stairs.  Adding 3/4” of solid wood to the floor at the bottom will mean your last stair riser is 3/4” smaller than the risers in the rest of the stair run. Risers should not vary more than 3/8” in a run (although they will when you add flooring- it’s just better to add 3/8” flooring than 3/4” flooring)

I would strongly consider a product like Pergo- Kinda looks like wood, but is completely waterproof both top and bottom  

Good Luck!

akylekoz said:

1988RedT2 said:

Depending on moisture levels, it may not be advisable to install hardwood over a slab.  An engineered product may fare better. 

On a similar subject, the slab floor on my cabin sweats in the spring and fall.  Is DRICORE the best option, placed under an new floor.

This is an option for the basement also, but it adds another $1.5/sq ft to the cost.

Vinyl flooring is better for moist areas but I don't think it will help my sweating problem.

Dricore is a good product but pricey. We used Platon which is a rolled plastic material with 1/4" divots and then put tongue and groove OSB over top of that, then fastened the sandwich down with countersink tapcons. On top of that you can put down whatever flooring you'd like. For our purposes we used quietwalk underlayment and a click-lock laminate flooring which made the basement space nice and quiet and comfortable. Platon is in the $.50/sf range and OSB is in the $.50/sf range so you save about $.50/sf over the Dricore.

SVreX said:

Floating engineered pre-finished floor with a moisture barrier on top of the slab. 

Here’s why:

- Gluing solid wood to a concrete surface is a bad idea

- Adding furring strips to the concrete to attach the floor makes the floor thickness too much to match adjacent areas

- Wood will only have finish on the top (visible) surface. The exposed raw bottom will absorb moisture from the slab, and the floor will eventually warp. 

- Prefinished because sanding flooring in place is a specialized skill that requires experience, equipment, and/or money. Plus, the bottom will still not have a finish

- Engineered is typically thinner than solid wood. This sounds like a bad thing, but it is actually a good thing because of your stairs.  Adding 3/4” of solid wood to the floor at the bottom will mean your last stair riser is 3/4” smaller than the risers in the rest of the stair run. Risers should not vary more than 3/8” in a run (although they will when you add flooring- it’s just better to add 3/8” flooring than 3/4” flooring)

I would strongly consider a product like Pergo- Kinda looks like wood, but is completely waterproof both top and bottom  

Good Luck!

All of this. 

SVreX said:

Floating engineered pre-finished floor with a moisture barrier on top of the slab. 

Here’s why:

- Gluing solid wood to a concrete surface is a bad idea

- Adding furring strips to the concrete to attach the floor makes the floor thickness too much to match adjacent areas

- Wood will only have finish on the top (visible) surface. The exposed raw bottom will absorb moisture from the slab, and the floor will eventually warp. 

- Prefinished because sanding flooring in place is a specialized skill that requires experience, equipment, and/or money. Plus, the bottom will still not have a finish

- Engineered is typically thinner than solid wood. This sounds like a bad thing, but it is actually a good thing because of your stairs.  Adding 3/4” of solid wood to the floor at the bottom will mean your last stair riser is 3/4” smaller than the risers in the rest of the stair run. Risers should not vary more than 3/8” in a run (although they will when you add flooring- it’s just better to add 3/8” flooring than 3/4” flooring)

I would strongly consider a product like Pergo- Kinda looks like wood, but is completely waterproof both top and bottom  

Good Luck!

Awesome thanks.

So something like this. Does it have to be the laminate?

https://na.pergo.com/laminate/detail/29002-265075/wheaton-oak

https://na.pergo.com/hardwood/detail/28900-264973/butterscotch-oak-225

Here is where the rooms are.

This is 8x10 room

Downstairs

Can't remember the brand name but I had the flooring in my house replaced a year or so ago. Bedrooms and closets got new carpet. Bathrooms and laundry room got ceramic tile. Kitchen/breakfast nook was already ceramic tile and left alone. Living room, dining room and hallways got hardwood flooring. Because there are grandkids at the house all the time we wanted something more durable than standard hardwood that dents and scratches pretty easily. We went with the engineered hardwood. It's kinda like plywood in construction with the top layer stained. All wood though. Very durable. Doesn't dent or scratch easily. More expensive than regular hardwood though but worth it to me. Has tolerated my grandsons (ages 3 & 6) toy cars (matchbox and hot wheels) and other objects being pushed, dragged, dropped & thrown across it and has not scratched or dented. Yet. My house is a crawlspace and this was glued down.

Does anyone make an engineered, snap-together, hardwood-look-alike floor with integrated electric heat elements? Cuz that would be mega-sweet. 

I have seen a couple of solutions (not my house).  A waterproof solid vinyl snap-together plank system and wood grained ceramic tiles.  Both were amazingly wood-like in appearance and would handle moisture fine.

I was told by the homeowner that the vinyl planks were bullet proof.  The ceramic tile is, well, ceramic tile, so will have all the benefits / downfalls of ceramic materials.

My brother laid an electric radiant mat product under the ceramic tile in his bathroom which seems to work well.  Can't imagine that something similar that would work with vinyl planks, but would check with the manufacturer of the planks before I did.

I usually agree with svrex on construction stuff since we’re both professionals, but pergo and other laminates are on my list of absolutely never touch it and no matter how you treat them they eventually die from humidity or not catching a spill in time or putting your wet boots on a rug by the door or your disposal/dishwasher/laundry leaking.  

you’re in a perfect situation for an LVP, I really prefer CORETec to any other brand i have installed because of quality of pieces, ease of install, and the wear layer thickness.  

In reply to Patrick :

Ha!

I agree that LVP would be a good solution here. (But he asked about hardwood!)

SVreX said:

In reply to Patrick :

Ha!

I agree that LVP would be a good solution here. (But he asked about hardwood!)

But laminate isn’t hardwood either, as much as realtors like to tell people it is

In reply to Patrick :

Correct. 

But I started with engineered wood which IS hardwood (arguably. At least a veneer.)

I switched to laminate because it’s an identical floating installation process and more resistant to moisture. 

But sure. If we’re gonna go completely off the tracks, LVP is a great option. 

I also suggested the laminate or engineered floating system because the OP was insistent the material be the same in both the lower level AND the upper level. 

The lower level is concrete. The upper one is wood. LVP is perfect on concrete, but less than perfect on wood. 

The ONE product that would do BOTH levels well is a floating floor, and the one floating floor that is moisture resistant is laminate. 

I agree LVP is great on concrete. Not so much on wood. 

SVreX said:

I also suggested the laminate or engineered floating system because the OP was insistent the material be the same in both the lower level AND the upper level. 

The lower level is concrete. The upper one is wood. LVP is perfect on concrete, but less than perfect on wood. 

The ONE product that would do BOTH levels well is a floating floor, and the one floating floor that is moisture resistant is laminate. 

I agree LVP is great on concrete. Not so much on wood. 

I'm thinking replacing my flooring with LVP. Waterproof and scratch resistance with kids and dogs is why I am considering it. I have 23/32 t&g osb sturd-i-floor over 24"oc floor trusses. Any problems using LVP over this subfloor? Why do you say LVP is not good over wood?

Thanks

In reply to old_ :

LVP telegraphs imperfections through it. So much so, that you can sometimes read the wood grain of the subfloor. 

When wood subfloor expands and contracts, it can open small gaps in the LVP. 

It can be done, but LVP’s greatest use is on concrete bases. 

OSB sturdi-floor is not a suitable subfloor for any glue down vinyl product. The imperfections are too big. 

I’ve lived with hardwood for the last two houses. My main advice is to get the fluffiest fuzziest slippers you can find. You may have to go to the women’s footwear and get a nice neutral gray. I HATE stepping onto a hard floor first thing in the morning. I hate it even more if it’s cold. Therefore I hate my hardwood floor that my wife loves. BUT she’s stronger and smarter than me so slippers it is for ole Steve-o here.  /rant

In reply to SVreX :

I was looking at a product like mohawk solidtech or similar. It's a vinyl plank with a solid/ridgid core and attached pad. The planks interlock on all sides and it is installed fully floating. Each plank is something like ~1/4-3/8" thick. Similar to "LifeProof" sold at home depot. Any thoughts on this type of LVP?

In reply to old_ :

If it’s a floating floor, it should work (although I would use the underpayment with it). 

I was referring to glue down. 

There's a little bit of confusion so far so hopefully this helps.

Solid hardwood - a chunk of wood (3/4" thick usually) that is milled for tongue and groove. This will not work on concrete as already stated. It is the least stable of any option, meaning it will expand and contract with the weather and is less moisture tolerant.

Engineered hardwood - plywood core with a wood veneer (can be 3/8" to 1/2" thick). Plywood is more dimensionally stable so it can be glued, floated, nailed, stapled, whatever. This is the route I'd go if you want wood.

Laminate - HDF core with a paper image to create the visual, and a wear layer/texture stamped together. Generally they are very durable but can swell if the are submerged in water. However, they make these in water resistant styles where the core is immersed in resin to make it more tolerant.

LVP floating - The recommendation above for Coretec is a good one. They were the first to come out with a composite rigid core LVP and it has a cork pad attached. There are a ton of products that are similar but I think there's is the most reliable. That stuff is easy to install, is inexpensive, looks good, and is durable.

Another option for the slabs is wood look tile. No moisture problems there and some people, some people that are not me, really really like it.