Tipping is starting to really pick me

Steve_Jones said:

Duke said:

We went to Friendly's a couple months ago and not only was the meal pretty overpriced, but the  suggested tips at the bottom of the receipt were not correct by a fair margin.

They had the usual 15% = X / 18% = Y / 20% = Z pre-calculated amounts, but if you checked the math they actually reflected about 19% / 22% / 25%.

I told the manager we were never coming back.

 

Lots of times they calculate it on the after tax amount, which is pretty shady in itself. 

That was going to be my rant. It's always calculated on the after tax amount, at least here. Why would I pay a tip on the tax?

He said I had to download the online menu and order

I'm out 

I wonder if  excessive "forced" tips is doing a disservice to the wait staff that truly bust their butt to provide you with service in a sit down restaurant. I am curious if these servers have seen a decline in tips due to the proliferation of tip jars/auto tips.

Last night, a large group from my past life met at a restaurant/bar. The waitress never missed a beat. I didn't even realize that my ice tea had been refilled. She was very receptive to taking a few pictures for our group.  I tipped 25%+ but even when I pay by CC I pay the tip in cash.

Peabody said:

He said I had to download the online menu and order

I'm out 

"Sorry, I left my phone at home"

I'm so sick of qr code menus.

In reply to Steve and Peabody :

Yeah, this was in Delaware, so no tax. Just fraud or at least super sketch.

I tip well.

However, I'm starting to get really pissed at automated tipping. The servers often don't receive this- it's a windfall for the restaurant that is never given to the servers. 

Ask servers how much they get.  Often it's $0 (or sometimes split among entire staff)

berkeley that. 

I liked how it was in Germany. Tips were legitimately gratuities.

Wait staff got paid a fair hourly wage. There would usually be *some* tip, but it was recognized as being legitimately extra.

Usually you'd just round up to the nearest Euro. Maybe throw a little extra on top for good service. This was especially easy, since most people were paying with cash.

My experience was with a Chili's at a small airport. I had to eat and it was the only restaurant, so I either worked part time for my food, or had McDonalds which I try to avoid as I travel a lot and it will kill you eventually. I did note when I walked by later that there was a large sign warning that all transactions were by smart phone only. I guess they can run their business as they see fit but to expect a large tip on top was too much for me and the outrage was summoned. 

And justified 

Beer Baron said:

I liked how it was in Germany. Tips were legitimately gratuities.

Wait staff got paid a fair hourly wage. There would usually be *some* tip, but it was recognized as being legitimately extra.

Usually you'd just round up to the nearest Euro. Maybe throw a little extra on top for good service. This was especially easy, since most people were paying with cash.

I came here to say this, but you phrased it more innocuously than I would have.  I would have said something that locked the thread in 4.28 hours.

Grtechguy said:

I also agree with the tipping trend has gone exessive.

 

I say get rid of it altogether and adjust goods/services accordingly.     You're not going to guilt me into tipping when there's no "service" provided.

But how else can they get people to work for them for $2.15 an hour?

ShawnG said:

Peabody said:

He said I had to download the online menu and order

I'm out 

"Sorry, I left my phone at home"

I'm so sick of qr code menus.

You want to put your app on my phone, there is a $3000 per visit fee from me for that.

Then either help fix the industry or don't eat at restaurants. Airports are as bad as theme parks for having a captive audience designated to take maximum profits.

I'm sure there's some policy put in place with covid to handling menus, restaurants saw a boost in profit potential and ran with it. Once you get that on paper it's not going away because some accountant won't let it come back as an added cost item. The guy making $7.50 an hour has no say in it.

It'll eventually get automated but then people will complain that it is eliminating jobs.

Capitalism gonna capitalize.

johndej said:

Then either help fix the industry or don't eat at restaurants. Airports are as bad as theme parks for having a captive audience designated to take maximum profits.

I'm sure there's some policy put in place with covid to handling menus, restaurants saw a boost in profit potential and ran with it. Once you get that on paper it's not going away because some accountant won't let it come back as an added cost item. The guy making $7.50 an hour has no say in it.

It'll eventually get automated but then people will complain that it is eliminating jobs.

Capitalism gonna capitalize.

Sometimes capitalism is not actually taking place, such as a limited entry location like inside the secure zone of an airport where not everyone can easily set up shop. If there are 10 restaurants on the street all competing in a true free market economy I can go to each one of the 10 and decide who gets my business. I suspect in that situation the service would generally be excellent and the tips would be earned. But in some cases such as the one I described capitalism is not happening and businesses take advantage of people with limited options. 

I speak as someone who earned a living waiting tables for 2 years, and who has been a small business owner for over 30. I have never been in the fortunate position of being able to cause people to pay more just because I was the only option.

In the flipside,  I never ,  ever could wait tables. I never wanted to be paid poverty wages and be subject to someone's whims if i did a good enough job so I can pay rent that month.

Berk that.

If we go out to eat, which is less and less these days, I make sure I have cash.  The bill goes on my card if it's large enough, but the tip is always in cash. 

In reply to volvoclearinghouse :

Yup. Same here. I want the people who did a good job to get it.

I usually didn't tip if I called an order in for counter pickup then my daughter got a job at the local Thai restaurant and it was the stories you'd expect.  A $200 party order with no tip then a $20 order with a $10 tip.   

So now I tip at carry out food cause of my kid even though she was minimum wage.

Appleseed said:

In the flipside,  I never ,  ever could wait tables. I never wanted to be paid poverty wages and be subject to someone's whims if i did a good enough job so I can pay rent that month.

Berk that.

Around here, if I take my wife or family out for a meal, and the waitstaff gets to keep the tip, then that waiter is going to be making $40+ an hour, at least during my visit. The size of my family, or the places I take my wife to on a date, plus the state minimum of $15, means that my bill is always going to be over $100 and a 20% tip. $20+$15+ other tables is over $40 an hour. Which is more than I made until a few years ago. (Again, this assumes the waitstaff gets 100% of the tip)

My kids work back of house at a nice steak shop, they get $15 an hour doing prep work and zero tips. And they're quite happy with it.

I have issue with other starter places like Papa Murphy's using Square and defaulting to 22%. You've done nothing but the job of taking my order and assembling my pizza. Zero extra. (and the local had a tiny sign warning that tips didn't go to employees which is extra scuzzy)

IMHO, COVID has completely rewritten the rules of tipping. Used to be, I tipped well for great service and would skimp for bad service. It was a message to the server that they needed to work a little harder at being competent at their job to earn more money. Today, I go out to eat with a server a lot less, but I tip 30% and in cash. Its harder and harder to get servers, let alone good ones, so I make sure it is worth their while so they keep doing it. 

The lack of servers has seen the rise of counter service and even self-service options. A tip is more of a thank you for showing up and allowing me to eat out at all. I tip the person at Panera...they slice and toast my bagel and they got there at 7 am. Same with Dunkin, they were there at 5am making my donut. My daughter worked at Rita's Italian Ice and tips were pretty important to her. Sure, she was making minimum wage, but was 16 and was busy dealing with a million kids. She was super friendly and helpful and tips made sense. 

But at a fast-food restaurant where I order the food myself, and pick it up myself, and get my own drink? That's a lot tougher. The kitchen staff is not making less than minimum wage like a server. I want to thank them for being able to eat out, but 30%? even 18%? I mean, the folks at Wal Mart are doing the same thing, stocking shelves and working registers so I can shop, and they don't have a hand out. I eat at Sheetz and GetGo all the time, they are cooking my food to order, and not asking for a tip. I blame the whole thing on Square and the other check-out apps. 

Johnboyjjb said:

Around here, if I take my wife or family out for a meal, and the waitstaff gets to keep the tip, then that waiter is going to be making $40+ an hour, at least during my visit. The size of my family, or the places I take my wife to on a date, plus the state minimum of $15, means that my bill is always going to be over $100 and a 20% tip. $20+$15+ other tables is over $40 an hour. Which is more than I made until a few years ago. (Again, this assumes the waitstaff gets 100% of the tip)

Out of curiosity, how many hours a week can they sustain that?  I'm assuming that's at peak busy times, which are only several hours per day, and some days none at all?

A lot is effects from the pandemic for sure, but also theautomated card-reader screens too. Wherever you see one of those there's pressure to put a tip line, and usually a preselected one that gives only "custom" for less than 20% locally.

I have encountered tip lines like this at placed I'd never tip, like college sports games concessions and grocery stores locally. 

Yeah it's out of hand. 

Most food service places pool tips. Whether credit card or cash, it generally gets split between all tipped staff (with servers and bartenders taking a larger portion than bussers and barbacks).

Some places will then divvy up those tips based on specific shifts or specific hours worked. This is more likely to happen with cash than credit card, but not necessarily.

Very frequently, tips are pooled for a full day, and then divided amongst staff based on total hours worked that day.

It is fairly unlikely that the especially large or especially small tip you leave sends a message exclusively to that one server you dealt with.

That said, most management knows which of their staff is especially good and will give them peak hours or days of special events that will lead to them on shifts that divvy up larger pools.

Servers and bartenders generally aren't bothered by this and usually prefer it for the sake of simplicity. You may see yourself as interacting with one server or one bartender, but the staff will tend to see themselves as working as a team.

In reply to Beer Baron :

Yeah, that's my understanding too.  I don't really understand the insistence on tipping cash since most places pool tips as you describe, including CC tips.

I also don't know how people are sure management keeps tips instead of distributing them to staff.

In reply to Duke :

Because I have asked. 
 

It is illegal for restaurants to keep tips. However, automatic gratuity is not considered a tip by the IRS. It is considered a service fee, and is therefore the property of the restaurant, not the server. 
 

Automatic gratuity

A tip is something the customer chooses to do voluntarily.  A service fee is a required fee the customer doesn't get to choose.

How carefully do you read your bill?