Working from home...?

Been WFH since mid March.

Would I take a paycut to WFH?  Probably not right now because it actually would increase my driving to take my son to school/daycare vs. just dropping him off on the way.

Is it a preferable work environment to work?  Hell no.  Its way less productive if you work on a collaborative team.

It it convenient?  Yeah.  I can have a contractor show up to do some work and I am right here to meet them.  I can do little chores between meetings once in a while.  Its also great that it doesn't necessarily need to be from home.  I can work from somewhere else on a friday or monday to allow for an extended weekend.

Hate it. 

Well, I hate being forced to WFH all the time. 

If I had it my way, I'd work from the office on days I'm feeling distracted and work from home on the days I want to get personal stuff done. 

I love that I can get in a solid 1-hr MTB ride at lunch and not worry about being sweaty or dusty. 

I hate that there are home projects that are right in front of me that I need to ignore until 5PM. Our toddler goes to daycare still, so during the day, you can get a lot of personal projects done without distraction...but you need to work. As soon as the work day is done, the toddler is home, and all the house projects get put on hold until she is asleep. 

What I really should do is shift my schedule to start at like 6AM, work straight through lunch, and be done at 2PM so I've got 3 hours to work around the house or go on longer rides. 

The part I dislike most is I used to be able to ask a question or get an opinion from the person in the next office by just walking over and talking to them.  What used to take 30 seconds can now take hours, as you're waiting for them to respond to an email or a zoom request or whatever.  I'm an engineer, and my work normally entails creating, looking at or marking up large drawings, all of which are inconvenient and slow to do on a computer screen.

stuart in mn said:

The part I dislike most is I used to be able to ask a question or get an opinion from the person in the next office by just walking over and talking to them.  What used to take 30 seconds can now take hours, as you're waiting for them to respond to an email or a zoom request or whatever.  I'm an engineer, and my work normally entails creating, looking at or marking up large drawings, all of which are inconvenient and slow to do on a computer screen.

This is the biggest problem I've really come across, which is why I have very hard time believing any productivity increases being claimed. I've met many coworkers small children as they walk into the middle of a meeting on Zoom. Or everyone is distracted by someone else in someone's home is making a lot of noise..............many Europeans don't live in standalone homes like Americans do, lots of apartments and noticeably smaller ones as well.

But I still only had this option 2 days out of 5 anyway. My boss and I WFH Mondays/Friday's, the devs and PMs did on Wednesday's. So Tue/Thurs were really the only days everyone was in the office. 

I'm currently mentoring a writer in Canada.........it's not uncommon for me to ask her to check on something (seeing that she is online and available), only to have the message ignored for an hour or two, she signs off, then doesn't respond until the next day. 

stuart in mn said:

 I'm an engineer, and my work normally entails creating, looking at or marking up large drawings, all of which are inconvenient and slow to do on a computer screen.

This should be a lot faster on a computer screen, if you have the right processes in place.  I have spent a lot of my time in engineering working to eliminate paper drawings.  Large drawings in particular.

(the above applies working in the office as well)

I've been working from home since March, when the pandemic shutdowns started. I was commuting 1.5hrs each way into the city on the train, and spending a fortune on the commute and parking at the train station. We just heard today that they are keeping us home for the rest of 2020, and we will go back "sometime in 2021", and even then, we won't be going back full time. To me, that was music to my ears! My company hasn't skipped a beat with the transition, since we leverage tech heavily anyway.

I like working from home. I went from driving a ton a couple years ago (Averaged 26k mi/yr on my poor Mazda), to dealing with taking the train into town last year, to rolling out of bed and being "at work". It's like a dream come true, to be honest. The coffee doesn't suck, I can blast Iron Maiden all day if I want to without people getting mad, and I don't have to deal with stupid/crazy people on the commute, unless I get in my own way.

There are pros and cons:

Pros:
-Soul sucking commute is gone!!!
-I have more time to get things done at work and it's easier to concentrate (I have no kids and my wife still goes to her job)
-Flexibility to get things done mostly on my own time
-Productivity has drastically increased
-Despite spending more time at work, I have more time outside of work to do all sorts of stuff
-My dog is happier because I'm home
-I'm saving a ton of money not commuting

Cons:
-No in-person meetings; haven't seen my coworkers in person in months. I actually like my team, and miss getting beer/lunch with them.
-People expect you to be available all the time, even after-hours "since you are home..."
-Have to make time to separate from the computer sometimes

I am working from my kitchen table with a laptop, portable monitor, and a wireless keyboard and mouse. Tried working from my game room for a few months, but the couch in there hurt my back, so I moved to the kitchen. I don't really have a spot for a desk right now, so this works well enough. The 2nd monitor is a must. I had two externals at the office, and I miss having that 3rd screen, but I manage. As far as interaction with coworkers goes, we use Slack for that, as well as a number of other tools. I like it a lot, but YMMV.

C/N: WFH is pretty cool. It's not for everyone, but it's definitely for me.

I've been working from home 2-3 days a week for a few years. I asked about WFH full time and was told that while I could handle it my boss wasn't so sure about my co-workers. Basically, he didn't want to deal with the politics of telling some people no. I was already set up pretty well at home, dedicated desk, dual 24" monitors, etc. My kids are both in high school. They barely come out of their rooms even when they aren't in school ;^). I leave my door open unless I'm in a meeting. We use Slack to ask quick questions and share screens so it really isn't much harder than being in the office. 

I save 2-3 hours a day not having to commute. I also save 20-25k miles a year WFH. That alone has had a huge effect on my sense of well being. 

My company has said that they will not open the US offices until 2021 at the earliest. Everyone will have the option to WFH even after they do. I honestly don't see myself going back to the office very often. Maybe 1-2 times a month and only for a couple hours at that.

Work life balance is key. Life is a marathon, not a sprint. I've been preaching that for years. I've turned down a couple really well known tech companies because their W/L balance SUCKED. Absolute E36 M3 show. A friend and I called it Valleyitus. People come to the Silicon Valley and thing that if they work 12 hour days 7 days a week that they will retire at 40. NFW I'm dealing with that. 

I've worn shorts/jeans and a tee shirt to work for the last 25 years. There's NFW I'm ever wearing a suit or uniform ever again. 

^Yep. Same here, even when our offices open back up, since my lady has RA, we have been told we can continue to work from home if ourselves or a family member is at risk. 

I'm hoping this will lead to full-time WFH for me and mean in a few years the lady and I will be able to move somewhere that maybe isn't great for local/in-office jobs, but is smaller, cheaper, etc. 

Regarding the lack of response:
I don't know about how other companies do it, but we use Google Chat.  If I'm in a meeting, often times I ignore chat as much as I can so I can focus on or drive the meeting.  If I'm in a one on one, I totally ignore chat to focus on my people.  So, if someone's not replying, they may be focused elsewhere.

When the meeting's over, chat has now blown up and I'm slogging through pages and pages of chat to get caught up.  It can easily suck up an hour or more of my time to get caught up and now I'm going into another meeting or behind just catching up.  I know there's a lot I miss.  I often tell my folks, if I'm missing something, ping me directly.  Even if it's just a "Hey, there's a fire going on over here". 

Everybody I work with has heard me say, "I can't multi-task.  The 8080 processor in my brain does not multithread"

-Rob

In reply to rob_lewis :

We used Chat for a while, but found it to be annoying to manage chats with multiple team members. Being on the Tech Team in my company, we got to try out a bunch of different alternatives until we found something we liked, and ended up settling on Slack. Some people out there hate it, but I love it. It's allowed us to collaborate amazingly well, especially now that everyone's WFH. 

ProDarwin said:

stuart in mn said:

 I'm an engineer, and my work normally entails creating, looking at or marking up large drawings, all of which are inconvenient and slow to do on a computer screen.

This should be a lot faster on a computer screen, if you have the right processes in place.  I have spent a lot of my time in engineering working to eliminate paper drawings.  Large drawings in particular.

(the above applies working in the office as well)

My problem with it is I don't have a monitor that's 32 x 24 inches....to view a big drawing, you either have to zoom out so the details and text are too small to read, or else it's like looking through a porthole at a small section of the drawing.  Also, my red pen doesn't work well on a monitor screen.    I'm old school, I need to have a hard copy laid out on my desk to be able to work efficiently.

stuart in mn said:

My problem with it is I don't have a monitor that's 32 x 24 inches....to view a big drawing, you either have to zoom out so the details and text are too small to read, or else it's like looking through a porthole at a small section of the drawing.  

I get that.  Using a 3D mouse you can pan and zoom crazy fast though.  And any small delay here is more than made up for with the timesavings of not needing to use real paper.

*steps down from soapbox*

Engineer working from home. 

I had just spent a few $100k more on a house to cut my commute from 40min one way to 5.  Still rather be here, but the commute benefit is nil. 

I also do not have a dedicated space in this house, and have a live-in GF wfh and a 1st grader distance learning. Focused time is mostly non-existent between 7:30am and 9pm.  My days have become long and scattered. 
 

WFH would be great if I wasn't also managing elementary school with a strong-willed little kid. 
 

headphones: I really wanted over-ear, with boom mic and mute, Bluetooth headset, $100ish. Proved really hard to find, bought an Avantree set that meets requirements but I'm told my voice breaks up if I'm more than a few feet from the computer. Which is a shame since I get 50-75 feet of audio range. 

I’m a bit older, my kids are both in their 20’s so condolences to those with young ones.   I’ve done 34 years of commuting in the greater Boston area, the first 10 in a service truck and the rest in sales / office work.   I did 10 weeks of strictly WFH during the peak time up here and while we’re back in the office we still have one mandatory WFH day per week to limit the number of people in the office.   I’ve had a dedicated home office for close to 10 years for winter weather reasons and it’s well set up to do what I need to do.   Our company was also well prepared for this suckitude as we have some large clients that required us to show them what our plans for dealing with unpleasant circumstances would be several years ago. (Thanks I guess?) Some observations:

Pro: I don’t miss commuting or the associated traffic one tiny bit.  Traffic is still way way down up here and it’s been awesome to be able to just hop in and drive somewhere if I need to make site visits.   I can get way more done in terms of concentration/ productivity due to fewer random interruptions.  My office, my tunes at any volume I like...  If I want to grab lunch out or do a random errand I can take the fun car.  As others have mentioned, alarm is an hour later than if I need to go to the shop. 

Con: None of the office toys ( color printers, full size plotter / scanner.  Be nice, I know I’m a dinosaur.)   Some very long, lonely days back in the spring when I was doing my job plus three other guys jobs when they were furloughed.   As others have mentioned I miss being able to poke my head in and have a 30 second conversation instead of a 15 minute Teams chat.   Keeping in touch with the crew.  Yeah, I hate most other humans too but I like my guys and there’s a lot of alone time doing what I do in the best of times.  Clients assuming I’m always available as others have mentioned.  Oh yeah, holy crap, if y’all don’t start going back to the office I’m screwed.  ( Our client base is mostly commercial property. With that said, my largest accounts are still moving forward with all current projects and are planning and starting additional ones.) 

Been working from home since mid-March. Pros & Cons. Can run errands when I want to. Not a lot of meetings but once in while. Job entails research into problems and dealing with soldiers around the world. The research takes longer as not all of the programs are available at home, even on the work vpn so have to get with others that can help. Either by phone or email. In the office had access to the programs and if not there could just walk over and talk to someone in person for the answer. Do miss the work mates, we got along and sometimes did lunch. Haven't seen them since this started. Have talked on the phone is about all. New boss took over last year and he's doing this separation of duties between core people and matrix people. I'm matrix from supply section so according to him I should be working supply. Never worked supply, in the slot because that's the one that was open when I got the job. I'm a maintenance person and know that better than anyone else in the office. Been doing it longer, a lot longer. Was there years before the new boss came there. Old boss didn't separate. Still doing some core jobs because no one else can do it, not qualified. It's getting worse during the work from home. Frustrating for me. Have known the boss for years. Going back to when both of us were in the army and I was a senior helicopter Tech Inspector and he was a new Maintenance Test Pilot coming through my shop for training. This separation of duties really only effects 2 of us and the other guy is retiring in a couple months. Although eligible I plan on 4-5 years until full SS to retire, unless health changes or I hit the lottery.

Also SWMBO understands I'm working but she sometimes walks by me giving me the stink eye and muttering in Korean. I'm set up in the dining room across from this computer with a laptop and extra monitor.

Hello?

Gone are the days when people had to work hard.  [For example, I got a PhD in basket weaving online... which set me up perfectly for building a live-aboard canoe... and now i can work from home everywhere!]

In reply to stuart in mn :

There are graphics tablet monitors almost that size, but they are damn expensive.  I do most of my printing at 11x17, which is close enough most of the time. 

I kinda wonder how this event will shape future housing design trends. 

I know my wife and I are definitely trying to figure out how we can convert various parts of the house into more proper office spaces. A neighbor of ours converted half of his garage into an office. 

We've been thinking of maybe relocating our washer and dryer into our mudroom/mechanical closet, and turning the old laundry room into an office.

I could totally see lots of new houses being built with spaces that aren't big enough to be rooms, but would function nicely as offices. 

In reply to pheller :

I don't think it will affect housing design as much as interior design.  While it's typical for higher end houses to have a designated office, I still imagine more normal folks simply re-purposing spare bedrooms.  When I (hopefully) rebuild my house, that is essentially my plan - to just use one of the bedrooms as my office unless I can carve out a "library" space with a desk area as well. 

I can see that. Just like having a theater room or a server closet or hardwired ethernet has been added to a lot of people's wish lists, a place for a home office is likely quite a bit higher on the list than it was 6 months ago. The house we lived in two years ago would have been much better suited to WFH as both Janel and I had offices, but we're making this one work. I'm in the middle of wiring in a new power circuit and just built some new furniture so it's the way I like it.

As for the "response time" comment from z31 maniac - I take advantage of my work from home status to work deep. That means shutting out distractions, including emails. I'll ignore everything else while I deal with a problem, then I can come up for air and deal with emails and forums and little dumb problems. It also protects me from walk-around managers ;)

I had to drive out to the office a while back to do something. First time I've been there in months. The drive itself was kinda unsettling - very familiar but there was almost a dread that settled over me. Turns out I really didn't look forward to that at all. I actually have a car parked there that I need to retrieve so I can sell it and I just don't want to.

I just got notice that my old office is now closing down. We will be WFH, even after "we go back", for most days. While this is music to my ears, I have to go into the office to retrieve all my crap. Among said "crap" is a pair of gnarly 4k monitors on a sweet stand. I think I'm going to have to create a "battlestation" here at home somewhere to work from instead of the kitchen table.

Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to pheller :

I don't think it will affect housing design as much as interior design.  While it's typical for higher end houses to have a designated office, I still imagine more normal folks simply re-purposing spare bedrooms.  When I (hopefully) rebuild my house, that is essentially my plan - to just use one of the bedrooms as my office unless I can carve out a "library" space with a desk area as well. 

That's what I was thinking, buy one more bedroom than you need, boom. Office. 

z31maniac said:

Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to pheller :

I don't think it will affect housing design as much as interior design.  While it's typical for higher end houses to have a designated office, I still imagine more normal folks simply re-purposing spare bedrooms.  When I (hopefully) rebuild my house, that is essentially my plan - to just use one of the bedrooms as my office unless I can carve out a "library" space with a desk area as well. 

That's what I was thinking, buy one more bedroom than you need, boom. Office. 

Easier said than done, depending on the regional housing market. 

We're actually considering expanding our house, depending on quotes. Spending $50k-$80k for an extra 1.5 rooms might be worth it if we both end up a permanent remote position. 

z31maniac said:

Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to pheller :

I don't think it will affect housing design as much as interior design.  While it's typical for higher end houses to have a designated office, I still imagine more normal folks simply re-purposing spare bedrooms.  When I (hopefully) rebuild my house, that is essentially my plan - to just use one of the bedrooms as my office unless I can carve out a "library" space with a desk area as well. 

That's what I was thinking, buy one more bedroom than you need, boom. Office. 

Unless your spouse also works from home, then it's two more than you need!

Right now, we're two adults and three kids living in a 4 bedroom with 2.5 baths.  Bathrooms are good, but two more bedrooms-to-use-as-offices would be nice to have.

pheller said:

z31maniac said:

Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to pheller :

I don't think it will affect housing design as much as interior design.  While it's typical for higher end houses to have a designated office, I still imagine more normal folks simply re-purposing spare bedrooms.  When I (hopefully) rebuild my house, that is essentially my plan - to just use one of the bedrooms as my office unless I can carve out a "library" space with a desk area as well. 

That's what I was thinking, buy one more bedroom than you need, boom. Office. 

Easier said than done, depending on the regional housing market. 

We're actually considering expanding our house, depending on quotes. Spending $50k-$80k for an extra 1.5 rooms might be worth it if we both end up a permanent remote position. 

If you do end up in a permanent remote position, I'd be curious what the increased value would be. Probably not much I suspect. 

And even with big tech companies like I work for, I suspect as things calm down next year, people who were "changed" to "permanent WFH positions" may not stay that way.