$2000 Challenge 2019 - Feedback, Praise, and Suggestions

I think the take the 12 works as long as the judges keep that in mind while judging everyone else. On one hand it sucks to have a nice clean car that only scores one point higher than zero effort (like the NX2000), but on the other hand if you're close to 12 you really aren't in contention for overall placement. The fact of the matter is that if you are trying to compete for anything at all, whether it's overall or some of the subclasses, you have to compete in every event and every point counts. Did anyone that took the 12 win an award?

In reply to n8 :

I agree totally, I had no illusions of the nx placing any higher than it did, in fact I feel like we left virtually nothing on the table with that car.  

The issue is I spent hours cleaning up under the hood, fixing body work and painting the car.  Granted that was for my own edification as much as building a challenge car but I could have just as easily drug it out of a swamp, not hosed it off and plopped it down in the pavilion and taken a 12.  That doesn't seem to fit the ethos of building a cool car for $2000.

The thing is, most of the cars that were judged got above a 12. 12 is the halfway point betwween 0 and 25, but it's probably not the average of all the scores from judged vehicles. I think that the lowest I saw was a 10, so really a 12 is not that much better than that.

Of course, I'm biased because I didn't clean my car up and it was full of luggage and tires during the concours, so naturally I took the 12. 

In reply to slowbird :

Do you have a picture of your car from the concourse, just for a comparison of your 12 vs the nx2000's 13.

You totally made the smart decision. I feel like I didn't...

In reply to n8 :

We got 12 by doing an actual amg livery with vinyl in the parking lot of the hotel and making an e55 faster than it should be with a misfire.  I was pulled away from making tacos to raise money for charity, gave the judges my presentation(off the cheat sheet) and got a 12.  We got parking lot class and last chance challenger plaques which honestly I gave to the kids.  
 

i'm not salty, the presentation sucked.  I had a blast all weekend.  
 

jeremy, is it possible the judges were staring at your nipples and not the car?  

In reply to pimpm3 :

I don't, but here's what it looked like all weekend:

Now, if I did the concours, I probably would've scored less than 12. But I can't pretend to know what the judges have on their minds at the time of scoring.

I tried to do some math, and it looks like the average of non-12s was around 15, and the median was 16.1 or something. My point is, I don't think it really makes that much difference for anyone outside the top 20. Which would be all the gastropods and then some.

In reply to Patrick :

We need to get a pic of the kids with the plaques next to the car before I remove the stickers.  Collin was excited to have the plb plaque.

jeremy, is it possible the judges were staring at your nipples and not the car

My nipples didn't come out until the camaro presentation.  I got a 14 something or other on that presentation.

In reply to pimpm3 :

Well, the data is right there, you know what you have to do from now on...

Hahaha.  John Welsh figured out cheerleaders handing out beads  improve your presentation a few years back.  I think that is a better option than my redneck cut up shirt.

Tom Suddard said:

Danny, I hear you there, but here's the real reason we eliminated printed results: It eliminated a huge logistics issue, because we didn't need to a have a staffer printing and posting times, and we didn't need to design the grid/course in a way that allowed for heavy foot traffic near the Timing & Scoring trailer. We made the call that the benefits outweighed the costs. 

Why not go modern. Flat screens are dirt cheap these days. Set up one or two connected to a laptop tablet or phone away from the timing trailer where and display the live timing for all to see.

In reply to pimpm3 :

FWIW, I’m really surprised that you only scored a 13 with the NX. I thought the car was very clean and presented well and it’s certainly something to be proud of. It’s probably just too stock for modern concours standards. 

n8 said:

In reply to pimpm3 :

FWIW, I’m really surprised that you only scored a 13 with the NX. I thought the car was very clean and presented well and it’s certainly something to be proud of. It’s probably just too stock for modern concours standards. 

Agreed. The NX was super clean, and had a great look too. Surprised it only managed a 13.

In reply to Dead_Sled :

I still cannot believe you made it 1000 miles in a stickered up drug dealer car with no plates without getting arrested 

During the post concours meeting, the topic of nitrous during autocross came up. I thought I remembered seeing a rule for that so I went back and checked. It says:

Nitrous use is not allowed during the autocross. Nitrous bottles are not allowed in cars during the autocross.

Given Tom's enthusiasm for nitrous use, can we get this rule officially removed for next year? 

dyintorace said:

n8 said:

In reply to pimpm3 :

FWIW, I’m really surprised that you only scored a 13 with the NX. I thought the car was very clean and presented well and it’s certainly something to be proud of. It’s probably just too stock for modern concours standards. 

Agreed. The NX was super clean, and had a great look too. Surprised it only managed a 13.

Similar discussion going on in another thread. Stafford pointed me to the 12 point example car on the rules page, which was a nice clean mildly moded early MR2. The judges were instructed and reminded to use that as the 12 point baseline. Review that car and comments kind of put the lower teens scores in perspective. Still not sure I agree with the weighting of the scores but I understand better where they came from.

Forgive me if this comment has already been given. The number panels were a good size this year and I liked the sponsor decal strip but it was a bit large for small cars.  Also, the windshield banner is still too big. I have a small, curved windshield and there is no good way to make a large straight banner fit or look good. It also impeads forward visibility. If the logo and lettering were shorter with the same amount of white space then it could probably be trimmed to fit and look decent.

I saw the "example of a 12 point concourse score" article.  And the example was a white, stockish MR2. It seemed to be a sign that I should take the 12. 

bigben said:

dyintorace said:

n8 said:

In reply to pimpm3 :

FWIW, I’m really surprised that you only scored a 13 with the NX. I thought the car was very clean and presented well and it’s certainly something to be proud of. It’s probably just too stock for modern concours standards. 

Agreed. The NX was super clean, and had a great look too. Surprised it only managed a 13.

Similar discussion going on in another thread. Stafford pointed me to the 12 point example car on the rules page, which was a nice clean mildly moded early MR2. The judges were instructed and reminded to use that as the 12 point baseline. Review that car and comments kind of put the lower teens scores in perspective. Still not sure I agree with the weighting of the scores but I understand better where they came from.

I am completely happy with the 13 and I think it was the right score for the car.  I just think the opt out option should not be an average or mid point score.  Most of the cars that opted out would have scored in the 7 to 10 range.  The opt out score should reflect that.  

In reply to slowbird :

Oops! Could have sworn that left when we ditched the SCCA rulebook. Let me make sure it isn't in there for insurance reasons. 

Patrick said:

In reply to Dead_Sled :

I still cannot believe you made it 1000 miles in a stickered up drug dealer car with no plates without getting arrested 

The trick is to go fast enough and leak enough oil to create a smoke screen behind you. 

My biggest concern was telling the cop I bought a car from a guy that lives 8 miles from me but we were 1000 miles from home.

slowbird said:

During the post concours meeting, the topic of nitrous during autocross came up. I thought I remembered seeing a rule for that so I went back and checked. It says:

Nitrous use is not allowed during the autocross. Nitrous bottles are not allowed in cars during the autocross.

Given Tom's enthusiasm for nitrous use, can we get this rule officially removed for next year? 

I do remember him saying something about a mother bottle and one continuous shot....

bigben said:

Forgive me if this comment has already been given. The number panels were a good size this year and I liked the sponsor decal strip but it was a bit large for small cars.  Also, the windshield banner is still too big. I have a small, curved windshield and there is no good way to make a large straight banner fit or look good. It also impeads forward visibility. If the logo and lettering were shorter with the same amount of white space then it could probably be trimmed to fit and look decent.

This could be a sponsorship issue. When they get those banners, they've sold crc space in exchange for money. Oftentimes it is size dependent. Nascar does down to the sqaure inch or something stupid as I remember. 

In reply to Tom Suddard :

Ummmm.  
 

you know I'm going to do this if it's legal.  
 

also airgas is doing a site survey of my shop when the addition is done so i can have mother bottles delivered to my own personal filling station 

Tom Suddard said:

In reply to slowbird :

Oops! Could have sworn that left when we ditched the SCCA rulebook. Let me make sure it isn't in there for insurance reasons. 

Some days I feel like the insurance company should just run my business and see how they handle all the restrictions. 
 

Nitrous for autocross will be better for weight balance than a turbo setup. Better get the nicer bottle brackets.