1987 RX7 LS1 Swap

There may be hope for the pan yet. I got a hold of a kid I used to work with today, since I frankly don't trust the skills of any of our current group of TIG guys, and sent him a pic. His reply was "I got that easy."

I'm still dubious, but we shall see. Maybe I can just get the flange decked if it warps?

I'm still a little blown away that all it took for the oil pan to break was a small bit of gasket double layered.

I've made the old/double gasket mistake if it makes you feel any better. Easy to do when the original stuff is so smashed that it's hard to tell it was ever a gasket.

In reply to docwyte:

Yea I'm a little perturbed by that as well. Really wasn't much force at all, torque wrench set to 109 in-lb (IIRC) and it was barely starting to get tight.

109 inlb of torque. Translate that into clamping force..... How small of an area was the pan stuck on?

If it was a point contact, it could have been several hundred pounds of force on that one small spot. Think of how a book on your hand doesn't hurt, but a book on the head of a pin on your hand most certainly hurts.

True, 109 in-lb works out to a clamping force of over a ton, so even if it was torqued to 50-75% of that it's still a decent amount of force. It basically hinged along a piece of the gasket maybe 1" long sitting about 1" away from the bolt hole. Flange of the pan is about 5/16" thick and pretty uniform in this region. Treating this like a cantilevered beam, which is a bit of an oversimplification but probably close enough, that's a stress of about 69ksi at the full 109 in-lb, definitely enough to break a piece of cast aluminum.

Science bitches!

Well it appears the oil pain repair is a success! (So far at least, guess I won't know 100% for sure until it's up and running.)

Got a hold of this guy Mason I used to work with to do the welding and one of our tool makers, Dave, at work to skim the pan afterwards. Mason races dirt track and Dave's a hard core muscle car guy with an ever changing lineup of fix and flip candidates, so they were both sympathetic to the cause and happy to help out. Couldn't even get them to take a 12 pack for their efforts!

Mason beveled the joint out and laid a really nice bead on the top side, where the flange meets the pan. The bottom side looks like it could have been cleaned a bit better and has a bit of porosity in the weld, but the joint seems plenty strong and looks good from the top side, where it counts. I think it should hold up fine.

Pan is now back on the motor, after a thorough dousing with brake cleaner. I'll post some pics tonight when I've got my tablet handy.

And pics... Top side of the oil pan repair, after its turn on the Bridgeport. I should have gotten a before pic too, but didn't.

 And the bottom. Not as pretty as the top was, but it should do. The weld was beveled and filled from the opposite side.

 And pan back on the motor.

 Too cold in the garage tonight, but there should be more progress to come this weekend.

Glad you were able to fix it. Friends with welders and skills are highly valued friends.

Last weekend I didn't make much progress, had to move my grandma on Saturday, hung out with my uncle on Sunday while he was in town, blah blah, excuses... Anyways, here's what I did get done. While this car is remarkably clean overall, there were a couple of spots of surface rust starting in the very front of the engine bay, near the ends of the tubular cross member thingy. Gave them a quick cleanup and hit them with a coat of primer.

 The big event, I guess, was getting the clutch master cylinder in. A standard, off the shelf Wildwood 7/8" bore M/C kit needs only a couple simple modifications to work, namely the shaft needs to be lengthened and retapped to a metric pitch (supposedly you can just run a die over the existing threads, as they're very close), the pass through in the firewall needs to be enlarged, and the m/c needs to be "reclocked" back upright, as the factory mounting points are on an angle. While I could have done all of the above myself, in the true Grassroots spirit, Hinson offers a ready to go Wilwood master cylinder for only $15 more than the lowest price I could find on the universal kit. So I took the easy route.

 Hinson also offers an adapter for the firewall to mount the master cylinder upright, so I figured why not and ordered that as well. I've decided I might cut some more corners and spend a bit extra where I can, for sake of expediency. Here you can see the difference in angle between the holes and studs on the Hinson mount.

 And here it is mounted in the car. Threading the nut onto the upper bolt from the inside was a bitch, but the smallest reservoir the kit comes with is a perfect fit. Tucks up tight against the lip on the firewall like it was designed to fit there.

 Plan for this weekend, aside from maybe doing a hike tomorrow, is to get the motor ready to drop in, which includes throwing the starter and alternator back on, figuring out some way to delete the PS pump from the serpentine belt, and getting the engine and tranny back together. To that end, I have a new throwout bearing/slave cylinder, flywheel, LS7 clutch, and a pile of fittings and braided stainless lines ready to go together. Goal is to drop the motor in next weekend. The weather is supposed to be beautiful all week, so no excuses not to be in the garage.

Brief update from this past weekend (pics to follow later):

Clutch is installed, engine and trans are back together, and wrestling a T56 by yourself kinda sucks. Intake manifold is off, alternator is back on, and the starter would be as well if I could find the plastic thingy that covers the opening to the bellhousing around the starter. Anyone know what that thing is called, in case I have to order another? See random internet pic below, it's the plastic thing on the right.

Did some more scrubbing of grease and stuff in the engine bay, removed what I think is remnants of the rotary engine harness, and now the engine bay is pretty much ready to host it's new resident. Cut the old driver's side trans mount off as well and hit the area with some appliance epoxy paint I had laying around. Should be all set to drop the motor in next weekend.

Sunday concluded with a bit of a mystery. As I was removing the seats and pulling the carpet back to access the trans tunnel when I go to drill new holes for the Ronin trans mount, I discovered a mystery liquid under the carpet beneath the seats. I thought it was just nasty carpet juice water at first, in poor lighting, and figured I must have sprayed some up the shifter opening during pressure washing. However, later inspection revealed it to have a green hue like coolant. Doesn't have much of a smell, though. Pool seems to have originated under the seats, rather than leaking back from further up towards the front of the car, so I have no clue where it came from or what it might be. Coolant? Koolaid? Alien pee?

I sucked up what I could with the shop vac and have had the carpet pulled up with a fan blowing since. Carpet needs a good cleaning anyways.

I think you nailed it with the alien pee.

I'm actually about 99% sure it's coolant. Seems very reluctant to evaporate.

Picture dump from last weekend:

 Clutch and flywheel waiting to go in.

 And installed.

 Transmission back on. Wrestling this beast by myself was not fun.

 Here's the driver's side trans mount hump removed. There's a second, smaller hump on the passenger side that was lopped off as well, but I didn't get pics of that. These were primed, painted, and the edges sealed with RTV (since apparently none of the parts stores here have any seam sealer on hand) later in the week.

 Trying to evaporate the alien pee out of the carpet.

So last night was a big occasion, as I was able to bribe my friend Bryan into helping me drop the motor in with some beers. None of my local friends are really the least bit mechanically inclined, but just having the extra set of hands around was enough to make the job go super smooth (the load leveler helped a ton as well.) Had just enough clearance between the cherry picker and garage door to get the trans up and over the radiator support and bumper, but once it was down and in the driver's side mount dropped right in place and the passenger side only took a little bit of leverage to line up.

 My assistant and his voluptuous beard in the background.

 The V8 fits like it was meant to be there, tucks up right against the firewall and sits almost entirely behind the centerline of the front wheels. Easy access from beneath to the oil pan drain, oil filter, starter, ECT, better even than in the Camaro. I should have taken some pics of the Ronin mounts before the engine went in, but oh well. The kit was money well spent, really high quality stuff. The welds look fantastic and everything went together perfectly. I would highly recommend these guys for anyone looking to do this swap. Here's the motor in its new home.

 And that's where I left it for the night and celebrated with more beers. Today's agenda is to center the trans, get the trans mount in place and drill mounting holes in the body, then start putting bits and pieces back together on the engine. Starting to come together!

I have no idea what the alien pee is. Seriously.

The heater core in these cars is a BITCH to get out. It did not leak when I had it running well. I soooo hope to god that is not the issue.

I have not spilled anything in that car. I didn't pee in it. I have no idea what that could be. The car sat in the garage, so it is not rain or anything like that.

Good Progress! Are you lucky enough to be able to now leave the engine in the car? My engine is back out... Gotta finish up the oil pan, starter, timing cover, etc....

Let me know how that master cylinder works!

In reply to wvumtnbkr:

I definitely think it's coolant, just not sure where it's coming from. Doesn't look to have originated from the heater core, but that's really the only logical place for it to have come from. I REALLY do not want to have to remove the dash because I'm 100% sure I will break everything plastic in doing so. Just gonna hope for the best when everything goes back together.

I'm about 50/50 right now as to whether the engine has to come back out. I'm realizing now there's some stuff (plumbing fuel lines for one) that would have been a lot easier to do with the engine out, but whether or not I have sufficient header clearance will probably be the determining factor.

Hopefully it's not the core leaking. Have you pulled the carpet back along the bulkhead (firewall) to see if there is anything running down it? It may also be worth pulling the whole carpet out to get a good look inside there. While its out drag the carpet over to a detail shop and have them shampoo it real quick and let it dry out of the car. It will probably go quicker than trying to air it out with a fan. And if I went this far I might just leave it out until the car is running and your sure it's not coming from the core.

None to less it's nice to see you making progress. Looks like you will be running in no time. Keep it up!

In reply to YoloRX7:

Carpet is out at the moment (lagging a little bit in my updates right now, not that there has been a ton of progress made), sliced it up along the center console/dash so I wouldn't have to pull the whole dash and break ALL the plastic things getting it out. Cleaned it as best I could, but there are still some rather tenacious stains, so I may try sending it to a detailer.

My Speedway radiator showed up the other night, so mounting that will be the big task for the weekend. Also have battery cable and fuel line to run.

Getting there, but lots to be done yet!

Furious_E wrote: I'm about 50/50 right now as to whether the engine has to come back out. I'm realizing now there's some stuff (plumbing fuel lines for one) that would have been a lot easier to do with the engine out, but whether or not I have sufficient header clearance will probably be the determining factor.

Why I will never do an engine swap without a plastic mock-up engine. These things are worth their lack of weight in gold.

You KNOW that the engine should come out to do the work properly, but you don't want to do it because it feels like going backwards. I so know this feeling when doing a project. Anymore, I don't waste the time agonizing over it, I just take things apart knowing it is the right way.

Now that the welder is out it's a real build thread Got my radiator in from Speedway last week, so this weekend I'm working on mounts. Here's what I've got so far. Approximate position:

 Mounts in process. Going to tie in to the stock oil cooler mounting points on the bottom, possibly to the tow hook bolts as well if it seems like it needs it. 

Good work! I'm hoping for first start of mine this coming weekend!

Keep up the good work!

P.s. let me know if you aren't gonna use those wheels!

Rob, new wheels are in the plans but probably a little ways off yet. I need the current set to roll around on in the mean time, but they're yours once the time comes.

Anyways, the updates and progress have been lacking the past month or so. Spent a week skiing out in Colorado, then a few solid weeks getting my yard work under control back at home and now my plate is (mostly) cleared for project car time again. Here's what I've gotten done this past weekend and in the preceding few weeks (pics to follow tonight):

-Finished lower radiator mounts. The brackets basically cup the lower corners of the radiator and hang off of the stock oil cooler mounting points. The radiator sits in the brackets, which are lined with foam from a camping pad to allow for a snug fit and isolate from vibration (wonder how the foam is going to hold up to the temps though...).

-Went through several iterations of upper radiator mounts before I came to a satisfactory solution. Pretty happy with the end result, holds the radiator very securely, light enough, and provided a convenient mounting point for the fan.

-Snagged an e-fan out of an early 90s Taurus and got that mounted. Clearance is TIGHT to the crank pulley and water pump pulley, but it should be ok as long as it stays where it's at.

-Assessed radiator hoses. Looks like the lower hose from the Camaro is damn near perfect. The upper hose is the right shape to be cut down, but both ends are 1 5/16" and I need one to be 1.5".

-Have fuel lines almost plumbed. Would have had this finished yesterday but for a rather pricey fitting that got up and walked away, plus I ran a little short on hose and had to order more. Kept the stock hard lines up until just before where the original fuel filter was at, then AN6 lines from there up to a C5 Vette FPR mounted above the brake booster, the key for adapting the LS returnless fuel system to the return style system on the Mazda.

-Started plotting out the battery relocation to the storage well behind the passenger seat, might start running cable tonight. Need to decide on a battery and get one ordered so I can make mounts for it.

That pretty much brings us up to current. The next big step now is going to be fitting the headers and seeing if I have clearance for them. If they fit, the motor stays in the car and I can keep charging ahead with buttoning everything else up. If not, we go backwards for a bit and pull the motor back out for more firewall bashing. Eagerly awaiting their arrival any day now...

Photos, as promised.

 Here's the radiator and fan in position. A pair of brackets cup the bottom corners of the radiator, with an aluminum brace running between them. There's a pair of straps bent into a u shape that tie into that brace and run up the front and back sides of the radiator, then bolt together at the top to secure it vertically. The front side of the straps are riveted to the original radiator/hood latch support thing. The fan mounts to the straps with 4 sheet metal screws. I snagged it out of an early 90s Taurus (the less soap bar looking body style) at the junkyard, because the internet says that's the hot (or cool?) setup. They supposedly flow like 3000 cfm and the shroud was about the right size, so good enough for me. It's actually mounted upside down here because that's the only way I could get the fan motor and plug to clear. There's maybe 3/8-1/2" of clearance to fast spinny things, so I'm sure it will be fine. 

 Lower brackets tie in to the stock oil cooler mounts. I glued some super trick foam isolators that I cut out of a sleeping bag pad to the insides of the brackets. Hopefully the foam holds up to the heat and abuse long term.

 Top of the straps are held together with some 3/8x3 stainless bolts and the front half of each strap is riveted to that cross member.

 Here you can see where the fuel lines tie into the hard lines. I used the super trick, Kevlar/homes wrapped Aeroquip Startlite hose in 6AN size for the fuel lines. Pricey stuff, but I thought I'd spring for the insurance due to the proximity to where I think the headers will be. I used some Russel 5/16 to 6an adapters to mate to the hard lines. One of which has evidently grown legs and walked off into the woods, hence why the return line isn't hooked up

 Fuel filter location, above the brake booster. I wasn't thrilled with this spot at first, but actually now that it's there it seems to work pretty well and allows me to keep the lines away from the headers. I'll run a 90 degree fitting on the other and and another 90 on the fuel rail and it should be a pretty straight shot. That's all for now, waiting on more parts.