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petegossett
petegossett PowerDork
6/2/15 5:54 a.m.

Agreed, I talked to an old-timer who'd pulled a hit-n-miss engine out of a creek. He had to build a huge bonfire to get it hot enough to free it up, but he did, and he ran it for me...and it sounded as smooth as I suppose any hit-n-miss engine could.

oldeskewltoy
oldeskewltoy SuperDork
6/3/15 2:33 p.m.
Grtechguy wrote: Well, the story I was told is that it suffered a lack of antifreeze and cracked the block. Stories of it running and smoking gophers out of the field exist

Stories are wonderful..... but often times inaccurate. Pull the engine, and begin to dismantle. Be careful to label everything. Once you get the engine down to its basic pieces have the block, head, and crank checked. The rest is likely source-able.

tuna55
tuna55 UltimaDork
6/3/15 2:48 p.m.
Toyman01 wrote: You would be surprised at what will clean up on a old engine. Don't write it off just yet. I've driven pistons out with a sledge, cleaned the rust off, reringed, and reinstalled. This isn't a 7k rpm engine. Tolerances can be measured with a ruler.

I have made it my life's work to correct this when people invariably claim it about older engines, but I never imagined you would be one of the people I'd correct!

http://egge.com/part/nos-1603-cb251/

Rod bearing clearance (just picked one) is 0.0008" - 0.0033"

An FC20 (can't find exactly) has something like .0020"

So anyway, take it apart, check everything, replace what you need to.

oldeskewltoy
oldeskewltoy UltraDork
6/3/15 5:21 p.m.
tuna55 wrote:
Toyman01 wrote: You would be surprised at what will clean up on a old engine. Don't write it off just yet. I've driven pistons out with a sledge, cleaned the rust off, reringed, and reinstalled. This isn't a 7k rpm engine. Tolerances can be measured with a ruler.
I have made it my life's work to correct this when people invariably claim it about older engines, but I never imagined you would be one of the people I'd correct! http://egge.com/part/nos-1603-cb251/ Rod bearing clearance (just picked one) is 0.0008" - 0.0033" An FC20 (can't find exactly) has something like .0020" So anyway, take it apart, check everything, replace what you need to.

4AGE...

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill SuperDork
6/3/15 8:33 p.m.

What a great starting point!

Put me in for the "pb blast and see if that puppy fires up" bin

Actually, if you have no deadline, why not pull the head off and see what the cylinders look like? You never know, it might be savable After all, if it was an "overheat" there's no real saying for sure that it cracked the block. Plenty of other heat susceptible parts could have been damaged by the over-temp (rings, valve stem guide seals, etc).

Either way. Way to go man, glad to see you got her.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
6/3/15 8:47 p.m.

I believe it was more a freeze vs overheat. Michigan gets COLD in the winter. Cylinders are soaking and I'm going to be away from home for a week.

Even have the wife admitting it's a cool old beast. The kids and neighbors are all about it as well.

Woody
Woody MegaDork
6/3/15 9:14 p.m.

I forbid you to go away for a week.

ebonyandivory
ebonyandivory SuperDork
6/4/15 7:40 a.m.

This makes me want to find an old engine in a creek and get it running too.

Love it! Good luck!

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill SuperDork
6/4/15 9:38 p.m.

GRTechguy:

I don't know if this is "motivation" or not, but it's definitely pertinent RoadKill GMC

Cheers

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
6/7/15 7:34 a.m.

Attempted to work on the brakes last night. It appears the adjusters are frozen up.

Huck drum brakes on the front. These are going to be fun getting off.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
6/13/15 3:43 p.m.

Back home today and started a little more disassembly. Wanted to see if there was a nut on the crank pulley in addition to the hand crank. No such luck. Guess it will sit for another week to see if it will free up.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
6/13/15 3:46 p.m.

Edit: also found that the radiator was filled with antifreeze. I'm hoping that's a good sign.

Hmmm.. the ATF I put in the cylinders last week has appeared on the dip stick. Thoughts?

Dusterbd13
Dusterbd13 UltraDork
6/13/15 6:06 p.m.

If it made it to the pan, it's not completely airtight stuck.

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic PowerDork
6/13/15 7:45 p.m.

In reply to Grtechguy:

That's a good sign! Means that the rings are soaked and the bores aren't rusty to point of making the piston itself a press fit. Add more for good measure (or better yet PB plaster) and start trying to rock it back and forth.

Toyman01
Toyman01 MegaDork
6/13/15 9:05 p.m.
tuna55 wrote:
Toyman01 wrote: You would be surprised at what will clean up on a old engine. Don't write it off just yet. I've driven pistons out with a sledge, cleaned the rust off, reringed, and reinstalled. This isn't a 7k rpm engine. Tolerances can be measured with a ruler.
I have made it my life's work to correct this when people invariably claim it about older engines, but I never imagined you would be one of the people I'd correct! http://egge.com/part/nos-1603-cb251/ Rod bearing clearance (just picked one) is 0.0008" - 0.0033" An FC20 (can't find exactly) has something like .0020" So anyway, take it apart, check everything, replace what you need to.

Tuna, read this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperbole

This is an old cast iron engine. Most of them will come back from abuse that would send a modern engine to the junk yard.

The last one I did had two pistons frozen solid and two valves that were almost rusted to nubs. Heat, beat and time got it apart. It got two new pistons, a set of rings and bearings and two new valves. No machine work other than a ball hone to clean the rust out of the bores, and very little measuring. Other than a puff of smoke on startup, it runs like new.

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic PowerDork
6/13/15 11:45 p.m.

Yeah I don't think anybody is claiming these old engines were built sloppily, just that they can be incredibly worn out and sloppy and still run OK on a suitably heavy oil. A quick google indicates these redline at 3400 RPM, lawnmower speeds.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
6/14/15 4:26 p.m.

After almost an hour of pounding, prying and discovering the 2 flush mount bolts (covered in rust), I have the front passenger drum off. Small victory for today. Still working on the rear, but taking a break to feed the offspring who claim to be starving.

Best part? Zero noise from the hub that spins smoothly.

Toyman01
Toyman01 MegaDork
6/14/15 5:09 p.m.

That actually doesn't look too bad.

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic PowerDork
6/14/15 6:32 p.m.

Keep in mind these old shoes and the dust they make is loaded with asbestos, keep everything wet (and collect the drippings) when working on it.

patgizz
patgizz PowerDork
6/15/15 6:47 p.m.

i found some new old stock delco and borg warner bits in my stash for you. have a new cap, rotor, points, and condensor.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
6/15/15 9:02 p.m.

Patgizz, I appreciate it. send me an email with how much you want for them & shipping. Unless you feel like taking a road trip up here.

patgizz
patgizz PowerDork
6/16/15 7:38 a.m.

going to ludington/branch for the 4th weekend, will bring with me. don't need anything for them. just want them to get used.

mazdeuce
mazdeuce PowerDork
6/17/15 5:37 a.m.

I got to look at this truck yesterday when I stopped by and it's cool. The Zenith carb and the friction dampers and the little nub thing for hand starting on the end of the crankshaft and everything. Just a really neat old truck. I have complete faith that this truck is going to be driving around again soon.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
6/17/15 7:20 p.m.

Got around to getting the rest of the wheels off (8 lugs each) and sprayed down the remain brake drum fasteners.

More PB blast down the cylinders - Still stuck

Pulled the starter for testing.

Noticed the bump start component? Also learning that this is a POSITIVE Ground 6volt system. Good think I looked at the battery before attempting to jump the starter.

Trying to take lots of pictures in small steps (in case I need help remembering where it all goes back to)

I did have a battery hooked up for a short time and was able to hear a couple fans from inside the dash run. the controls for them still worked great as well.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy UltimaDork
6/17/15 7:32 p.m.

Oh, forgot to post this rather grotesque find. Two mummified mice. It appears to be a mother and baby, perfectly intact with ears, toenails, eyelids, bones. nothing else. There a few holes that you can peek through the skin and see bones.

But all the mouse turds are out of the cab finally.

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