Well, this pandemic has kept me super busy on a lot of fronts, so I haven't done the final punch list on the '34 yet. And I got distracted with yet another old Ford that fell into my lap:
I like this picture because it's got a beautiful, bone stock 1937 phaeton in the background. It's a customer car that's in for a clutch and some sorting.
I'm not good enough to tell exactly what year the sedan is...but it's close enough that I have to chime in and say that my father has a '41 Super Deluxe sedan he acquired as a project a few years back.
Well, four years later, and I'm working on the punch list. I have excuses, but they're pretty first-world in nature so I'll skip back to the car. I've barely driven it since 2020, but I've vowed to drive it this year and dial everything in. I started by replacing the dead battery that was now 8 years old.
It's a bit tricky to get a great idle as it gets the blower lope below 800 RPM. I'm pretty happy with it at about 900, but may keep trying to get it a little lower. I think I have to put leaner idle jets in it as the idle screws do very little. But overall, it's been running well, starting on the first try, and making a nice whine. I'll keep fine tuning it for a few weeks, then get it on the dyno sooner or later.
I have it parked in the home garage so I can run a lot of errands with it. Short trips are the hardest things on cars and the best way to sort things out. I put about 30 miles on it this weekend.
One thing I've just put up with was cabin heat. The car doesn't have side windows, nor does it have a heater. But it gets really hot, mainly because of the transmission cover and the lack of insulation. I'm remedying both of those soon. I started by screwing a 1/2"x3/4" of wood to the body so that the transmission cover would fit better and have a good place to hold its mounting screws. Previously, it was pretty wavy and a lot of heat came through.
Ever since I bought the car, it's had this big cutout for the shifter hidden below the carpet. I'm going to make a proper cover and get the transmission cover to sit flat on the floor. That's going to take a little cutting and a little fiberglass work, but should go fast. Then I'm going to use Dynamat or similar to insulate before putting the carpet back in.
I think this car looks good from any angle...and I've mixed race fuel with the ethanol-free (just in case) so those pipes emit a nice smell...
Glad to see this one on page one again. We have several cars like this that just need driven more. Glad to see it going again
What a cool old thing. Thanks for bringing it back up and sharing it with us.
You asked at one point whether you were giving us too much detail. Absolutely not. It's possible to do that, but you're a long way off.
Hey, a "Carl" thread I've not seen! I'm going to start from the beginning on this one, thanks for bringing it back to the top
Ugh, memories of playing with the carb on a '34 Sedan with a 174-supercharged Chevy engine.
If the throttle plate is open far enough to start to uncover the transition slots, the idle screws are doing nothing because you are pulling fuel from above the mixture screws. You'll need to open up the secondaries a little if possible so you can close up the primaries at idle. More likely, you'd need to drill some holes in the throttle plates so you can close them enough at idle to cover up the transition slots. Then you may find that it's too lean, not too rich.
I also ended up doing a lot of rework to the idle feed restrictors, a little at a time... pulling the carb off every time so as to not risk getting fuel on the polished blower. I was very familiar with working around the radiator support rods and the hood getting the carb on and off that tall-ass engine 
If your metering blocks have actual idle jets, congratulations! You don't need to use a pin vise set to drill out the IFRs.
But once it is dialed in, the drivability becomes amazing, since the transition slots are working as they should, all the metering circuits are working as they should, and you don't need to band-aid over a bad transition with the biggest accelerator pump cam and pump jet that come in the kit.
More random thoughts...
The transition slots feed the engine through the idle circuit via the IFRs (the Holley analogue to idle jets). So the fuel mixture for the transition between idle and the main circuit is controlled by the IFRs.
You tend to need to richen this up after you drill the throttle plates to get the throttle closed enough for the mixture screws to work because those drilled holes kind of represent a vacuum leak.
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
Thanks for these tips. I've seen drilling the throttle plates is a common tweak for supercharged applications. I'll take a closer look and see what's going on. I know just enough to be dangerous with Holley's, so it's great to have someone with more in-depth wisdom chime in. Thanks thanks thanks.
Fortunately, right now the driveability is very good from idle to any drastic or gradual change in throttle position--no bogs, coughs, or other frustrations. So I'm really into fine-tuning luckily.
It's been under 80 degrees ambient so far this summer and the car runs about 170-180 degrees with the new radiator. If I let it sit and idle, it will approach 190, so the fan is just barely doing its job. Once it gets into the 90s, I'm expecting:
We saw 92-94 degrees yesterday, depending on whose thermometer, so I had a chance to test hot driveability and idle temps. Driveability was fine everywhere and no different than colder temps, so I'm very happy. I took the car for a decently long drive and the temp stayed between 170-180, then let it idle for about 10 minutes and it crept up to just above 200.
I didn't have the patience to let it idle longer to see if it would keep climbing (it was hot outside!). Plus, it's pretty unlikely I'll have to let it idle any longer as I don't take it to big car shows or parades. Anyway, I took it for another drive and it cooled back down to about 185 pretty quickly. So I'm giving the cooling system a pass but not an "A."
Given the good results with driveability, I'm not going to mess with the tune anymore until I'm on the dyno. I'm going to try a little more timing and see how the A/F is. I may need to make some driveability tweaks after the dyno. Now I just need to find time to go that matches the time the dyno shop has available--never an easy task.
Next priority is getting the hole in the trans cover filled and getting the insulation/carpet back in now that it's hot outside.
Fixed the hole in the transmission cover:
I used a paint stick and some wadded up tinfoil to make space under the shift arm for the tape mold I quickly made.
Three layers of mat and some resin.
I should have taken more pictures, but I cut a few aluminum pieces to fill gaps that were letting hot air into the interior. I also used some black duct tape to seal some of the seams, then covered with 3/4" Dynamat on the firewall and 1/2" on the front of the floor (not shown).
I took the old insulation off the old carpet, glued the upper piece in, and the lower piece just lays in place. All that's left is a good shift boot.
I've driven this car for 25 years without insulation and my feet would get toasty. Now, it's very comfortable (85 degrees today). Why didn't I do this a long time ago?
This is why we call it Eclectic Motorworks: MGB, Beetle, M100 Elan, 2CV, MGA, Model T, 1934 Ford.
That's doing good. That '34 I mentioned would cruise at 200-210 and get up to 230 at idle. This with a full hood with the sides and everything.
It had a giant radiator made for us by Griffin, after mailing them the original-and-modified Ford radiator to use as a template, along with some measurements on where there was no more room for bigger. No room for an engine driven fan because the radiator was a belts thickness from the pulleys (8 or 10 rib blower drive, belt R&R was like playing Operation) so it had two pusher fans. It "worked" and the guy drove it around like that for at least 15 years.
We had a free hoist bay at Eclectic this evening, so I thought I'd put the car up in the air for a nut-and-bolt since I have about 100 miles on it since the major work. Most things were tight--exhaust flanges at the headers needed a little tightening as expected (stupid headers) and the trans pan bolts all needed about 1/4 turn.
The other reason I put it on the hoist was to fix the fuel gauge. I fixed the gauge on my 1966 Outlaw Beetle yesterday, so I thought I'd make it a twofer. The gauge always worked before I made all the updates. I figured I must have pinched a wire or done something simple when I put the new tank (old sender) in. Nope, the wiring was good and an ohm meter told me the sender had resistance. So I had to pull the tank to see more.
I did the work like a flat-rate tech--removing the bare minimum and balancing parts so I could leave things attached.
The picture doesn't show it very well, but the sender has a brass float that was full of gas. So the sender was okay, sunk float.
I didn't have a spare sender (it looks like a universal sender that gets used on a lot of hot rod gas tanks and boat tanks) and I didn't feel like putting the car back together to get the hoist bay back while I wait for parts. So I pulled out a used, broken MGB sender and took the arm/float from it.
I bent the MGB arm to fit in the sender and bent the rest of the arm to mimic the old arm's behavior.
Fixed and I have a fuel gauge again. The punch list is getting very short and the car is really fun to drive. Sorting makes such a difference!
Here's the punch list:
In reply to Carl Heideman :
Your week for fuel gauge senders? (Saw the Outlaw Bug thread too.)
11GTCS said:In reply to Carl Heideman :
Your week for fuel gauge senders? (Saw the Outlaw Bug thread too.)
Yep! Fuel gauges are more important to me these days because my sons sometimes drive my cars. Before that, I kind of had a sense for how much gas was in a car. Not anymore. So I make sure the gauges all work.
We had several days in the high 80s and my idle luck ran out. One night, I ran a lot of errands. I'd go 1-3 miles, stop for 5 minutes, drive a few miles, stop, etc. Of course the last stop was checking up on a hot rodder friend's latest project and the car died as I idled into his driveway. It restarted just fine, but it shouldn't have died in the first place. Over the next few days, the problem got progressively worse until a couple of days ago when the car would die at idle almost every time I came to a stop sign. When it started to happen, I did turn the idle screw up a little bit, but I knew that wasn't going to help because the problem was getting progressively worse. And I was pretty sure that turning the idle screw was moving the throttle plates past the transistion slots and would cause the problems Pete has discussed above.
So I pulled it into the driveway at the home shop to give it a proper look and I found that fuel was inconsistently dribbling out of the front passenger side booster at idle (top right). I wondered if I had a sunk float (since the gas gauge sunk) or other issues, so it was time to go inside.
Why does working on a Holley involve spilling so much fuel? I do find this Moroso drain tool very useful and spill very little.
The float was fine, but I found this fuzz stuck in the needle/seat.
I put it all back together and it's happy again!
There is a little postscript to this. I'm right on the edge of having the idle low enough to not slam into gear but high enough to stay running when I put the car into gear, especially when it's hot. As the carb gets heat soaked, it's even closer to the edge--I suspect the fuel is starting to boil and maybe overflowing out the booster erratically as it did with the dirty needle/seat.
If I turn the idle up just a little higher, that passenger front booster starts to erratically dribble again. I don't think I'm quite on the transition slots, but very close. I'm wondering:
I'll see if Pete or others chime in with any wisdom, and I may call Holley tech support and get their thoughts as well.
I'll admit I'm being pretty fussy at this point, but I'd like this setup to be that good.
I have a feeling your floats are just a little high. Mechanical fuel pump or electric?
One really neat "tool" that I used to use for Holleys was a 1 quart oil bottle with most of the face of one side removed. The cap is replaced with the spout from a 1 quart gear oil bottle.
When you have to mess with a Holley, you just remove the whole thing from the car and invert it over the bottle. All the gasoline drains out. Then you stick it on the carb stand you make from four 5/16" bolts, a handful of nuts, and a piece of thin wood, and do all the work on the bench where if you drop a little clip or jet or something it won't get lost in the engine bay. Not so much a big deal on a car with a center hinged hood, but try replacing the secondary jets on a Holley in a car with a rear facing hood... and a rear distributor.
Then after you put it back in the car, you pour the fuel back in with the spout, through the vent tubes. It's okay to spill some down the venturies, as that will get the engine going for you, since the accelerator pumps take forever to refill so you won't be able to pump the throttle a few times to prime the engine.
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
Thanks for the fast reply. I was wondering if I maybe should lower the float height (at least on the front bowl). I'll give it a try and report back.
Mechanical pump.
I really appreciate the tips. I spend a lot more time with SUs, Webers, and Solexes than Holleys.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:Ugh, memories of playing with the carb on a '34 Sedan with a 174-supercharged Chevy engine.
If the throttle plate is open far enough to start to uncover the transition slots, the idle screws are doing nothing because you are pulling fuel from above the mixture screws. You'll need to open up the secondaries a little if possible so you can close up the primaries at idle. More likely, you'd need to drill some holes in the throttle plates so you can close them enough at idle to cover up the transition slots. Then you may find that it's too lean, not too rich.
I also ended up doing a lot of rework to the idle feed restrictors, a little at a time... pulling the carb off every time so as to not risk getting fuel on the polished blower. I was very familiar with working around the radiator support rods and the hood getting the carb on and off that tall-ass engine
If your metering blocks have actual idle jets, congratulations! You don't need to use a pin vise set to drill out the IFRs.
But once it is dialed in, the drivability becomes amazing, since the transition slots are working as they should, all the metering circuits are working as they should, and you don't need to band-aid over a bad transition with the biggest accelerator pump cam and pump jet that come in the kit.
It's time for me to thank Pete again. His 314 words (yes, I counted them) in the two posts on 6/10/24 have been more useful that several books and magazines in my library about Holleys and/or roots supercharging. Those 314 words have also been more useful than the whole internet. The only things that come close are some articles reprinted from Pat Ganhal (Hot Rod and his Street Supercharging book), Jeff Smith (Hot Rod), and some YouTube videos that I've liked from a channel called TPV Productions.
Thank you, Pete! You have so briefly provided so many tips that are truly useful.
With that thank you, here is a status update. I've been fine-tuning the idle about 1/4-1/2 turn of the screwdriver and it's still in a pretty good place, but I think it's right on the edge of needing to drill the throttle plates as Pete suggests.
It's pretty happy with the idle mixture screws 2-1/2 turns out and just a little bit of the transition slots exposed (I'll measure the exact amount next time I have the carb off--probably less than .050"). On hot and/or humid days, it just about dies when I put it into gear, but barely holds on. I'd like it just a little better, plus I feel like I'm at the far edge of the adjustment (more than 2-1/2 turns and I think the screws will work their way out).
I did open the secondaries a small amount by hand and fuel started dribbling out of the accel pump squirters (not the boosters), so I'm not sure I can open them any more. Next time I try, I'm going to use a feeler gauge to measure the opening instead of just manually manipulating the secondaries by hand. If I can open them a little more, maybe I won't need to drill the primary throttle disks.
Until I'm ready to get more drastic, I'm going to try to turn in the idle mixture screws 1/4 turn, then drive for a couple of good sessions with stops and heat soaks in between, then go another 1/4 if it's still happy. I do know that less than 2 turns makes it die occasionally, so it's pretty close.
One last thing: The passenger front booster isn't dribbling at idle any more, but it does dribble if I slowly or quickly snap the throttle in Park. The left booster doesn't dribble, so I'm still wondering if I have something defective. I may swap them side to side or do something else to diagnose them. I have lowered the float level to pretty low with no effect.
TL;DR: Car runs great, Carl is being very fussy because he wants it all.
You're welcome, man!
I am fighting a big block Chevy with a way too small carb right now... the throttle has to be open enough to idle in gear that it's uncovering the ported vacuum, so the idle speed is like 700 in gear, and then in Park it shoots up to 1300 because the ignition timing goes from 15 to 24 degrees. Yuck.
Mind you, I no longer WORK at a shop that does hot rods. But this one came in and I'm the guy on the team that speaks the language, so it falls to my lap.
Here's a little diversion, but still about hot rods. I'm not a show car person. I like my cars driveable, I don't find cleaning and detailing fun, and it just not appealing to me to go to a car show and sit around.
But about a month ago, Ron Covell, a metalworker who's been a friend (and hero) of mine for many years, sent me an email that he was selling a show car he built in the early '80's. The car was quite famous at the time, garnering a of show trophies and many magazine features. It stayed with its original owner until he passed away, and then Ron bought it from his widow about 15 years ago. He was wondering if I knew of anyone who could buy it and take good care of it. I called a few friends to spread the word, but then started pondering it a little more. It's not my kind of car in some ways, but I really admire the metalwork (he built the hood and nose) and chassis (Ron built it with a torsion bar front end and a coil over suspended Halibrand quick-change in the back).
The car is a total time capsule, with the original paint and almost exactly as it was in the 1980s. The only major change is that it had a custom digital dash and Ron converted it to convential gauges. I'll probably fix the dash, although I don't know if I'll reinstall it or not. I also got several original drawing from the designer (Don Varner) and some build photos. Very cool piece of history.
If you want to learn a little more about it, Ron put up a video on his YouTube channel with a lot of details: https://youtu.be/k7JecUk6MgQ?si=J60AG73zSngDgew1
I have a bunch of Ron's VHS tapes. I'm not really into Track Ts or show cars but Ron is a hero of mine and that car is a very cool piece of history.
In reply to APEowner :
I'm in the same boat and saw it as a chance to enjoy the history and craftsmanship. I love the car from the windshield posts forward as it uses some great racecar styling from the 1930s to early '50s. From the windshield posts back, it was stepping into the billet era, so it's a bit of an anachronism. Ron's next car with Don Varner was the California Star, which was very non-traditional and controversial (but won the Grand National Roadster Show).
But it was built for show so it's more like kinetic sculpture than a car. It drives very well, but the ergonomics are not great and my head is well above the windshield.
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