GRM $2015 Challenge

aussiesmg wrote: The tires must be DOT legal for the autocross,

Not anymore.

In reply to GarageYourself:

What size are you looking for? Check ebay sometimes you can get a deal on some take offs.

i got a deal on some new NT01's on ebay for less than anywhere else.

See y'all next year.... Just haven't had that Essy alum d-port fall into my lap or hell, a decent CI head, yet. Just have to put my $150 pair of 2.3 turbo short blocks into use....

Ranger50 wrote: Just have to put my $150 pair of 2.3 turbo short blocks into use....

one for the front wheels and one for the rear?

rcutclif wrote:

Ranger50 wrote: Just have to put my $150 pair of 2.3 turbo short blocks into use....

one for the front wheels and one for the rear?

Ummm, no.

Pssht, behind..... Still waiting for parts from the UK and have yet to send my injectors off for a rebuild. Rust is treated and there is zinc primer on the wings. We'll be there.

Man, this is gonna be so much fun!

VWguyBruce wrote: Pssht, behind..... Still waiting for parts from the UK and have yet to send my injectors off for a rebuild. Rust is treated and there is zinc primer on the wings. We'll be there.

Now I don't feel so bad. I just need to get my shocks/springs back in and the brakes back together to be drivable. But I've found myself waking up at 3am thinking of what I need to do next.

MrJoshua wrote:

aussiesmg wrote: The tires must be DOT legal for the autocross,

Not anymore.

Truth.

Rules said: The following will be required: all lug nuts present; functioning throttle return spring; positive battery tie-down; properly operating brakes; wheel bearings free of excessive play; properly secured seat; and tires free of any exposed cords or other defects. Additionally, all loose items shall be removed from the interior, and open cars running non-DOT race slicks must have approved rollover protection. Cars that do not meet the SCCA’s Static Stability Factor will be relegated to tires with a UTQG rating of 200 or higher.

This event embraces the spirit of this being a BUDGET build (from all I have read). How does allowing tires that cost almost as much as the whole build fit that spirit?

We had hopes that we might be competitive in the autocross, but there is no way unless I spend an additional $1300+ on tires (Tire rack pricing). There should be a limit of new retail of $150/tire, anything over comes out of the build budget. Just my $.02 (Which in this arena goes a long way :) )

In reply to GarageYourself:

The reason for the tire exemption is probably a long drawn out one with a lot of issues encountered in 15 years of the event.

But I think it fits the spirit. Just as the driver is the #1 most important after-market part, the tires are the second most. They leveled the playing field on drivers by having pro drivers, and leveled the issue on tires by making them exempt. But you still have to spend your money (and your exemptions) wisely.

I am going to challenge your suggestion that there is no way for you to be competitive in the autocross without $1300 tires, because I have done it.

My car wore $1300 worth of autocross tires last year, and won 3rd in the autocross. This year, I have removed the expensive autocross tires, and switched to free race cast-offs. I can't tell you how we will perform in the autocross yet, but I can tell you we moved from 27th place finishes or worse at highly competitive local venues to top 5 finishes with cheaper tires.

Just because you CAN buy tires exempt, doesn't mean you should.

In reply to GarageYourself:

The problem stems from people showing up on some pretty fresh looking Hoosiers that they received for $50 or free as take offs. Not that they didn't, just not everyone was able to find the same connections to acquire tires cheap. I'm still running cheap take offs because real life can't justify $1300 in new tires. As SVreX said it is to even the playing field. This event is really a builders game. The first year with free Kuhmo tires we all lost to a Jeep at Autocross. That says a lot to the build levels that people are capable of with a limited budget. I'm still upset my Miata was beat by a Jeep.

For anyone doubting the Jeep Team External Combustions claim that the tires were free take-offs, please note that they also gave sets away to others, and not after they used them themselves. Just sayin'.

And, for the record, we discussed the tire rule during a $2000 Challenge town hall meeting. We wanted to hear what those who had skin in the game thought.

To be honest, going into the meeting the staff figured that the group would want some kind of tire limit. After various competitors presented their arguments, the group voted on the current tire rule. It was deemed the most fair, easiest-to-regulate option.

hey, my new tires only cost $396. my 2 used drag tires add $100 though. i like the rule, even as a newcomer to the event, because it let me pick something i wanted to run all the time versus scrounging for a set with a little life left in them.

TheV8Kid wrote: Coming to the Challenge in 2016. https://www.youtube.com/embed/3x17ax8hGZM

I agree that it's odd that you can spend that much off budget on one part of a $2015 car, but I can also argue many reasons why the new rule makes sense. Whatever your thoughts, it is a current rule and there are cheaper alternatives than new that are darn near just as good. I personally wouldn't go new because the budget alternative is the only way for me to make this type of thing work.

It's only people who have not competed who don't get the rules, come play and you might understand more.

Also, according to the rules you only get to exempt 4 tires. If you build a dual purpose car you are still going to have to get some used or budget drag slicks to hook up in the 1/4 mile. I think my $900 GTI ended up 9th in the autoX last year running on some Toyo takeoffs.

AND, if you need to find some budget tires for the AutoX or drag post your tire size here. Other GRM'rs are a great source for finding what you need.

aussiesmg wrote: It's only people who have not competed who don't get the rules, come play and you might understand more.

I'm working on it!

David S. Wallens wrote: And, for the record, we discussed the tire rule during a $2000 Challenge town hall meeting. We wanted to hear what those who had skin in the game thought. To be honest, going into the meeting the staff figured that the group would want some kind of tire limit. After various competitors presented their arguments, the group voted on the current tire rule. It was deemed the most fair, easiest-to-regulate option.

I like the rules.

I voted in favor of the Tire Rule because we were running a car with an odd rim size. It was simply hard to find any tire to fit, let alone finding a good used one for a budget friendly price.

My point is that a smart person would reject an oddball car because cheap tires are not available, which would lead to a field of Miatas, E30s, and Civics zzzzzz. (I'm sorry, I started to fall asleep while thinking about those challenge car selections.) The tire rule opens up car choice possibilities.

I have a question about the Longest Drive Award: Longest drive from home to the event award.

I have a terrible idea and some spare time. If I were to fly somewhere buy a car and drive it to the challenge would I qualify for this award or would my distance only count from my actual residence?

In reply to Andy Neuman:

I think terrible ideas should be encouraged!