modified car VS stock

So typically when considering a car purchase, I try to find one with the least miles within budget as well as overall condition. I would normally avoid a car with a lot of "mods" as they are typically done by someone using a butter knife and zip ties. With that said, I found a decent FRS with a lot of tasteful work, mostly suspension for what I consider to be a fair price. He came down to $14k as a cash only option, and I'm heavily considering it. The car would be used as a daily/STX autocross/HPDE mule.

I was worried it may have been an abused track pig, so I asked a couple questions with this response:

"The car did see one HPDE open track day at Hallett. All of the parts were installed by me and my brother (we are both mechanical engineers). Most of the parts have about 10k-15k miles on them (I don’t know the exact mileage on them as I installed them after I stopped daily driving the car)."

From the pics it looks to be an immaculate example, and well taken care of. Most modified ones I have looked at, often have scuffs and dings all over the bumpers, silly ugly wide body kits, intakes poorly clamped in place, and generally look like they were posted from silly Snapchats with emojis. Often they are pics with foam at the carwash all over them. Weird.

Anyway, I'm torn between a stock example car in the 2016 range with about 25-35k miles for about 16,500-17500 or the one below.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1051544991694290/?ref=messenger_banner

Seller's Description

2013 Scion FRS w/ Premium Bespoke Audio 54,000 miles (and going up slowly as I do still drive it occasionally) Clean Inside and Out The car was just looked over by Sherwood Tire Pros and everything is in excellent working order. I am selling my 2013 Scion FRS as I have too many projects and need to consolidate vehicles. This vehicle handles amazingly and was built for HPDE track days or it could even be used for autocross. Modifications: Raceseng Shock Top Rear Upper Mount - $335 Whiteline Adjustable End Links (Front) - $120 Perrin Steering Rack Lock - $89 Whiteline Lower Control Arm Inner Bushing (Rear) - $45 Whiteline Rear Trailing Arm Bushing (Front, Lower) - $72 Whiteline Steering Rack & Pinion Mounts - $40 Whiteline Control Arm Inner Bushing (Front) - $45 Whiteline Positive Traction Kit - $40 Whiteline Upper Control Arm Bushing (Rear) - $130 SPC Camber Bolt Kit (Front) - $23 Whiteline Roll Center / Bump Steer Kit (Ball Joints, Tie Rod Ends) - $180 Perrin Control Arm Brace (Front) - $87 (Included but not installed) Whiteline Anti-Dive Caster Kit - $135 Raceseng Cascam Plates (Front) - $595 Whiteline Adjustable Toe Arms (Rear) - $315 GTSpec Front Strut Tower Brace - $202 Eibach Anti-Roll Kit - $509 Whiteline Adjustable End Links (Rear) - $120 KW V3 Coilovers - $2167 SPC Adjustable Lower Control Arms (Rear) w/ Toe Kit - $230 Enkei NT03+M Wheels 18x9.5 +40MM (Black) - $1404 Falken Azenis RT615K Tires - $499 JPM Coachworks Stitched Gauge Hood - $110 JPM Coachworks Speaker Trim Alcantara Red Stitching - $150 JPM Coachworks Knee Pads Alcantara Red Stitching - $135 JPM Coachworks Brake Boot Alcantara Red Stitching - $80 JPM Coachworks Shift Boot Alcantara Red Stitching - $60 Toyota OEM Black AC Vents (Outer) - $25 Toyota OEM Black Dash Trim (Passenger) - $38 Toyota OEM Black Door Handles - $54 Toyota OEM Black Knee Pad Trim - $22 Toyota OEM Black Radio Dash Trim - $38 Toyota OEM Black Shifter Trim - $19 Toyota OEM Black Steering Wheel Trim - $21 Toyota OEM MT Traction Control Buttons - $55 Toyota OEM Black Door Levers w/ Locks - $57 Weathertech Floorliner Digitalfit All Weather Floor Mats - $110 Weathertech Trunk Liner (Black) - $110 ATI EZ Pod Triple Meter Gauge Pod Felt Like Finish - $139 OLM LED Interior Dome Light - $7 Velox Throttle Pedal Spacer Kit - $125 Cusco Sports Accelerator Pedal - $46 Sparco Champion Steering Wheel - $260 NRG Generation 2 Quick Release Steering Wheel Adapter - $130 NRG Short Hub - $85 Greddy Power Intake System - $379 Beat-Sonic FDA43 Shark Fin Antenna - $104 Toyota Emblems (Pair) - $53 GT86 Trunk Emblem - $50 OLM Vision LED Fog Light Kit - $160 Winjet JDM Headlights (Black) - $350 Morimoto Headlight Elite HID System - $150 OLM LED License Plate Bulbs - $20 Spyder V1 Tail Lights (Chrome with Red Housing) - $320 Carsmo Design Rear Duckbill Trunk Spoiler - $300 Cusco Tow Hook (Front, Swivel) - $118 (Included but not installed) Cusco Tow Hook (Rear, Folding) - $118 (Included but not installed) Perrin and Whiteline Bushing Combo - $63 Whiteline Support Outrigger Insert - $54 Whiteline Crossmember Kit - $135 Whiteline Diff Cradle Mount Kit - $117 Whiteline Rear Diff Support Bushing - $54 Goodridge Stainless Steel Brake Lines (Front and Rear) - $115 EBC Yellowstuff Brake Pads (Front/Rear) - $94 DBA T3 Rotors (Front and Rear) - $566 (Rear Included but not installed) Grimmspeed Master Cylinder Brace - $95 ISR Performance Exhaust - $500 Downforce Carbon Fiber Front Lip - $250 Moroso Oil Pan Baffle - $135 (Included but not installed) Oil just changed and I will include the oil and filter for another change as well Total = $13,538 in performance parts KBB and NADA both list the value at $13,000 stock. I am asking $16,000 OBO for the vehicle with all of the parts listed above. I am in no rush to sell and I do not need help selling the vehicle. No test drives without cash in hand. Let me know if you have any questions. Less

I am of the opinion that if you are going to be modifying a car anyways, buying a pre-modified car can be a great deal - if the modifications are of good quality and properly installed. In this case it really depends on your priorities for the car's intended daily/stx/hpde use. If the primary purpose is daily driver, I would go for the 2015+ to avoid the recall work/nightmare going on with the 2013 Scions. If you are going to be mainly tracking the car and driving it as an afterthought this is a great way to get all those mods for pennies on the dollar and it's probably worth having to fix the valve spring issue yourself. 

I am in agreement with dj, if you want an autocross or hpde car, buy someone elses! (as long as the mods are good quality and installed correctly). You will save a ton of time and money, especially if you need to pay a shop to install performance parts. You can spend the extra time and money on motorsports events over mods. If you will still miss modifying it yourself, you can make small changes so the driving characteristics are different, especially when you learn how the car drives.

Here's my thoughts:

1. Seller is realistic about that fact that mods, even good ones, don't add big $$$$$ to the value of the car.

2. Parts list is quality stuff.

3.  Seller claims to be an engineer.  If true, this is a good thing.  Generally speaking, the engineers I know aren't automatically great mechanics, but if they do a job, they research the heck out of it and know the "right" way to do it.  You likely won't find any zip ties.

4. Don't be afraid of track days IF the owner is as OCD as the ad would indicate.  Sure a track day may add some "hard miles", but it typically also means frequent fluid changes and no differed maintenance.  On the other hand, if the owner is a flat brimmer who calls you "dude", sticker bombed the interior, and tells you how he stuffed it into "the beach" at turn 11 at Gingerman during his last HDPE (which he will call "my last race"), you might want to run screaming.  

5.  Miles indicate regular, but not extreme annual use.

I'd probably pull the trigger on this one if I was in the market. 

Sounds legit. If I were looking for that kind of toy, I'd jump on it.

Seller's response wasn't laced with "yo" and "bruh" and "vape", nor does it seem like the car was hacked together with eBay bits. 

The only thing that gave me pause is the NRG wheel.  I usually see those on drift cars, but those cars usually have cheap parts and the cars are beat to hell.  You can easily sell the tail lights + interior bits for 500+, and if you want something more daily/wallet friendly I'd sell the wheels/tires.  Put another way, I think if you want to put in the time you can get it back to stock (not sure if he has all the parts?) and have that car for 11k easily.  Now it's a 13 so may be under the recall, and if you track it the coils tend to go bad, but whether all of that is worth it is up to you and your intended purpose.

Sorry about the formatting on the parts list, I didn't expect them to be lumped together like that.

The NRG wheel is a bit Drifty McDrifterton Jr. but have seen not all are terrible ebay specials.

The wheels technically aren't legal for STX as they are .5" wider than allowed. I would prefer a set of 17x9 of whatever is light and strong, but these would work for now.

I forgot about the valve spring recall disasters. After some light reading I see they are attempting to get this sorted, so if anything I may contact the dealer and confirm they have performed the recall before successfully. It's about the only thing that I see as a major issue.

The all cash thing is also kinda weird. I couldn't bring a proper money order or cashier's check, cash only. Carrying around $14k in Benjies is a bit sketch for me.

Insist on going to a notary to have bill of sale and title transferred. They may even have them at police stations, so if he has bad intentions he’ll push back on that. 

In reply to captainawesome :

Meet at a police station.  Most departments don't mind, in fact, many encourage it.  Only if the seller balks at that would I worry.  Of course I usually bring along my friends Mr. Smith & Mr. Wesson if I'm carrying over $1000 cash.  

Really the only thing on that list I don't like is the KW coilovers, IIRC (and I may not) they are still soft, progressive springs even on the V3.

That's weird about the cash only thing. And does make it seem sketchy. Tell him to meet you at his bank and take it that way if he must, then you aren't responsible for having that amount of cash on you or him trying to be sketchy.

No test drives without cash in hand.

I always read this as no joy rides, be prepared to prove you can afford this car and have intention of purchasing it. It's like an all encompassing drift bro filter not that he want's a cash only sale.

RacetruckRon said:

No test drives without cash in hand.

I always read this as no joy rides, be prepared to prove you can afford this car and have intention of purchasing it. It's like an all encompassing drift bro filter not that he want's a cash only sale.

Thats how I read it to. I dont let anyone test drive my car unless they can prove they can pay for it. 

No, I thought the same thing originally. He insisted cash only after discussing how the funds would be exchanged. No bank money order or cashier's check would be accepted. Cash only.

Going to the local PD should be a reasonable option.

I'll read up on the KW's as I assumed that was a good upper shelf option.

If any forum members know of or are considering selling a good 6 speed example I'm willing to fly or drive out if needed. I really would prefer a white car, but will consider others as well.

In reply to captainawesome :

That is... different. Proceed with caution Cap'n

I would be very, very weary of someone who REFUSES to take a cashier's check, bank money order, a wire transfer or similar. 

z31maniac said:

I would be very, very weary of someone who REFUSES to take a cashier's check, bank money order, a wire transfer or similar. 

 

I agree, this seems a bit odd.  For a $500 winter beater, ok sure, insist on cash only that’s totally reasonable.  But for a car that’s over $10k? ehhhhhhhh…

I found another car locally with less miles and in stock condition. It has a bumper blemish/crack on the underside of the passenger side, but no damage to structure. I'm fairly certain a bumper place could repair it for less than a new bumper, though I'll get some numbers to be sure. The damage gave me some leverage to lessen the price, so I could potentially get the car for about $2k under book. It's also a 2015, so no recall to mess with, less miles, and I get to tinker a little.

I decided the stock car just wasn't for me.

Tomorrow afternoon I should be shaking hands in the Police department parking lot showering the previous owner of the highly modified FRS in cash. Fingers crossed everything is uneventful/awesome. I'll update when the coast is clear.

I can understand the "No Cashiers Checks or Money Orders"  thing.  I wouldn't accept that either, unless I was physically present and at the counter of a buyers bank when the check was issued. (where I would immediately cash or have wired to my account).  They are too easily forged...

No wire transfers is a little more suspicious, but as a Buyer, I wouldn't send one anyway until I was in possession of both the the car and properly signed/notarized title.  Once sent, it's gone...

If he won't meet you at a bank and accept either a check or a wire that he watched you initiate, it could be a red flag, or it could just be an overabundance of caution.  I hope it's the latter!(It likely is)

(I Just went though this on a 35k+ car bought out of state, I really didn't feel comfortable driving all that way with that much cash on me.  Ironically I was more concerned about egregious civil forfeiture laws than I was about the seller.)

edit: I just noticed the date of your post, How did it work out?

In reply to cbaclawski :

Civil forfeiture was definitely on my mind as well.

I ended up taking the advice above about meeting at a police department. What was really surprising when pulling up to the PD was the two marked parking spaces dedicated to a SAFE TRADE ZONE. I've never seen one before, but I think it's a great idea.

So essentially everything went without a hitch, I brought the cash, the car was as advertised (possibly better), and we both left happy. My favorite type of transaction.

For anyone interested here's the thead I started to try to document the future of the car: https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/build-projects-and-project-cars/freddy-mcshreddy-midlife-crisis-frs-thingy/153004/page1/