My first "project" car

I've posted on this form before about my lack of skills with a wrench in hand. I can "bench talk" cars pretty well, I have a good understanding of them, but my mechanical experience is limited to oil changes and a few plug changes. I've wanted to teach myself for many years. Made a few small attempts to start, but no true project cars to date.

Well, I saw something on Craigslist and just on an impulse decided to take the plunge. So here it is....

http://s1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa424/Klayfish/

There were actually two of them for sale. I was supposed to pick up the second one on Monday, but bad weather forced me to postpone. I've got a verbal deal for it, and if I do pick it up, I'll have paid $500 total for both cars. I haven't heard from the guy in a few days, so I'm hoping he didn't sell it to someone else.

Anyhow, gotta say when I got this first one home, I had that moment of "Oh crap, what have I gotten myself into?" But I ordered a Haynes manual and found a good forum. I'm going to take a step back, clean it out and try one step at a time.

I'll post my progress. Hopefully there will be more progress than the wife saying..."get that hunk of crap out of my driveway...

EDIT: I should say that my goal for this car(s) is not a full restoration or anything like that. I just want to turn some wrenches, learn some things, hopefully get it to run and drive. If I can accomplish those goals, I'll go from there.

You'll learn quick, and Fiats are pretty simple for the most part. You'll certainly learn about wiring, that's for sure.

I started somewhat the same way you have, but with.... running cars. I'm still awful, but i can eventually do pretty much anything. (except welding)

Trial by fire makes you learn faster. (Should i even say that in light of your new Italian car purchase?)

Nice score!

Edit: +1 on trial by fire. it's a great motivator

Welcome to Fiat ownership, I did the same thing as you last August, and been working on mine ever since, but I took it for its first 'real' drive this past weekend, and found a bunch more things that it needs. Here are some sites you'll really want to go through the documentation on very thoroughly, it's how I rewired my fuse block into a modern style ATO/ATC and also how to tune a carb, etc.

1) www.artigue.com/?page_id=3 - I took the PDF and printed it out on legal size paper at Office Depot for $20 in color, worth every cent. The Haynes manual has the diagrams but they're black and white with labels and hard to follow all the connections on a small page.

2) http://www.mirafiori.com/faq/ - I used Matt Webb's writeup on ATO fuse block conversion to do it to mine, now everything works, all the time, lights are bright, flashers flash at a good speed, etc. http://www.fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=12341 (page 2 has the final product, though I've since gone back and heatshrinked all the connectors.

3) Besides fluid flush, check timing on the cams, spark timing, and pull the valve covers and check valve lash (I think the procedure and clearances are on page 34 or 43 of the Haynes manual - I'm doing mine now). I'm pretty sure your year has actual ground blocks for all the grounds which makes checking connectors alot easier than early cars where they're everywhere!

These cars are crazy simple so you chose well mechanically. On the down side all the electrical connectors are exposed and chances are the wiring is degraded up into the sheathing, I found I had to cut back several inches to get good clean wiring when I redid my block.

Good pick!

Looks like a heck of a deal to me. Nice score.

Raze wrote: Welcome to Fiat ownership, I did the same thing as you last August, and been working on mine ever since, but I took it for its first 'real' drive this past weekend, and found a bunch more things that it needs. Here are some sites you'll really want to go through the documentation on very thoroughly, it's how I rewired my fuse block into a modern style ATO/ATC and also how to tune a carb, etc. 1) www.artigue.com/?page_id=3 - I took the PDF and printed it out on legal size paper at Office Depot for $20 in color, worth every cent. The Haynes manual has the diagrams but they're black and white with labels and hard to follow all the connections on a small page.

If you can somehow print in good detail on a much larger sheet, it would help a TON.

And on the flip side, if your home printer can do legal paper, you can make copies that you can get dirty, too.

But my point here- what Raze mentions is excellent- information that you can read easily and follow wires. Wiring is one of the most intimidating things, until you figure it out, and then you wonder what the fuss was.

2) http://www.mirafiori.com/faq/ - I used Matt Webb's writeup on ATO fuse block conversion to do it to mine, now everything works, all the time, lights are bright, flashers flash at a good speed, etc. http://www.fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=12341 (page 2 has the final product, though I've since gone back and heatshrinked all the connectors. Good pick!

Just going on with the wiring- kind of as a follow up to Raze- if you DO wiring (and I bet you will), please, do yourself a favor, and do it right. No stripping/twisting/taping- that never works. Always make good connections, and try to find the best connectors you can. I've had incredible luck getting engineering samples from Moldex- they have the original spade connectors, which are almost impossible to find on the market. That does require a really good crimper- which will pay for itself quite quickly. If you can find GOOD butt connections that you later cover with heat shink- that's a lot better than the colored ones you see at basic stores like murrays.

Most people tend to be very careful and slow with engine work, but think they can take short cuts with the wires. MOST reasons I've seen classic cars have issues was wiring, and a lot of that is due to owners taking short cuts. OEM wires are usually good- but are old, and can have ground and basic connection issues. On all of my Alfas, the wires near the engine are the ones that really need replaced.

Can't help with the specifics, but for your sanity, just do the wiring by the diagram, using good parts, wires, and connetions.

And a +1 on the good pick!!!

Eric

Listen to Alfa, he steered me when I first started and I'm glad I took his advice to heart. Even though I initially 'taped' my connectors, I went back and heat shrinked everything as advised as it took exactly one exposed connector contacting the chassis to pop fuses and scare the crap out of me...

And his comment about once you understand the wiring is spot on, I took a whole week over Xmas vacation getting my head wrapped around it all. Now it's a total joke, and I know what to scare if it even tries to look at me the wrong way.

His comment on the mechanical aspect is also dead nuts as that's where I've had the most experience so I've been taking it very, very slowly and glad I did. My cams were off 5-10°, any more and I would have started munching them. Instead I caught and fixed it before I ever ran the car...

Thanks for the advice, guys. When I saw the cars up for sale, I thought it was a good deal and they would make great projects. Getting two complete cars for $500 is a steal. The guy owns a small restoration shop, specializing in old British cars, but he also had a love for Spiders. These were his own cars (they're titled in his name, so that checked out). The car I picked up is missing the intake manifold and carb, but the guy is supposed to find them and give them to me when I pick up the second car...

Wiring is definitely intimidating to look at. The wires on the car I have so far seem neatly bundled together (at least from my initial glance) which is better than other cars I've seen where the wires are just a rat's nest. Great idea on printing out the diagrams, I'll definitely do that.

I definitely plan to take things slowly, I'm in no rush. With my life outside of cars, I have very little free time anyway. If I get 2 hours in a week to work on the car, I'll be very lucky, one hour will be more likely. So progress is going to be slow no matter what. My goal for this weekend, besides picking up the second car, is to get them cleaned out and sort through all the spare parts. Then I'll be ready to start in on wrenching.

Wish i was closer, i'd love to get my hands dirty in some old Italian iron.

Didn't one of this group do a DIY paint job on a 124? I could have sworn it was here, and was a very nice deep blue.

It's quite possible that once you get your favorite one up and running, you can use car 2 for 1) a Challenge car, 2) find there's enough parts to assemble and then sell for profit, or 3) someting else.

I would go out on a limb and predict that you can do a killer GRM challenge car to #2, once you are comfortable enough with #1. (and I'm saying that from doing a Turbo Alfa at the challenge). You will learn so much, it's not even funny.

The best part is that you seem to like the cars in the first place. It's hard to take yourself out to work when the like isn't that strong. This is a hobby, not a job.

Yeah, I'm not sure how long the wife will let me keep both cars at the house. She loves cars and is very supportive, but a girl's got her limits...

Apparently, the second car I'm picking up on Saturday is much more assembled. The interior is complete and the intake manifold and carb are already attached, but the body is more rusty. I'll probably start with that car, just trying to make it run. And you're right Alfa, I've got lots of options with the two cars. Once I get into it more, I'll have a clearer picture of what to do with them...each car has it's strengths and weaknesses.

I definitely do like the cars. They're really cool, so they'll keep my interest for sure. I didn't realize how big they are. I've got the orange one parked next to my NC Miata, and by eyeballing, it looks just as big, if not bigger.

Hey...can I save this thread as a "favorite" in my profile? Not sure how to do that.

you can link to it in your garage when you create a listing for this car there. Thats how Id do it anyway.

Congrats on the project. I know how you feel and my wrench are pretty poor as well (what there is of them). However, all of my cars have been used as a DD and there is a limit to how much I will toy with them as I need them to run come Monday morning. Especially since most of them have spent there lives parked on various city streets. Remember that Harbor Freight has great deals on tools. Good luck, have fun, and keep us posted!

Klayfish wrote: Hey...can I save this thread as a "favorite" in my profile? Not sure how to do that.

Click the red heart below the quick post box to save it as a favorite.

Thought I'd follow up on this and show part two of my first project car(s). This is the second of the '76 Fiat Spiders I bought. I also got a spare transmission, 4 radiators, several carbs and 3 or 4 boxes of assorted parts. Both cars and all those parts for $500...quite a score!!

This second one has been in a barn for 5 years, so it's really dirty. It's got a pretty rusty body. Darn shame too, because the interior isn't too bad, it's just dirty. The top is decent too, just dirty. I need to get underneath it, but actually it doesn't look horribly rusty underneath. Doesn't matter much anyway, I have no plans to "restore" this car. I bought these with the goal of learning how to wrench on cars. So, since this one is more assembled, I'll start practicing on this one. The goal is just to get it to start. I've found a great Fiat support forum, and I'll definitely ask plenty of questions here. First thing I'm going to do is take inventory of the parts boxes, so I know what I have, then figure out what the first step in putting this red car back together is. Maybe duct tape on that front tire...

http://s1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa424/Klayfish/1976%20Fiat%20Spider/

I recommend you put your efforts into the less rusty car. If you can convince yourself to leave the paint and body alone, you will stay out of deep financial trouble.

Keep in mind that the valves are an interference design; if the cams are not timed right, they will collide with the pistons. Ask me how I know!

They are simple cars. I rebuild the engine when I was 18 and all ended well.

the 134 is a great little car--it has the best convertible top design of all the imports, bar none.