Article request?

I did get this series picked up by a car blog. I will post links when they are up. I will be writing it, probably 2 series per week.

I am pretty excited. (going to the Barber Indy weekend to do "research"...yeah, that's it!)

Answering those questions could fill a book, but we could tackle it in bite-sized chunks--and we have done some similar articles already.

The next issue does have a history of World Challenge, covering its evolution from the creation of Showroom Stock (1972) through today--including all of the name changes. We did a similar piece a year or so ago on professional street stock racing which basically covered a parallel trail: Showroom Stock to Playboy Endurance Series to Escort Endurance Series to Firehawk to (eventually) Koni and today's Continental Tire Challenge series.

If you guys want to read more pieces like that, we can deliver. We know people.

Javelin wrote: * P2 (begat from IMSA GTO, identical to International P2 at LeMans)

IMSA GTO would be more like an ALMS GT1 car. P2 would be more like IMSA Camel Lights (FIA/ACO C2).

FIA: Federation Internationale de l'Automobile, international sanctioning body for motorsport.
ACO: Automobile Club de l'Ouest, the folks that operate Le Mans.

Or did maroon already post those up?

Here is the first post in the series. I will be carrying all of them through. If you have any requests, just ask.

For the first one, I thought I would dive in to the deep end of the pool with the most complicated and convoluted rulebook in the world.

ALMS!

A guide on IndyCar has already been written and submitted, should be arriving soon.

Maroon92 wrote: Here is the first post in the series. I will be carrying all of them through. If you have any requests, just ask. For the first one, I thought I would dive in to the deep end of the pool with the most complicated and convoluted rulebook in the world. ALMS! A guide on IndyCar has already been written and submitted, should be arriving soon.

Great article, but I still have many questions!

1. I see that IMSA is the founder. Does ALMS have anything to do with the old IMSA classes (rules similarities, races run, etc)? Did IMSA kill their original series' when they launched ALMS?

2. You mentioned a GTE Am class, is that the only sub-class? Are the Pros just "regular" GTE?

3. GTE: Are they tube-framed or production-based? Do they use their production engines, or is output restricted? Are there any factory-backed teams?

4. GTC: Same questions as GTE.

5. GTC-Spec-911-whatever: What's the point? Are these stock 911 GT3 Cup cars? Are they used in any other series?

6: Overall, any rules similarities? IE - do the LMP1 cars run at the real LeMans or do any European teams come over here to run?

7: LMP2: What's the point? What are the differences other than being restricted and lighter?

8: "Green"? I see mention of the Diesel Audi and Peugots, and that's it. What else is "green"? Hybrid 911's? Ethanol? KERS?

Thanks!

Javelin wrote:

Maroon92 wrote: Here is the first post in the series. I will be carrying all of them through. If you have any requests, just ask. For the first one, I thought I would dive in to the deep end of the pool with the most complicated and convoluted rulebook in the world. ALMS! A guide on IndyCar has already been written and submitted, should be arriving soon.

Great article, but I still have many questions! 1. I see that IMSA is the founder. Does ALMS have anything to do with the old IMSA classes (rules similarities, races run, etc)? Did IMSA kill their original series' when they launched ALMS? IMSA was founded in 1969 IIRC. The company was nearly bankrupt when the current crew that runs it now stepped in. Effectively all other classing was scrapped when the ALMS was created. They don't sanction much else but a couple spec classes and a small open wheel class. 2. You mentioned a GTE Am class, is that the only sub-class? Are the Pros just "regular" GTE? Yes, GT1 has been scrapped. GTE Am is the only "sub-class" but they run identically prepared cars. 3. GTE: Are they tube-framed or production-based? Do they use their production engines, or is output restricted? Are there any factory-backed teams? For the most part, they are tube framed, but Porsche sticks with the tried and true GT3 RSR which is still a tub car with a complete roll cage. 4. GTC: Same questions as GTE. GTC is 100% limited to spec 911 GT3 Cups. This is the exact same car used in GT3 Cup series that run all over the world. 5. GTC-Spec-911-whatever: What's the point? Are these stock 911 GT3 Cup cars? Are they used in any other series? The point is to boost grid sizes by creating a cheap class that has readily available cars. 6: Overall, any rules similarities? IE - do the LMP1 cars run at the real LeMans or do any European teams come over here to run? Yes, the rules are very similar. In order to be eligible for the ILMC, any cars in the ALMS have to run to ILMC classification (identical to Le Mans). Audi and Peugeot are the main ones, but there are a few others that typically compete in europe but come over for the bigger races. Now that Petit and Sebring are part of the ILMC, there are a lot more of those types of entries at those two events in particular. (Audi and Peugeot will not be running the whole ALMS) In the past, the ALMS has bent the rules slightly to allow cars not eligible for Le Mans to run in their classes (IIRC the BMW M3s of the early 2000s were ALMS spec only, and Dyson has used Bio Ethanol which is not an eligible fuel, also the 911 GT3 R Hybrid ran at Petit last year, but it is not allowed ) 7: LMP2: What's the point? What are the differences other than being restricted and lighter? That's about it. For the most part, in the shorter races, there is nearly no difference in the two classes and they are allowed to run together in the same class. The LMP2 class was designed to be a place for privateers to play, but since Porsche "broke" the class with it's RS Spyders it has been a bit neutered... 8: "Green"? I see mention of the Diesel Audi and Peugots, and that's it. What else is "green"? Hybrid 911's? Ethanol? KERS? Yeah, it is mostly marketing speak, but they have certainly built the playground for Green technologies to play. A lot of teams (Corvettes were the pioneers about 3 years ago) use Bio Ethanol, while some other teams have experimented with hybrids, as well as the Diesel cars. Thanks!

Javelin wrote:

Maroon92 wrote: Here is the first post in the series. I will be carrying all of them through. If you have any requests, just ask. For the first one, I thought I would dive in to the deep end of the pool with the most complicated and convoluted rulebook in the world. ALMS! A guide on IndyCar has already been written and submitted, should be arriving soon.

Great article, but I still have many questions! 1. I see that IMSA is the founder. Does ALMS have anything to do with the old IMSA classes (rules similarities, races run, etc)? Did IMSA kill their original series' when they launched ALMS? 2. You mentioned a GTE Am class, is that the only sub-class? Are the Pros just "regular" GTE? 3. GTE: Are they tube-framed or production-based? Do they use their production engines, or is output restricted? Are there any factory-backed teams? 4. GTC: Same questions as GTE. 5. GTC-Spec-911-whatever: What's the point? Are these stock 911 GT3 Cup cars? Are they used in any other series? 6: Overall, any rules similarities? IE - do the LMP1 cars run at the real LeMans or do any European teams come over here to run? 7: LMP2: What's the point? What are the differences other than being restricted and lighter? 8: "Green"? I see mention of the Diesel Audi and Peugots, and that's it. What else is "green"? Hybrid 911's? Ethanol? KERS? Thanks!

ALMS is actually sanctioned by IMSA. The old GTP cars kind of died out when the manufacturers stopped spending so much money on it. A new spec was written in the mid 1990s, but it kept the concept of "big & little" prototypes & production cars.

GTE cars are production based, but the amount of stiffening allowed means that they're almost tube-frame cars in a production shell. A real ship in a bottle to build.

A lot of the 911 GT3 cars also run in the FIA GT series in Europe.

Why the small engine classes? Same reason as a club race. Diffrent strokes for different checkbooks.

And yes, they do travel back and forth from the States to Le Mans. Not so much lately, Audi's pretty much stayed in Europe since the eco meltdown, and Peugeot only comes to Sebring & the Petit Le Mans at Atlanta. Lots of the Euro teams come over for Petit, because if you win it, you recieve a guaranteed entry to the big show at Le Mans.

Green stuff: When the Audi first arrived, it burned so much cleaner than the diesels I saw on the street, I couldn't believe it. I think this program was not just to sell more TDIs, but also to really wring out the technology and make it better. And yes, the 911 Hybrid does run, the Corvettes run on E85, Dyson ran some wild new biofuel in the Mazda/Lola, Yokohama's got a line of tires made from orange oil, and probably a lot of other stuff I've forgotten.

Weirdest thing for me is the Au/Pug diesels. They're quiet. You can hear the wind over the car in the straights & the tires in the corners over the sound of the things.

In reply to Maroon92:

Sorry dude, we must have been typing at the same time..

Hey thanks, the more the merrier!

So the great and glorious IMSA of GTO/GTU/GTP fame pretty much died and came back with the straight ALMS rules. That makes sense.

Do the GTE cars run in the ILMS? Other than the 911 RSR, are they tube-frame (got 2 different answers on this one)?

Do any of the ALMS teams run other non-LeMans events or visa-versa (like the 24 of Daytona) and if so, what is the equivilent sanctioning body/class they run in, and what do they have to change?

On the GT3 Cup cars, do they have identical rules everywhere? So if I hit the Lotto and buy one, can I race in GTC in ALMS, GT3 Cup in PCA, and go play somewhere in Europe too?

Back to LMP1 & 2, what are the basic engine rules? 3.0L TD's? What about the gas motors? Nominal HP and top speed?

GTE: Same questions, what motors do they run? Except are they production-based? Doesn't the ZR1-looking Corvette run a 5.5L version of the LS7?

Thanks again! This is really interesting and I will have to watch the ESPN3.com feed during the next race!

GTE is an ILMC class, it is the GT class at Le Mans. It is nearly identical to GT2 of last year, but they changed the name because GT1 doesn't exist anymore.

Almost nothing is transferable between ALMS and Rolex Grand Am. The grand am cars are essentially the same speed as the ALMS GTC class. Grand Am has a bespoke set of rules that doesn't translate to any other series. That said, there are some teams that have been known to run both series. Krohn racing, Flying Lizard, and The Racers Group are good examples of teams that run different cars in both series.

For the most part, the floorpan and the roof has to be in a GTE car, and they are almost fully tubed from there. Porsche uses the whole production 997 GT3 shell and tacks a cage into it.

GT3 Cup cars. Yes, essentially. If you want to run GTC, that is true, I believe, but if you want to run IMSA GT3 Challenge, they use the same cup cars with Yokohama rubber and a different fuel.

I believe it is limited to 3 liters if you use forced induction whether it is Diesel or Petrol. Top speeds are near 200, power is dependent upon the engine used, usually in the 600 range.

GTE uses production based engines. The Corvette ZR1 R does use a 5.5 liter engine, but it shares very little with an LS engine. it is basically a bespoke racing engine.

Maroon92 wrote: For the most part, the floorpan and the roof has to be in a GTE car, and they are almost fully tubed from there. Porsche uses the whole production 997 GT3 shell and tacks a cage into it.

I honestly didn't know that. I was thinking the GTE cars were constructed a lot like the World Challenge cars before the rules change. Sounds like they're much more like an FIA GT car. Which makes sense, really, since the ACO is actually in Europe.

Thanks for the correction! Nice article, BTW.

IIRC, this year, the GTE class allows a complete Carbon tub for the first time ever. Thus, if McLaren wanted to enter GTE with the new MP4-12C, they would be allowed. Also, I believe it means that, for example, Risi could build a carbon tubbed 458 italia if they were so inclined. (I could be wrong on that second part though.)

friedgreencorrado wrote: Nice article, BTW.

Thanks dude! Next one comes out on Wednesday....

Maroon92 wrote:

friedgreencorrado wrote: Nice article, BTW.

Thanks dude! Next one comes out on Wednesday....

Looking forward to it!

Sorry, I forgot to answer the "factory support" side of GTE.

Yes, nearly all GTE cars are factory supported.
Corvette is a GM racing product built wit GM engineers and Pratt & Miller.
The Panoz is built and campaigned by Panoz.
The Porsche RSRs of Flying Lizard are mostly paid for by Flying Lizard, but Porsche loans them the use of factory racers (usually Pat Long and Jorg Bergmeister, with Marc Lieb and Marco Holzer usually stepping in for endurance events. All four are Porsche factory senior team drivers).
Ferrari is a similar situation where Risi Competizione pays most of the bills but has Ferrari factory drivers.
BMW is a 100 percent factory effort campaigned by Rahal Letterman Lannigan racing. BMW provides a lot of factory support with engineering and drivers.
ETC...

Nice! So GTE is where the action is then!

Javelin wrote: Nice! So GTE is where the action is then!

Yep. Prototypes have been kinda boring since Audi and Porsche left full time.

HERE'S INDY! Check It!

Something more of you might care about. This is the third installment about Grand Am Rolex G A

Interesting. Questions:

1. Are all Daytona Prototype's identical-looking?

2. How is the parity between the different engines / chassis in DP?

3. How many DP cars run?

4. I'm guessing no LeMans teams run in Rolex? Who are the heavy hitters that come just for the Daytona 24?

5. No sub-classes in GT? The Camaro & Corvette race together? Any similarities between the GT's here and elsewhere (ALMS)?

I'm loving these articles by the way!

1. They are not identical. The differences are pretty subtle. Kinda like the differences between F1 cars. From far away they look the same, but the devil is in the details. The red and black ford is a Doran chassis. The Red Gainsco car, the number 9 (its sister car, the number 5 at the back), the black, red and silver ford 5th back, and the 01 Ganassi Telmex on the right are all Riley chassis. The 90 black and blue car is a "Coyote" chassis. The greenhouse is "spec" for safety reasons, and there are things like ride height, wing width, height of the gurney flap, mirror size, etc. that are mandated to be within a certain criteria.

2. The parity is pretty close. Chevy seems to have the most powerful engines, but the Dinan BMWs seem to be more reliable. At Daytona, the BMWs were so much faster than the rest of the field that Grand Am dropped the rev limit on them by 100 RPM. Doesn't sound like much, but evidently it was enough for them to have to change their gear stacks to optimize the speed.

3. At Daytona there were 18 DP cars, but for the rest of the season there is usually just over 10.

4. There are some teams that run both series. TRG run a Porsche in the GTC class of the ALMS as well as the GT class in Grand Am. Flying Lizard usually runs a GTE car in ALMS, but did a one off at the Daytona 24 in a DP. Krohn racing runs a Ferrari in ALMS GTE for selected events, but also runs a DP. Nothing correlates between the two series, except seat time...

5. There are not any sub classes in GT. Parity is done with weight and engine restrictors. Camaro and Corvette race together. Neither is factory backed...officially.

Keep the questions coming!

BTW, the guy that owns the blog and I are campaigning Jalopnik to pick up the series in syndication. If any of you have Gawker accounts anymore, tell them that you want to see it on their site!

Can you give us some picture examples of the GT cars?

Brad, having walked the Daytona track with you, you know your stuff and every damned driver who ever did up a helmet. You have my worthless vote for the GRM position.

aussiesmg wrote: Yes, having walked the Daytona track with you, you know your stuff and every damned driver who ever did up a helmet. You have my worthless vote for the GRM position.

As much as that means to me, the position was filled last Friday. I don't know who got it, but wish them all the best!

Sir, you earned my ear with your stories several times over. I would climb many a banked track with you! lol.