I think that everyone here gets the point that by buying smart you can enjoy the car hobby and driving something interesting for nothing. Maybe even make a few bucks or more if you are lucky. The key is finding and buying that straight, non rusted, car for the right price.
What about a clean early RX7? Today on CL I found a spotless stock '85 GSL-SE for $2500. I could see that appreciating for sure.
Not going to happen. Especially if you drive the car - all it takes is one thing needing work and there goes any potential 'profit' you might have hoped to make, and given that old cars are assemblies of slowly degrading parts it is a certainty that things WILL break. If you think you can win that particular crap game maybe you should head for Vegas and make your fortune.....
Most or all of those cars have pretty much bottomed on value and probably won't be budging any time soon. Settle for buying something in good shape - body and mechanical - and hope to at least break even when you sell it. If you get lucky and sell for a bit more, you won the lottery.
I used to have a car magazine from around 1988 or so, the cover story was cars that would appreciate by the year 2000. One of the cars listed was the MGB-GT, it said it would be worth $25k by then. I guess you could say that I'm still waiting, but honestly I am ok with my '68 GT and its lack of value. Means that I can do what I want with it and not worry that I am jeopardizing my retirement.
From what I've heard -- Pay a premium for the best example you can find. Take care of it, and you will probably break even. Your dividend is enjoying the car.
I've heard that's good advice. But the surefire way to double the purchase price is to buy cheap, spend 3x that and then sell it for half of what you have in it, less your time. This seems to be the route I take more often than not.
Heheheh. My suggestion got NO comments. I think i know why.
From what i can tell, almost everyone in this thread seems to be basing their 'picks' around things they would LIKE rather than like to STORE. I think there's a strong correlation between that, and failing to make money. The reason cars become more rare is because most of them ARENT in storage. If you buy one of the nicer examples left out of a dwindling supply and then dont just store it, you'll be lucky to come out the other end of 5 years with a car that's worth more than you've put into it.
So, stop thinking about what you LIKE and start thinking about what will nearly go extinct in 5 years because everyone else is busy ENJOYING (slowly destroying) theirs, and STORE one instead of having fun with it. 
What would you like to pretend you dont own for the next 5 years? If you can't sink 5k+ storage into something you're willing to do NOTHING with except maybe stare at, you're probably going to lose.
Out of curiosity, do any modern mega-dollar cars outperform an index fund from their time zero at msrp?
Vigo wrote: Heheheh. My suggestion got NO comments. I think i know why. From what i can tell, almost everyone in this thread seems to be basing their 'picks' around things they would LIKE rather than like to STORE. I think there's a strong correlation between that, and failing to make money. The reason cars become more rare is because most of them ARENT in storage. If you buy one of the nicer examples left out of a dwindling supply and then dont just store it, you'll be lucky to come out the other end of 5 years with a car that's worth more than you've put into it.
that was why I suggested the E30 and Saab 900. The E30s are getting eaten up in the spec series (and the kids modding them) and I rarely see any 900s anymore. With Saab gone, they are going to be a lot more rare.
I base the Miata (at least the 1.6) on the same criteria as the e30.. fun little roadster that is getting eaten up in spec piñata.
I do not know why the MGB has not skyrocketed yet.. maybe it is due to the replacement bodies you can get?
Mitchell wrote: Out of curiosity, do any modern mega-dollar cars outperform an index fund from their time zero at msrp?
Ford GT maybe? I could potentially see buying an Alfa 4c resulting in a decent investment over time assuming production volume is as low as they claim.
Someone in that market may chime in with better info.
I dunno about the premise. If you treat an enthusiast car as an investment, you are likely to baby it, and therefore not enjoy all it has to give. Chances are that you'll pick wrong anyway. As for the guy who mentioned that he always made money on his Porsches, that reminds me of my uncle who would brag about how well his stocks did in the late 90s. If you're in the right place at the right time, all is golden. Most of the time, not so much. I'd say pick the car that you like above all and take care of it. If you have taste and are lucky it should turn out all right.
mad_machine wrote: I do not know why the MGB has not skyrocketed yet.. maybe it is due to the replacement bodies you can get?
Maybe it is due to the Miatas you can get?
I'll wager 924S since you can get them for pennies right now. They are like what GTV6 were 5 years ago and are a better car that is only getting rarer.
I still see nice looking low mileage Buick GN's for under $10k from time to time. Most people list them for $15-$20k. You have to find the right person that is hurting for $$. Two years ago a friend stumbled across a '89 Turbo T/A pace car edition with 70k for.... $6k. Yes he bought it and its a major hoot to drive. After putting a bit of money in it for small things, that is a car that should get $15 - $20k.
I have bought and sold approx 80 cars in my lifetime and usually purchased them based upon my own personal preferences rather than ability to flip for a profit. Generally, I am able to own and use for a period of time(I do find that time is extending as I get older) and then get my money out of the car when I sell. There have of course been some exceptions.
If your purpose is to catch the appreciation wave, listen to what they say on the Velocity shows: originality, desirability and collectibility.
The rarest car I ever owned was a 1989 GTU-s in very good condition but my wife hated same and didnt want to drive it because it didnt have all the options that her previous RX-7 had no matter its unique character so I sold it to a RX-7 collector in New Jersey. I made a few dollars on the car but that car had a very limited market.
Mitchell wrote: Out of curiosity, do any modern mega-dollar cars outperform an index fund from their time zero at msrp?
I was trying to prove to my Dad that my Mom & Stepdad's 67 Corvette was an awesome investment (22k in 2002 and now maybe 60-65k) so I actually did look at this. Since it's difficult to pin down the value of that car over the years, I started with the MSRP, but there was no DOW in 1967. Turns out that if you bought a brand new vette at MSRP when the Dow started you would pretty much have paced it through today. Not too bad.
mad_machine wrote: I do not know why the MGB has not skyrocketed yet.. maybe it is due to the replacement bodies you can get?
They made over 500,000 of them and there's still no shortage, but they are appreciating a bit. If I keep carving them up they might get a little more rare. Right now the v6/v8 converted mgs are still worth more than stock ones except for a few rarities like the factory racer that went for around 100k. There was a v8 conversion done in Germany that's traded hands a few times around the 60-70k mark. $7-9k gets you a nice driver still. $5k gets you a scruffy driver. You might be able to find a spridget for 5k. Maybe an e36 m3 sedan. Well bought Minis can be found/imported. I suspect they will be going for more in the not too distant future.
mad_machine wrote: I do not know why the MGB has not skyrocketed yet.. maybe it is due to the replacement bodies you can get?
Simple - they made so damned many of them. You need scarcity to really kick prices up and even that doesn't work if the cars aren't inherently attractive to fans.
MGAs have gone up nicely and MGA Twin Cams by far more - they are attractive and getting scarce. Other cars like my old TVR race car - only 90 built - don't bring big prices as they don't have the image (unless they have the Ford V8 in them).
There was a Cosworth Vega for sale locally for $3900 and it disappeared within 24 hours.
1967-1972 C10 trucks will never be worth anything so give them all to me!
My serious suggestions: Iroc Z Camaros, any year K5 Blazer, Jeep CJ, YJ
tuna55 wrote:Mitchell wrote: Out of curiosity, do any modern mega-dollar cars outperform an index fund from their time zero at msrp?I was trying to prove to my Dad that my Mom & Stepdad's 67 Corvette was an awesome investment (22k in 2002 and now maybe 60-65k) so I actually did look at this. Since it's difficult to pin down the value of that car over the years, I started with the MSRP, but there was no DOW in 1967. Turns out that if you bought a brand new vette at MSRP when the Dow started you would pretty much have paced it through today. Not too bad.
Even with the cost of storing it? Insuring it? Paying property taxes on it?
ProDarwin wrote:tuna55 wrote:Even with the cost of storing it? Insuring it? Paying property taxes on it?Mitchell wrote: Out of curiosity, do any modern mega-dollar cars outperform an index fund from their time zero at msrp?I was trying to prove to my Dad that my Mom & Stepdad's 67 Corvette was an awesome investment (22k in 2002 and now maybe 60-65k) so I actually did look at this. Since it's difficult to pin down the value of that car over the years, I started with the MSRP, but there was no DOW in 1967. Turns out that if you bought a brand new vette at MSRP when the Dow started you would pretty much have paced it through today. Not too bad.
I am basically zeroing out those costs versus the costs of owning a mutual fund and paying taxes on its growth.
I don't see this happening. From the 1980's on, most cars were made well enough that there are way too many survivors for them to appreciate that much.
I can't buy into this premise except as an alternative gamble to the lottery. Look into the retirement link on this site. Person after person has talked about how important maxing out a 401K is. In fact the latest post I saw is where someone said he/she will always regret not putting more into the 401K plan.
If you ever want to retire don't count on Social Security and especially don't plan on doubling your money on any ride. Buy the ride because you want it and can afford it. Enjoy it, then pass it on and hope to break even.
Investment wise, you almost certainly can't beat your 401K even if you don't get employer match money. After all you're reducing your tax bill. If you're not maxing out your 401K every year you have no business gambling on turning any ride over for a profit. That being said, if you are maxing your 401K buy what you like and enjoy what you buy!
As much as I'm trying to find another MK1 MR2 (either SC or swapped), I don't know about it doubling in value in 5 years. I've seen a few here and there anywhere from $5900 to $9000 depending on condition, being worth $15-20k in 2018? Not sure about that.
Dug this thread up based on what I've been seeing recently: Super clean Japanese mini trucks are on the climb. Minty old Datsuns, Mazda REPU, Toyotas.
They made a bunch of these and they're just outside the car collector radar, so it's reasonable to find one locally. A lot of people would think $3000 for a 30 year old pickup truck is a premium, but I see them already changing hands at twice that amount.
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