Help me choose HPDE Brake Pads!

Aboot me car: 

2020 Subaru WRX

Stock powertrain (save for a conservative flash tune) 

Stock brakes

22mm rear sway bar for the oh so nice rear rotation

225/45/17 Falken RT660

Audi RS3 brake ducts (though I'm not sure if they do anything).

ATE TYP200 Brake Fluid

Primarily street driven, with occasional HPDE at Pacific Raceways, and potentially The Ridge, and autox in between.

Looking for: Decent street manners (a little cold squeak is ok, dust is relatively ok as long as it's non-corrosive-ish), but will last lap after lap after lap for a full year of HPDEs (at most 12 events a year) and daily driving.

Pad choices so far:
EBC Yellow/Blue

I like the price point + track/daily ability, but I've heard they chunk. 

Winmax W4

I like the price point + track/daily ability, but I've heard they don't last very long. 

Ferodo DS2500

These were recommended to me by KNS Brakes but I don't like the price point. 

GLOC R10

Recommended to me as well by a friend, specifically R10/R8 F/R, but I also don't particularly like the price point.

Endless MX72 

I think this is my best bet, but they're incredibly expensive! 

StopTech Sport (309)

This is the pad I'm running right now and I have not experienced fade at Pacific Raceways, but I noticed they were starting to chunk + rear pads have worn down quite a bit based on visually inspecting with flashlight through caliper. As I get faster and faster, I predict I will begin to outgrow these pads (if you've ever done Pacific Raceways, there's some hard braking in T1>T2, T2>T3A, and T7>T8). They are cheap though! 

Anything I'm missing? 

If the wrx is anywhere near as hard on stock brakes as I imagine it is, there isn't really a pad that does what you want. Especially if you think you're going to continue improving and pushing the car harder. Find a really good street pad and a compound compatible track pad. I'm using porterfield R4/R4S, but there's a few other options. The gloc pads are expensive but should last a really long time which offsets the cost. I think those are what most people would suggest and probably what I would have done if I didn't already have and really like the set of R4S for street/autocross. The ohter thing about performance street pads that you've already started to see is that even if you can manage to keep them just under their upper temp limit, they tend to wear pretty quickly and long term real track pads, even expensive ones, will likely work out to be cheaper.

Hawk HP+ do double duty for me. I like them quite a bit.

Another vote for separate pads. You'll be pulling wheels to clean them and bleed calipers anyway, so changing may not be much more work.

I'd be very surprised if any street-friendly pad is going to last for 12 track days, especially on a heavy ish car. Same for tires, but that's another q.

I used Hawk HP+ on my 944 turbo when I started tracking it. Fine on the street, ok on track but as I got faster they went away faster, eventually lasting less than 4 days. PF97 became the dedicated track pad, nice performance and much longer lasting for me. 

IIRC the HP+ have pretty good performance through the low and mid range temps but basically fall off a cliff around 800F which is really not very much temperature for an undersized pad on a heavy car. Most track pads are good to well over 1000F. On that note, if you end up with real track pads you're going to want to also pony up a few bucks for some DOT5 brake fluid for the extra boiling resistance.

I am currently using EBC yellows on a Focus ST. No squeaking on the street but very dusty.  Really leaned on them on the track and they never faded. Good bite when cold as well. Really happy with them.

dps214 said:

If the wrx is anywhere near as hard on stock brakes as I imagine it is, there isn't really a pad that does what you want. Especially if you think you're going to continue improving and pushing the car harder. Find a really good street pad and a compound compatible track pad. I'm using porterfield R4/R4S, but there's a few other options. The gloc pads are expensive but should last a really long time which offsets the cost. I think those are what most people would suggest and probably what I would have done if I didn't already have and really like the set of R4S for street/autocross. The ohter thing about performance street pads that you've already started to see is that even if you can manage to keep them just under their upper temp limit, they tend to wear pretty quickly and long term real track pads, even expensive ones, will likely work out to be cheaper.

That was the plan with the GLOC pads, actually. R6/R6 and then R10/R6 F/R, or just going full YOLO and R10/R8 or R10/R10. 
R10/R8 combo is about $300, and combine it with the RockAuto $30 rotor special and I have a pretty good set up. 
the only thing stopping me from having a dedicated track pad is that I have to spend time swapping the pads and packing up the car after at the end of the day. Track days means I carry all four wheels ratchet strapped in the back seat, floor jack and tool tote in the trunk, and soon I'll be bringing roof rack + extra fuel tanks. It adds up. 

How far away is the track? Just do the swap at home, tires too for that matter.

In reply to dps214 :

Apartment parking lot so that's not possible. 

Someone suggested DOT-5 brake fluid.  Don't do that except on vehicles that come with the factory with DOT-5.  I'm a fan of ATE Typ 200 DOT-4 for track use.

GLOC pads are great and you can use them on street, but they will squeal and dust, and in my case, destroy the finish of the wheels if you don't clean the dust immediately.  Still my go-to track pad, and I just accept the fact that track wheels are going to be coated in the stuff.  Also note that you can't mix GLOC pads with normal pads on the same rotors without cleaning the rotors, unless you also switch to their street pads which are compatible.

When I was tracking the 944 I  too had 4 tires, a floor jack, and the rest stuffed in the car.  Does the WRX still use Brembos up front? Changing pads on those is like making toast. 

I used Porterfield r4s for a while as dual duty, they worked fine to start out. Eventually you get faster and pads like the r4s or HP+ will start giving you issues, and you really won't have an option but to use pads that are not DD-friendly (or leave it there and not try to push further).

Have you been tracking for a while? Your question is one I asked a few years back, and now I have a truck/trailer and the car is going from TT to w2w... It all depends on whether you can stay a "fun HPDE" guy or get more competitive. I've been bad at not pushing, which leads to a car that doesn't play well on the street, if nothing else because of things like safety gear (seats/harnesses/etc).

Entropyman said:

I am currently using EBC yellows on a Focus ST. No squeaking on the street but very dusty.  Really leaned on them on the track and they never faded. Good bite when cold as well. Really happy with them.

I've also used EBC Yellows on my AE92 for street + track + autox, they can take whatever you throw at them on track and aren't bad on the street and they last a long time, but what I didn't like about them was how they performed in autocross - they're very grabby pads (a favorite for rear pads in drift cars for this reason) so it's easy to lock up the brakes with them, and the brakes get much sharper over the course of a run as they warm up. They do produce a lot of dust and are capable of casually destroying your rotors if you skimp on warmup time or brake cooling as well.

I'm trying Powerstop Track Day PST pads on my 86 right now for the same use, so far I've only done some street driving and one autocross with them and they've been fine for that, just like ordinary street pads but with a bit of squeaking when they're literally freezing cold. I've heard they produce a lot of dust (hard for me to confirm so far) and don't last that long though, and you could get some fade on the track with them if you don't have brake cooling. The next step up from this is the Track Day Spec PSA which is a bit more like a Yellowstuff, they are noisier and more temperature-dependent but have more headroom for high temperatures.

Berck said:

Someone suggested DOT-5 brake fluid.  Don't do that except on vehicles that come with the factory with DOT-5.  I'm a fan of ATE Typ 200 DOT-4 for track use.

There's a big difference between DOT5 and DOT5.1. DOT5.1 is compatible with DOT4 and in practice, kind of redundant with that specification - DOT5.1 requires a higher temperature capability than the DOT4 specification, but a lot of brake fluids that could meet DOT5.1 are still labeled as DOT4.

DOT5 is a completely different fluid used mostly in vintage cars.

Another note, for tracking a modern car with ABS you should use a low-viscosity brake fluid. I run Pentosin DOT4 LV in my 86.

In reply to paddygarcia :

WRX has always been sliding calipers IIRC, it's the STI that came with the Brembos.

I guess the other thing about having two sets of pads is the cost - high initial cost but cheaper long term. 

In reply to spedracer :

I have not been tracking for a very long time, but I can see scope creep happening. 

I'm currently looking at getting a Cobra Nogaro seat for more side bolstering without getting too far into a half/full cage + 6 point, if that helps you understand where I'm planning on going with this. For now since it's my daily I'll keep the mods light until I have a different car to daily or track. 

Pad swaps will be really quick with the sliding calipers and running GLOC R6/R6 F/R for street and R10/R6 for track might be the most ideal, even though the initial cost will bite.

I have a set of G-Loc pads (R12 front, R10 rear), but they're dedicated track pads that get swapped in for events. Maybe when my Hawk HPS street pads are done for I'll see if the the G-Locs work for street use, but I'm guessing they'll dust more than I'd like.

My vote is for race pads for track days, paired with their own set of rotors. On the WRX (I have a 2015, also basically stock), the stock rotors aren't that expensive and it's not that difficult to swap back and forth for track days. I ended up getting Carbotech XP10, as there are limited choices for full race pads for this car. I've run HP+ in the past, but as I got faster and started using R compound tires, I wanted full confidence in my brakes, so I switched to full race pads. I really liked the Hawk DTC-60's I used on my RX8. My dad switched to them on his Miata after using Porterfield R4's and found them to be a big improvement.

I only used the XP10's once so far at a rainy track day (Area 27) with custom front ducting and liked them allright, but it's not a real torture test. I'm heading back in a couple weeks and can report back on them if desired.

I ran ebc yellow fronts and red rears for a while on an all suspension/tire 1991 integra. It was a good fit for that car.

Hawk HP+ pads blow unless you have a really lightweight car.  Otherwise they're terrible on the street with a lot of dust and noise and aren't nearly enough on the track.  A dual purpose brake pad simply doesn't exist for a modern heavy, powerful car.

I run hawk dtc 60 on both my Miatas  and my m4.  They take a lap or 2 to g

et up to temp but work fantastic.  You can not daily them because  they squeal really bad.

In reply to RX8driver :

I called GLOC a while back and they said that all of their compounds are cross compatible, so separate rotors might not even be an issue if I go the GLOC route.

Ah, the infamous scope creep! 
https://www.rr-racing.com/RR-Racing-Front-Big-Brake-Kit-for-WRX-p/swrxfbk015.htm

G-LOC also makes pads in this shape, and fixed calipers are much easier to swap pads than sliding. Thoughts on going all in? Should I save the money and still do two compounds? 

In reply to spedracer :

This x100

Of the options listed in the original post, the 2500s and Glocs are the only options I'd even consider, but I'd likely go R4S. 

Do you need bigger brakes? I get the want, but would that money be better spent on something else (R comp tires, suspension, etc)? Will your wheels fit over those brakes? If you have multiple sets (I have 3 sets of 17's: summer, winter, track) then that can be a big extra expense, but then again, that's a good argument for going with big brakes early on so that you can make sure any extra wheels you buy are compatible.

There's also always the option of STI Brembos, if you keep an eye out on the forums, eBay, classifieds you may be able to score a deal. You could also check for reman calipers through various parts stores as another option to get some. It would be easier to source rotors and pads that way.

One benefit of two sets of rotors is you can bring the street ones with you in case of a failure. Track rotors are a consumable, they do crack and need replacing over time.

In reply to hunter47 :

If you're just starting out, I'd save the money and "deal" with the current calipers. It ain't that much harder to swap pads. If you end up becoming a track rat you'll get used to doing it a lot. I went with a BBK when I started, and honestly it wasn't a great idea. Once you move off the stock setup things get a bit more complicated as far as setup/troubleshooting goes. Suddenly the brakes have too long a stroke and really you need a new master, balance is different so you need a prop valve, etcetc. Not to mention I now have to take a small penalty in power/weight in the w2w class I'm moving into. If I could go back in time I'd leave the car about stock, and buy someone's used racecar when ready for a trailered car. Would have saved thousands.

Unfortunately there's no replacement for your own experience. Try a dual duty pad, run it till it becomes an issue, and only then complicate it for yourself. You'll likely be going through brake pads every few events, so you'll have plenty of opportunities to switch it up. Or start off swapping so you don't have to worry if that makes you more comfortable. The most important thing is seat time, anything performance related is a distant second. Getting advice is good, listen to it all, but know a lot of it will be terrible. There's local guys here that swear by HP+ and get half a year of events out of their NT01's - because they are seconds off spec miata times with triple the HP. That's cool, I'm glad they are showing up, I just don't want their advice.

I know most of my post had little to do with brake pads, but honestly just throw something reasonable on, get a feel for what YOU like, and get out there!