The Fly And Drive Conundrum

Can you guys point me to a previously discussed thread or enlighten me on the magical fly and drive scenario?

Lets say I live in eastern Mass, I find a car in Virginia that I like and tics all the boxes. What then? Strike a deal sight unseen (I’ve seen some of you do this)?

Then book a good time and place to purchase the car... how do you get from the closest airport to the car? How do you legally drive this car home with plates and insurance (you didn’t even know for 100% sure you were buying it after all, the car might not be what the seller described).

Im seriously looking into this but the many steps it’ll take to make it real are eluding me.

I did a sorta-kinda fly and drive when I bought the BMW.  Took the train to CT to visit my parents for Thanksgiving, went car shopping, drove back with the car.  

I did a little bit of careful planning for the getting plates on it thing, etc.  I had a few cars lined up to look at and made sure I was looking at them all on Friday, not Saturday (even though I didn't have to head home until Sunday).  By looking at them on Friday, that meant the DMV was open.  So when I bought the car, I exchanged money and paperwork, did insurance stuff on my phone, went straight to the DMV, got plates and then went back to pick up the car. 

Being that I bought it in NY (just at the other end of the state, 6+ hours from home) I could just get real plates for it and be done.  In states outside of your home state you'd have to figure out what your options are for temporary / in-transit plates.  I know some states (like NJ) will issue in-transit plates to non residents so you can buy the car and drive it back to your home state.  

Getting from the airport, etc. will vary depending on what's available as far as taxis, Uber/Lyft, someone willing to pick you up, etc. 

I did this when I bought my 05 GTO about 5 years ago. Yes, I struck a deal sight unseen, but the seller and I had exchanged many emails and a couple of phone calls, and I also paid to get it inspected at a local dealership. I was pretty confident in the car. I was mostly happy with it, though it did turn out to have more stone chips in the front than it looked like in the photos. That wasn't the seller's fault, pics sometimes don't show small details very well.

In my case,  the seller picked me up at the airport, we drove back to his house where we did all the paperwork, then I set out for home. He let me keep his license plate on it for the drive home, and I mailed it back to him. I had previously added it to my insurance policy and had a certificate with me. All in all, it was pretty easy.

I'll share what I did. After deciding that I wanted the car, the seller and I agreed on a couple of things- He would meet me at the airport with the car and would take a cashiers check for a certain amount. I got the VIN and gave my insurance company a heads up for the drive back. I can't remember if he left his tag on or not. I had the bill of sale with me in case I got pulled over. I think you can go 24-48 hrs like that. We talked back and forth a good bit and got things worked out. Turned out to be a good experience.

I'll never do a fly n drive again unless its for a brand new car.  I've been burned too many times, with every time it happened me getting a PPI done and the car looked at by a local enthusiast.  I pay for the car and fly in, only to discover undisclosed paint/body work that the PPI shop didn't see, missing parts, blown turbo, etc, etc, etc.

I would never pay first. I want refusal.

I did this for a '95 Neon ACR - flew from Philly to Atlanta (twice, actually, but that's another story) and drove it home.  The seller picked me up at the airport.

I had extensive email conversation with the seller beforehand, and he sent a number of pictures, including one of the title.  I did not know him but at the time he was at least a little bit familiar to the community.  His communication was good.  I checked the VIN and got a history from Chrysler that matched what he told me.  I forget if I got a Carfax or not - this was in 1999.

We agreed on a price pending in-person review, and I took a cashier's check for that amount with me.  The car met my expectations, we exchanged paperwork (including 2 signed copies of a bill of sale, 1 for each of us), and I headed home.  It worked out great - I drove the heck out of that car for 7 years after buying it; it was 11 years old and running strong when I sold it.

Delaware DMV has an in-transit form that you can download and print out, basically giving you 24 hours to drive the car home under the assumption that you will register it in DE.  It's like a 1-day T-tag for private party sales.

If you're an existing customer, State Farm will cover any car for 24 hours from time of purchase, whether or not you tell them about it ahead of time, but it's usually a good idea to notify them beforehand that you might buy a car in the immediate future.  See what your insurance does in this case.

In reply to Tom_Spangler :

This is fairly close to my experience having done this three times.  Two of those instances the maintenance paperwork /carfax  was all there and it was very easy (one time the car was not exactly as described, but the flaws weren't a big deal).  Sellers picked me up at the airport, i checked out the car, test drive them, then went to bank to wire the money (since wires are immediate the sellers can see the money in their bank account in about 15min).  Then had the bank notarize the bill of sale, etc. then I was on my way home.  In all instances I kept the plates and mailed it back to seller upon getting home or destroying them after getting my own plates.  Add the car to your insurance policy and everything should be good.    

My fly and drives have been pretty straightforward.  The first one is a learning curve, but the rest are easy.

Call your state's DMV and the DMV of the state you're buying from.  You'll find out what your state requires from VA and what VA can offer in terms of temp reg or legal things.  For the most part, your bill of sale (if it is a state "pink slip") works as a temp reg.  If that is the case, you would just meet the seller with the car at a notary/title store/DMV/tax office (depending on how its done in VA).

You just need info, and the best way to get the info you need is to call the DMV for both states and just ask questions.  If you call MA-DMV and ask "I'm buying a car from VA, what do I need to register it here?" and call VA-DMV and ask "I'm buying a car there but live in MA, how do I legally drive it back?"

There is always a solution because state DMVs have to comply with certain Federal rules.

I have also done it a few times "on the sly" but I don't recommend it.  I did a fly-n-drive (well, rent a car one way) on a 73 Impala wagon that was super-minty.  I wanted that car so desperately that I just took a plate of my 96 Impala.  My hope was that if I got pulled over a cop would just see "Impala" and not pay attention to the details.  I didn't get pulled over, but that could have been a recipe for many headaches.  I don't recommend it.  It adds stress to an already stressful situation.

If the seller offers to just let you take his plates and send them back when you're home, I don't recommend it.  It is theoretically legal (no different than borrowing a friend's car) and it doesn't really put you in jeopardy, but it is a big risk for the seller.  The only risk to you is if the seller's car was used to rob a bank or kill someone which is rare, but if you take it on a toll road, get in an accident, or get a parking ticket, it could mean trouble for the seller.  I did it once with a seller that I had developed a rapport with, and my EZPass didn't trip the sensor on the turnpike and he got a bill.  Not a worry... but he noticed the bill and called me.  I cheerfully paid it, but if he didn't notice the bill or if I hadn't had that rapport it might have turned sour.

As far as getting from the airport... how far away is the car?  Uber?  Lyft?  Shared-ride van?  Bus?  Train?  Usually there is some combination of public transport that can get you really close.

Years ago, I sold my MR2 SC to a guy who lived in St. Louis (I was in Toledo, OH)

We did a lot of talking and I took pictures that he requested as well as shot some video.  A decided deal was struck.  He flew into Detroit, MI about 45 minutes away.  I picked him up at the airport.  It was easy to tell him, "I'll be the guy driving a red MR2 SC."  He hopped in and we got away from the busy part of the airport.  We then switched drivers and this gave him 45 minutes of "test drive time."  Once back at my house I offered him a floor jack to see under and anything else.  All was as stated and we visited my bank to exchange $ and complete paperwork.  He had cash.  

The part I remember most about the whole thing was this 28 yr old buyer then looked at me and said, "how do I get to St. Louis from here?"  From my house at the time you could see I-75.  I told him to head south for 3 hours to Dayton and I-70 then head west until it looks familiar.  

I asked him what his plan was if things were not right with the car.  He said that it was just another $100 to fly back with Southwest (maybe $200 on short notice) and that I had already agreed on the phone that I would take him back to the airport if the deal was not good.  For a rare car, he couldn't find one easier or cheaper.  

I seem to remember that I sent him home on my plates which I no longer needed and were soon to expire anyway.  

My best advice is don't try to be too cheap with the seller.  The seller is putting more effort into your purchase than he is to someone else's purchase.

I've done a few on both ends. The first one I bought was an Audi 200 5MT in San Diego on eBay. My sister lives in northern Sandyeggo but the seller picked me up at the airport and drove me to the car. The crazy thing about this one was it was in May and it was raining cats and dogs. In May. In Southern California. The seller was cool, the car was cool and everything went off without a hitch. Spent the night at my sister's and drove the 400 miles home without incident. I was now sold on the Fly 'n Drive concept.

The next one was another Audi 200 on eBay but this one was in Phoenix, Az . I live in San Jose, Ca so we flew into town and the seller picked us up. The car turned out to be a TPoS. She understood my position on a car I was planning on driving 1000 miles home so she took us back to the airport and I rented a car to drive back to San Ho, since we were already planning on the drive, not a problem. She got a neutral feedback on this one...

I sold a BMW R1200GS motorcycle on Craigs to a guy that flew in from LA. This one was really crazy. He contacted me through email with a few questions, then said he would be by on Saturday morning to take a look at it. A cab drove up to the house at 11, the guy got out with his kit and cash, looked the bike over and rode it home. I asked him what he would've done if it wasn't up to snuff and he shrugged, "you seemed like a stand up guy in the emails, so I went for it. Never entered my mind that it wouldn't be what you said it was." Now, I am a stand up guy but that transaction certainly gave me pause about making sure I was as stand up in real life as I am in my mind...

I bought my fourth R1200GS, a 2010, off eBay and it was in Diamond Head, Mississippi. Flew into Stennis, the guy picked me up, took me to his place, fed me dinner and sent me on my way. The bike was better than expected and I put 70k on it in three years.

My latest Fly 'n Drive was selling the 2010 GS in 2015. An Australian saw my ad on the local Craigs, contacted me and we exchanged emails, pitchers, etc. He was going to buy a bike and ride it all around North America and South America for a year. Because I had the bike set up for long distance riding, he thought it would be perfect so he flew in, paid in cold hard and rode off for a year of adventure. He had a Facebook page so we could follow along. He had a great time and the bike held up just fine. I was pretty happy with how that one turned out.

The key is to ask the questions and if you don't like the answers, then walk away. Most of the time, the sellers (and buyers) are enthusiasts and are willing to make you happy. eBay offers the most protection for both buyers and sellers. Craigslist is more of the Wild Wild West and you've got to be on your toes. In either case, I've had for the most part good experiences and made a coupla friends for life. That's probably the best part...

Mass throws a monkey wrench in the works in that they won't honor temporary tags from other states, and they will pull you over and have the car towed.  BTDT.

That means it's a ton easier to essentially borrow the car from the seller and drive home with their plates and then mail them back if they need them.  That involves some trust and familiarity you might not get.

Another option is the double fly and drive,  where you fly in, the seller meets you at the airport and you take care of everything on their end and get yourself and the car dropped off at the airport.  You fly home with your paperwork, get your plates and insurance squared away, then fly back to the airport and pick up your ride. If you are getting a great deal on the car and can get cheap tickets that lets you walk away easily too because you already have the return ticket. 

I've done it a few times.  The important thing to keep in mind is that walking away will only cost you a few hundred (whatever the return ticket/car rental costs).  It's a calculated risk but if the rewards are worth it (special car/rust free southern/etc), roll the dice.

I will say in ANY car purchase situation (different town or different state, doesn't matter!) NEVER put the wrong plate on the car.  You can run into logicistical issues if you happen to get pulled over and the cop is having a bad day, but at the end of the day the worst outcome is a towing bill and a misdemeanor.  Putting the wrong plates on a car intentionally is a felony.  You're better off to roll with no plates and risk getting called on it (I never have, luckily!) than to put the wrong one on.

As others have said, make sure the expectations are clear ahead of time.  Twice I was picked up at the airport by the seller and once I just used Uber.  Another good thing to pack with you is an OBDII scanner so you can see if the codes were recently reset, masking an emissions problem.  One of the minivans I bought from VA had a CEL for the catalyst efficiency that was not disclosed before I got there.   To the seller's credit (small used car place), they bought me a new cat and o2 sensors.  When the o2 sensors fixed the problem, I returned the cat to o'reilly and sent them a check back per our agreement.  They claimed they just didn't think to note it because they don't emissions testing in their area of VA, it had just passed a mechanical inspection.

I've bought 2 sight unseen, many pictures, agreements, etc. One I had shipped, the other I had GutenParts pick up for me and then do some work.

The 2nd one, I took the VIN and got plates and had it insured before I flew out to pick it up.

I was on the seller end of a fly and drive gone wrong. I had a 1972 Toyota Corolla 4-door that had been rear ended. (By my dad, but that's another story for another time.) The buyer flew all the way from Florida to Ohio - he wanted the A/C and the uncracked interior plastics (dash, etc) for his coupe restoration project. We went to U-Haul for him to rent a truck and trailer, and it was going to be something like $1300 one way. He decided to drive it instead. I told him I wasn't so sure about that plan - I had put about 200 miles on it total, and on top of that it had bad tires and a 2-speed auto transmission. (UGH!) He decided to risk it and hit the road. This was in the early days of cell phones so when his call came in from a gas station about 15 miles down the freeway with an overheating engine, I didn't get the phone call. He left me a voice mail, but I didn't get that until it was too late. He ended up paying the $1300 for the U-Haul. I don't know how much it cost him to get to the U-Haul rental place. He emailed me later the details and told me he was still happy with the deal. I felt terrible for not at least helping him once it broke down.

I still do feel pretty bad about it, actually. I wonder how that guy's restoration project went for him.

oldopelguy said:

Mass throws a monkey wrench in the works in that they won't honor temporary tags from other states, and they will pull you over and have the car towed.  BTDT.

 

Dude, seriously? Like, even if you're just in transit through the state you can't have temp tags on your vehicle??

I never understood how messed up the whole tag / plate thing is in the east and south. 

I did a fly and drive for our 2013 XC60.  Lady that owned it was an accountant and was moving to Italy.  Got a CarFax report and she gave me the name of her guy at the Volvo dealership where it had been serviced.  Talked to him, got on a plane, and then caught Uber to her house.

Got two BOSs & signed title from her, called my insurance company, and drove it from San Diego to the other end of the state - 850 miles.  It still has the same plate on it as when I bought it. 

As long as I did the title transfer within 21 days  (I think) and paid the sales tax, all was good.

I don't know about the temporary tag thing, but what I learned from living in MA and buying a few cars out of state (one from NC)

If you're going to transfer your registration from one car to another, there is a grace period where you can use your existing plates and registration, coupled with the sale paperwork for the new car, to drive it around legally. It's either 5 or 7 days.

Now, if one were to do that, then upon getting home with no legal issues, decide not to transfer the registration and instead to get new plates for their new car, I can't see how the state could argue with that...

Ok, if we're going to tell stories...  For all of these I live in Denver...

Found an UrS4 on line in Sacramento.  I have a good gear head friend there who checked the car out.  He mentioned to me it didn't seem to pull the way he expected but since he'd never driven one before I kinda discounted that.  Had it checked out at 2Bennett, a very well known Audi shop, who gave it two thumbs up.

I fly in, friend picks me up and takes me over to the sellers place.  I check out the car.  It doesn't pull the way I expect but it's otherwise in good shape and 2Bennett checked it out, right?  So I bought it and drove home.  It took 3 gallons of water to get it home.  I rebuilt the head and everything seemed fine but I believe in karma and I sold it.  Lost $$ and time.  Wife pissed at me.

Found a 944 Turbo S Rennlist.  Was a car that had been local to me and I'd actually driven 3 years beforehand.  Seller seemed quite wealthy, lived in a McMansion, had a lift in his garage and 3 other Porsches.  Had the car checked out by a Porsche shop in Detroit, near the seller.  Told them specifically what I wanted them to look at.  They gave it two thumbs up.  It was winter and I didn't have a ton of extra time, so I just bought it and had it shipped out to me.  Showed up a complete basket case.  I ended up LSx swapping it.  Spent TONS of money on it, wife pissed at me.

Found a Nogaro B6 S4 Avant in Salt Lake City.  Had it checked out by a well known Audi shop there, they gave it thumbs up.  I wire the money to the seller, he picks me up at the airport.  I start to walk around the car and instantly notice that the drivers side right rear quarter has had paint and body work done to it.  Both the seller and the PPI shop had said no paint/body work.  Car seems otherwise fine.  So, while pissed, I drive it home.  Get home, get the car in the air and its missing the belly pan and several other parts that don't affect it mechanically but cost $$ to replace.  Find that the seller hadn't put the title in his name and even worse, had signed the title!   So now not only do I have to track down the guy who sold the car to him, but he has to go and request a duplicate title from Utah!  Thankfully I did find him and he was an enthusiast and took care of it for me.  This could've ended very poorly for me.   I'm pissed at myself for this one, I should've made sure the title was in the sellers name.

Found a B5 S4 avant in Wyoming.  Seller says its perfect.  Friend drives me 6 hours up there to pick it up.  Airbag warning light is on.  Scan it and it's the airbag ECU, which is a $1000 repair.  Seller does lower his price but still.

I've done exactly ONE fly n drive when everything worked out the way it should.

Conversely I've sold quite a few cars to people who've flown in, as far as I know, they've all been happy as I never heard anything from them.  I tend to take extremely good care of my cars and point out any flaws to the best of my ability.  I don't let the sellers take my plates, too much liability.

In ma they let you use your old plates but you must have roof that you don’t still own the car that the plates were on. You then have to have the appropriate sale documents for the vehicle that the plates are on. 

I think temp plates are legal in MA. I see NH temp plates around a lot. 

In reply to dean1484 :

IIRC from talking to a friend who used to live in MA, MA doesn't issue temp plates.  Out of state temp plates are legal if you're not a MA resident and are passing through MA, but not legal if you are a MA resident.  As far as MA is concerned, if you're a resident, you either get MA plates on the car before you drive it into the state or it comes in on a trailer.  

Curtis said:

As far as getting from the airport... how far away is the car?  Uber?  Lyft?  Shared-ride van?  Bus?  Train?  Usually there is some combination of public transport that can get you really close.

I know for a fact that Hell would freeze over before I drove into Logan Airport in Boston to pick up a buyer of say, a $3,000 car. I can not fathom asking a seller to do that for me unless he was minutes from the airport.

I guess these things make more sense as the selling prices climb. But for a cheap, rust free Civic hatch or Neon ACR it’s not really feasible or at least realistic.

ebonyandivory said:

 

I know for a fact that Hell would freeze over before I drove into Logan Airport in Boston to pick up a buyer of say, a $3,000 car. I can not fathom asking a seller to do that for me unless he was minutes from the airport.

Obviously it depends a lot on the circumstances, but I didn't have any issues with picking up the guy who flew in to buy the Odyssey I was selling a couple years ago.  $6500 car, rather than $3K, it was only about a 20 minute drive to the airport, and he was coming in relatively late so the traffic wasn't bad.

I sold one of my Mustangs and my E46 to fly-and-drive buyers. I met both of them at DTW, which is a good 45 minutes from my house. I don't see it as that big a deal, but I tend to be a pretty accommodating seller. Neither car was really "cheap", though, the Mustang was about $7k from memory, and the E46 was over $20k.