How to have "the talk" with parents--telling them they need to retire, or move, or similar

Prodarwin, I emailed you but figured that it would be beneficial for everyone else--you say your parents failed at downsizing? How so? What did your parents do that they should have done differently?

FWIW to the rest of the board, I think MY parents are doing this correctly. They're starting at ages 63 and 57 to get rid of stuff. They've had me and my siblings claim things for the future. They're preparing their house to sell in the next 1-10 years, and are keeping their eyes open for a small ranch house. And that house would be a 10-25 year home; they know they need to go to assisted living before they think they do. Hopefully they remember that when they're older.

SVreX wrote: Part of the hard part for me is that my parents are NOT adults anymore, and are simply not always able to make decisions for themselves. It's hard watching the people I once trusted to raise me reverting to conditions of second childhood. YMMV

Very well said.

mtn wrote: Prodarwin, I emailed you but figured that it would be beneficial for everyone else--you say your parents failed at downsizing? How so? What did your parents do that they should have done differently?

My parents went from $500k, 3500 sq ft, 4 bed, 3 bath to $650k, 2500sq ft, 3 bed, 4 bath.

Some highlights:

good:

• lake house (gorgeous)
• master bed/bath on main level
• exterior care/lawn care handled by HOA/neighborhood
• no longer in DC area - less traffic

bad:

• they got a boat now (because lake-house) - more hassle/stress/not very safe for someone with MD
• further from more things (more driving)
• further from important medical care
• more stairs than previous home

I only list rough pricing to highlight that saving money was not one of their primary concerns when changing homes. I'm probably missing some things here, but the point is, they still ended up with too much house and IMO the location is not great for someone with health issues like my father.

First, a thank you: I think many of us can sympathize with the tough spot you're in, not least because we will all face some variation of it either as the caregivers or the ones who will need help. Thank you for starting this thread to get everyone thinking.

Second, a suggestion: There are lots of resources out there to help guide these kinds of conversations and planning. The easy starting point is AARP. Membership eligibility starts at 50 years old, for like $12/year, and they have a ton of online and other resources and counseling services. My parents joined, and found it really helpful.

First of all, I cant tell you how sorry I am to hear this is going on at only 58 years of age. That is MY age!

I would try to build a future around what IS working. Your mother in-law actually enjoys working, and your father in law seems to thrive when she is not a burden.

So, how do you maximize those two situations?

Does your mother in law HAVE to retire? "Likes to work" and "Needs the income" would indicate that retirement is a death sentence for both of them.

Are there no housing options close to where MIL works? Maybe an apartment or ground floor condo? Downsizing would sure help with the cashflow, unless the money is then in danger of being wasted on something we cant forsee. (FIL have a gambling habit?)

London Ontario is a small town kinda like where you live. Here in London we have a transportation service for the handicapped. It works around your schedule if it is fixed (like going to work)or you work around its schedule for random runs. It is not free, but not overly expensive either. Cheaper than maintaining a car.

They seem to like independent living, but is the current house too big? Too far from work? Too much tax assessment?

You skimmed over your FIL. Why do you think he was going to have a heart attack? 58 is not that old that you could not take care of a spouse who is still ambulant. Why does he not drive? Seems like he does not have an income. What does he WANT to do? What does he do all day? For some reason he seems to get a free pass on the whole show. How can you get him to be a part of the solution? What are his strengths at this point? Can he cook? Can he clean? Can he shop? Can he maintain the property either himself or by managing the trades?

NOHOME wrote: London Ontario is a small town kinda like where you live. Here in London we have a transportation service for the handicapped. It works around your schedule if it is fixed (like going to work)or you work around its schedule for random runs. It is not free, but not overly expensive either. Cheaper than maintaining a car.

We don't live in Normal anymore, we're in the Chicago suburbs. I need to fix that on my profile. But public transportation really isn't an option right now, until after she goes on disability (she's not disabled until she goes on it, then there are a few options but none that are all that great--we may end up getting her a driver)

NOHOME wrote: They seem to like independent living, but is the current house too big? Too far from work? Too much tax assessment?

Current house is not too much to maintain or to afford, but it is too much for MIL since the bedrooms are all on teh second floor. If they get an elevator, it would fix it, but I've been hearing stair lift, which would just kick the can a little bit.

NOHOME wrote: You skimmed over your FIL. Why do you think he was going to have a heart attack? 58 is not that old that you could not take care of a spouse who is still ambulant. Why does he not drive? Seems like he does not have an income. What does he WANT to do? What does he do all day? For some reason he seems to get a free pass on the whole show. How can you get him to be a part of the solution? What are his strengths at this point? Can he cook? Can he clean? Can he shop? Can he maintain the property either himself or by managing the trades?

FIL is overweight and has a hard time dealing with stress. He's losing weight at a healthy pace and is doing much better. He is already the oldest male in his family history (his uncle died at 54, his dad at 56, his grandpa at 57, etc.) He's been proactive about his health recently and watches what he eats, but it is and will always be a struggle for him.

He owns his own business. Thanks to Obamacare, its profitability has been ripped from him. He doesn't make much now (1/4 of before the Obama presidency) and thinks he is too old to reinvent himself. In his defense, he has tried a couple of times but has failed. He knew one thing and did it for his whole career, and now it is mostly gone. I don't know their whole retirement situation, but I would assume it is not what it should be--I know they didn't save for the rainy days like they should have.

He does not get a free pass at all. He does work (and because of the location of most of his clients, moving closer to MIL's work would be a bad idea--since her days working are limited anyways, and his are not). He has been doing ALL of the cooking, ALL of the cleaning, ALL of the shopping, EVERYTHING down to getting gas in her car. I probably eat dinner made by him 3 days a week. And yes, he manages the house pretty well, all things considered. Things would be easier if my BIL was kicked out of the house, but that is a whole 'nother can of worms.

EDIT: FIL does enjoy his job, and will probably do it until he dies (his words).

One thing I want to make clear: They are not hurting for money right now. However, if my MIL were to go on disability today, and was not able to ever return to work, her pension would be about 1/3 of what it will be if she can hold on to February. So money is an "issue" but not a glaring issue that it is for many.

Im not much help im just glad too see you helping them out. My fathers lungs function at 21% so for the last 5 years ive been doing alot of driving to his house just too help with small projects. Luckily my stepmom is 15 years younger and in good health so she can and does handle most of it.

The hardest part of it for our family so far is getting my siblings who all live closer to actually help with anything. My dad still thinks he needs projects (cars and yard) and he clings to it since hes no longer able too work. It took alot just to convince him that he cant do everything on his own anymore. Luckily hes slowed down for the most part and has downsized too one property after all this.

Good luck.

I'm kind of going through this right now with both parents. They are divorced so two entirely different situations. They are both 66 years old.

Daddy had a stroke 24 years ago. He's paralyzed on one side and my darling 87 year old grandmother takes care of him. I think if she stopped, she'd die. I've caught some flack from others because she will not LET me help much. I offer to drive them if they need to go outside of their neighborhood and I've taken over a few things. They live about 30 minutes from me. The house is double what they need.

My mom and step dad live like 10 plus hours away. Mom is in horrible health and refuses to do anything to help herself. She's a pack rat and refuses to realize it and isn't able to get around unless she's using a walker. My sister made noises over Thanksgiving that she wanted us to start coming in and getting rid of things to downsize. That went over about like a lead balloon. Mom doesn't drive now and at least realizes that she shouldn't be. Step dad is working still. Neither of them seems to be able to keep control of the house and it's three times what they need.

Both situations suck when we start making noises about what they should be doing. Go in there armed with information ready to offer suggestions and ideas. Point out that you're trying to help things be easier on them AND on you. If they move to X area, transportation is easier. A smaller home means less cleaning and easier access and that they would probably rather do this now while it's in a controlled situation than in a crisis situation. Just try to keep it about suggestions and ideas rather than demands. People get their backs up when you start hitting them with "have tos".

58 is SO young to be dealing with all of that. I feel for you right now.

Toymanswife wrote: 58 is SO young to be dealing with all of that. I feel for you right now.

Feel for my wife, not me. 27 is far too young to have to be dealing with this. I'm just the support system.

Sorry for all the questions! Did not mean to cast aspersions upon your FIL. Much better picture at this point. Kinda reads like the American dream that pulled up 200 yards short of paradise dock. They are lucky to have you on board.

Edit, they should also be glad they are not in Canukistan, we don't have the sophisticated health care that y'all do...

NOHOME wrote: Sorry for all the questions! Did not mean to cast aspersions upon your FIL. Much better picture at this point. Kinda reads like the American dream that pulled up 200 yards short of paradise dock.

Pretty close to it. He could have sold his company in 06 for a couple mil. He said that, at the time, that looked like the worst idea he'd ever heard. ACA came along and by 2010 he'd be lucky to sell the company for 1/20 of that offer.