In the vein of the 'Almost...' and 'What do you miss?' threads, what technology & features do we have readily available in cars today do you think will cause major headaches for us car people in, say, 15 years?
I'll say navigation systems, automated manual transmissions (think paddle shifters), and computerized drivetrain bits like Honda's SH-AWD and the Nissan Juke's torque-vectoring AWD.
Keyless ignitions and keyless entry. It's becoming more of a practice.
I think the whole thread can be summed up with "electrical gremlins".
I'm guessing cars will be more disposable as a result of that. Once multiple electronic systems start failing on an older car, it won't be remotely cost-effective to fix it.
When iDrive came out on BMW's, the BMW guys were thinking about the same thing--i.e. who will be able to restore an iDrive BMW?
gamby wrote: When iDrive came out on BMW's, the BMW guys were thinking about the same thing--i.e. who will be able to restore an iDrive BMW?
On the bright side, they'll be cheap because they're unfixable. That means that nice condition bodies will be cheap fodder for complete drive train swaps. None of the electronic stuff for climate/heated seats, etc matter if you're turning it into a track rat
I'm not even thinking so much about gremlins as just the potential issues posed by having all the systems on the car computer controlled, networked, and wirelessly accessible. About the only thing that isn't computer controlled on most cars is the steering. Oh wait, there are all of those self-parking cars now. So, forget that.
What is going to happen when people figure out how to hack these things?
The 89 Supra project I had for a bit didn't have door handles, only a remote. Imagine how fun that was :)
Tire Pressure Monitoring Systems (TPMS) and stability systems. Just imagine a stability system sensor failure so it cuts throttle. All the time. Then car = boat anchor. I'll stick to cars before 2010.
David
Think of what Megasquirt can do now. In 10-20 years, there'll probably be open systems that can use CANBUS and any other communication method being used on current cars. There will be enthusiasts for every marque that will come up with baseline control packages, and hacks for when sensors or input/output devices die.
And in 10-20 years, iDrive will still blow.
There are research papers already detailing how you can hack very modern cars now. I imagine in 10+ years you'll have wardriving: the sequel. Imagine being able to run an app on your jailbroken Ipad5 that detects such unprotected cars around you, and being able to take them over and shut them down, speed them up, or lock the accelerator on....
Lovely.
Or, think of Anonymous. Now imagine crowdsourced chaos. A few hundred people bringing a city to a stop with wireless signals. How's that?
DWNSHFT wrote: Tire Pressure Monitoring Systems (TPMS)
^This.
Wait a second, my 12-year-old Corvette has TPMS and I've had no problems with it. If the sensor goes bad you check the pressure with a gauge, and replace the sensor the next time you swap tires.
chaparral wrote: Wait a second, my 12-year-old Corvette has TPMS and I've had no problems with it. If the sensor goes bad you check the pressure with a gauge, and replace the sensor the next time you swap tires.
It depends on what happens when it thinks your tires are low. If all you get is warning light or such, it's no big deal.
Funny that you mention corvette's though, as I'm pretty sure the C6's are a prime offender in TPMS related shenanigans. There's more to it than "If the sensor goes bad you check the pressure with a gauge, and replace the sensor the next time you swap tires."
JeffHarbert wrote: what technology & features do we have readily available in cars today do you think will cause major headaches for us car people in, say, 15 years?
Not completely readily available today, but it is coming and what will cause me the most grief will be GPS tracking and telematics monitored by your insurance company
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I also find interesting this new trend of only putting one lock cylinder on the exterior of the entire car. If you want to use the key to lock or unlock the car notice that most new cars can only accept a key into the driver's door.
Radar guided cruise, lane change warning, all the stuff the detects objects and the car avoids them instead of having to pay attention.
jrw1621 wrote: I also find interesting this new trend of only putting one lock cylinder on the exterior of the entire car. If you want to use the key to lock or unlock the car notice that most new cars can only accept a key into the driver's door.
I first saw that in a VW... and could only imagine the issues
I'd actually prefer to see a car with no outside door handles or door lock holes. "plipper" only. That knocks out a good way for water to get in, allows the door to be lighter, and allows you to move all the hardware to the inside of the door frame.
Even better would be a car with no outside door locks. Have it permanently unlocked. Thieves can get in anyway, why let them damage the car to do it? You'd have to put a non-pathetic lock on the glovebox or only allow it to be opened with the key in the ignition.
Between factory engineers, clever people reverse engineering, and good ol' American ingenuity, its not a major issue if you can use a computer and read a schematic. Think about it. The generation that will be restoring a 2010 Hyundai in 30 years was using a computer when they were in diapers, had a cell phone when they were 8, and could bring down the complete Sony PSN for 3 months whin they were 14. Its nothing to be afraid of, its something to embrace.
Sure, Billy Bob's service station doesnt own a Tech II or understand how EFI editing software works, but its really a non-issue. Billy Bob will be dead and buried when these cars are being restored, and Billy Bob's kid already knows how to work on them.
Throttle-by-wire. By far, the thing that will keep me from buying new(er) cars. You don't even have to go 15 years ahead, lots of cheaper cars have it now.
Someone else mentioned stability control. Glad I'm not the only one that thought of that. What an awful idea.
That's it, I'm buying only older cars. My current car is too new. Anyone have anything from the early 70s they want to sell me? Carburetors and horn buttons on the floor for me!
NO Doubt on the drive by wire throttles-my father owns a Ford that still smells new, and the throttle's already giving trouble. Ford will do nothing but SELL you another one. Nice. And GPS will definately be a nanny-state and insurance technology used against us. It's all a double edged sword. OH-and direct injection, don't get me started!!(just kidding).But I will continue to covet cars from early 90s and earlier. Forever.
Its not really in the future, but how about the $10k fuel system failure in the new TDI vws? Im sure someone will adapt a different fuel pump (duramax, etc) eventually for swaps, but for the average person looking for a 45 mpg commuter? Forget it.
Plastic. Sorry, but it just doesn't age well. 15 years may not tell the story, but sooner or later ...
Computers. How long will they continue to make that particular module for your car, and what will you be able / allowed to do when they don't?
Twin_Cam wrote: Throttle-by-wire. By far, the thing that will keep me from buying new(er) cars. You don't even have to go 15 years ahead, lots of cheaper cars have it now.
Diesels have had this since the 70s. No real issues with it.
Keyless ignition/entry, Traction control/nannies, Black boxes, Electrical issues,
Make something more fool proof and you just end up making a better fool.
Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:Twin_Cam wrote: Throttle-by-wire. By far, the thing that will keep me from buying new(er) cars. You don't even have to go 15 years ahead, lots of cheaper cars have it now.Diesels have had this since the 70s. No real issues with it.
Curious, I haven't seen a diesel before the 90's with throttle-by-wire. Ford started in 94 with the Powerstroke, Dodge I believe with the 24V Cummins, Chevy has it with the Duramax, not sure about the 6.5L. My 91 F350 I had with a 7.3L IDI had a cable still.
I prefer to have a cable or rod throttle, not too fond of throttle-by-wire. I am tending toward older vehicles myself, just to get away from all the electronics on the newer vehicles.
I was leery of the throttle by wire in my Mustang, but the ability to retune its function as part of an overall ECU remap is really nice. failures, however, won't be.
I'm not too worried about the computer systems function since hacks will happen fast/easily enough. Obsalesence and lack of replacement parts could become an issue, but they've made 40 gazillion mustangs, so it will take a while on my particular car.
What worries me more is the intrusion of the nanny gadgets as required by the gubmint (and/or the insurance gangs). The tech is already in place for remote monitoring and remote shutdown of our vehicles. I fear the day that the government establishes auto-monitoring of these systems and outlaws cars without them. As safety measures, of course.
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